Constant Search for N/A Power
08-06-2002, 02:35 PM
#31
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Hey BRB,
So you used to live down by the pier? Nice! Co-workers and I often go down to Charlie's Chili during the summer. Chili's good and the scenery is better.
The S2 engine is perfectly happy living in the S2, but yeah, the thought did cross my mind. If I ever had a wreck in my car, I might seek out a nice straight 924 body shell and put the "Abby Normal" brain in the 924 body ("Class...dismissed," as Young Frankenstein plunges the scalpel into his thigh). The cool thing about my proposed monster is that it would be real plug-and-play, with nice, stock driveability and no lag. I'm sort of partial to the aspros because they make really good autocross cars.
But variety is the spice of life, and makes for a good horse race.
Doug, Captain of the Varsity Mixed Metaphor Team
So you used to live down by the pier? Nice! Co-workers and I often go down to Charlie's Chili during the summer. Chili's good and the scenery is better.
The S2 engine is perfectly happy living in the S2, but yeah, the thought did cross my mind. If I ever had a wreck in my car, I might seek out a nice straight 924 body shell and put the "Abby Normal" brain in the 924 body ("Class...dismissed," as Young Frankenstein plunges the scalpel into his thigh). The cool thing about my proposed monster is that it would be real plug-and-play, with nice, stock driveability and no lag. I'm sort of partial to the aspros because they make really good autocross cars.
But variety is the spice of life, and makes for a good horse race.
Doug, Captain of the Varsity Mixed Metaphor Team
08-06-2002, 05:21 PM
#32
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Steve in NH!
As to your chip question: I originally had a Weltmeister chip in my 85.5 na. It was good but not earth-shattering, you know. I just swapped it out for an FR Wilk chip (fellow Rennlister) after reading good reviews on the 944 mail list. I definitely noticed a difference between the two. I like Wilk's much better. Something to consider...plus it's under $200 which is cheap compared to Weltmeister, Autothority, etc.
And by the way, yes 951s are great. But I love my n/a too.
Ken
As to your chip question: I originally had a Weltmeister chip in my 85.5 na. It was good but not earth-shattering, you know. I just swapped it out for an FR Wilk chip (fellow Rennlister) after reading good reviews on the 944 mail list. I definitely noticed a difference between the two. I like Wilk's much better. Something to consider...plus it's under $200 which is cheap compared to Weltmeister, Autothority, etc.
And by the way, yes 951s are great. But I love my n/a too.
Ken
08-06-2002, 08:15 PM
#35
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[quote]Originally posted by Bones944:
<strong>Seeing as how I own one of each, I agree with several points here; yes it is good to baby the car you own, and if it's your money, if you want to spend it, spend it like you want. If that means spending several $K getting an N/A to perform, go for it! However, when $500 in chips in a 951 will accomplish the same thing that several thousand will in an N/A, then logic says go the 951 route. I know my n/a will never perform like the 951, but the car is doing what it was designed to do. If horsepower and torque were the only answer, I'd have a '72 Chevelle with a built 454, and for a lot less $$$ too! Enjoy your N/A, spend what you want to on it if it makes you happy and proud, and if you want a 951.....go get one! Lots around to be had.......</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well bones944 said it for me, I agree with the above.
One more thing, the 944 is becoming (or already is)a classic. I know they ARE sports cars but to make a long story short I was thinking of buying a 1950 Packard (sp?) to restore. Do you think I would be worrying about how to get "more power" out of the straight eight?
Of course some people would buy the Packard and drop a 454 in it.
I have a real crazy idea... buy one of those fiberglass model A hot rod kit cars and drop a 968 driveline into it.
<strong>Seeing as how I own one of each, I agree with several points here; yes it is good to baby the car you own, and if it's your money, if you want to spend it, spend it like you want. If that means spending several $K getting an N/A to perform, go for it! However, when $500 in chips in a 951 will accomplish the same thing that several thousand will in an N/A, then logic says go the 951 route. I know my n/a will never perform like the 951, but the car is doing what it was designed to do. If horsepower and torque were the only answer, I'd have a '72 Chevelle with a built 454, and for a lot less $$$ too! Enjoy your N/A, spend what you want to on it if it makes you happy and proud, and if you want a 951.....go get one! Lots around to be had.......</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well bones944 said it for me, I agree with the above.
One more thing, the 944 is becoming (or already is)a classic. I know they ARE sports cars but to make a long story short I was thinking of buying a 1950 Packard (sp?) to restore. Do you think I would be worrying about how to get "more power" out of the straight eight?
Of course some people would buy the Packard and drop a 454 in it.
I have a real crazy idea... buy one of those fiberglass model A hot rod kit cars and drop a 968 driveline into it.
08-07-2002, 01:08 AM
#37
Burning Brakes
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Steve, our 2.8liter 11.5:1 engine will put down 200 at the tires all day long. YOu can go higher in compression, maybe up to 13:1 like our race car, but I don't know if you'd like to dump race gas in the car with each fill up :-)
08-07-2002, 01:14 AM
#38
Burning Brakes
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Steve, I forgot to mention, yes, the tranny is up to the task, just do'nt spend your "clutch popping tickets" to easily :-). But really, yes it can hold the motor, and we have a great clucth package that will grip like glue, without the upgrade hassles of going to a turbo bell housing and clutch assembly.
08-07-2002, 03:00 AM
#39
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I have both cars. <a href="http://pages.prodigy.net/pjbloom1" target="_blank">http://pages.prodigy.net/pjbloom1</a>
I have seen most stock 944's dyno around the low 120's WHP. My spec racer has milled head with "valve job" almost 11:1, reflowed inj., cone filter, swapped the cast header for the later tube type,2.5 open exhaust, soldered in socket for "chip"(2WHP). I got the weight down to 2432lbs. Dynojet = 132.4 (average for similar mod'd spec car)
Everything was done per 944-spec.com rules + suspension. Fun car to drive!
The 951 has susp./engine mods that makes 400WHP/2980lbs.
If I had to drive a 944 or 951 every day I'd leave it basically stock. I really liked the n/a in stock form as a driver. Unless you buy a SC kit it is not going to do very well in the stop light GP. If your going that route the turbo would be more cost effective + better susp.,brakes, ect..
That said these cars are about emotion. So, If you love your present car then soup it up!!!
Paul
I have seen most stock 944's dyno around the low 120's WHP. My spec racer has milled head with "valve job" almost 11:1, reflowed inj., cone filter, swapped the cast header for the later tube type,2.5 open exhaust, soldered in socket for "chip"(2WHP). I got the weight down to 2432lbs. Dynojet = 132.4 (average for similar mod'd spec car)
Everything was done per 944-spec.com rules + suspension. Fun car to drive!
The 951 has susp./engine mods that makes 400WHP/2980lbs.
If I had to drive a 944 or 951 every day I'd leave it basically stock. I really liked the n/a in stock form as a driver. Unless you buy a SC kit it is not going to do very well in the stop light GP. If your going that route the turbo would be more cost effective + better susp.,brakes, ect..
That said these cars are about emotion. So, If you love your present car then soup it up!!!
Paul
08-07-2002, 03:09 AM
#40
Three Wheelin'
Dan,
Europroducts.net chip movie, courtesy of Grass Roots Motorsports. I posted the link below in the 924 forum a little while ago.
I like the Europroducts chip... cheap as hell, and everyone I've talked to seems to notice the difference. GRM posted a significantly better 0-60 time with it. I like mine - but someone said FR Wilk is making a chip for the late cars now as well (used to just do early...) so I may have to check his out next
<a href="http://www.grmotorsports.com/944chip.mov" target="_blank">http://www.grmotorsports.com/944chip.mov</a>
Micah <img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />
Europroducts.net chip movie, courtesy of Grass Roots Motorsports. I posted the link below in the 924 forum a little while ago.
I like the Europroducts chip... cheap as hell, and everyone I've talked to seems to notice the difference. GRM posted a significantly better 0-60 time with it. I like mine - but someone said FR Wilk is making a chip for the late cars now as well (used to just do early...) so I may have to check his out next
<a href="http://www.grmotorsports.com/944chip.mov" target="_blank">http://www.grmotorsports.com/944chip.mov</a>
Micah <img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />
08-07-2002, 10:30 AM
#41
Track Day
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Gentlemen:
I, too am aflicted with a desire to take something and make it better. That is my personality type. If you read Robert Pirsig's "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" you will find that for some of us it is the process, or the quest, that we love, not just the final product. Remember, "the cycle (car) we are working on is ourselves"
I, too am aflicted with a desire to take something and make it better. That is my personality type. If you read Robert Pirsig's "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" you will find that for some of us it is the process, or the quest, that we love, not just the final product. Remember, "the cycle (car) we are working on is ourselves"
08-07-2002, 11:50 AM
#42
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Yea, I guess the NA attracts our sort. We just can't avoid the desire to make it just a "little better"! I love my little NA, and have been incrementally improving it. It's main purpose in life is a 'quick' good weather highway cruiser (I have a 65 mile highway commute)...and a weekend fun ride!
So I'm not looking for a neck snapping Mustang eating machine! I want to bring her up to more modern standards...things like a cup holder and one touch windows in the interior and power roughly equivalent to a base Boxster...that would be just fine for me!
John, thanks for the info on that 2.8l...that sounds like the perfect choice for me. I think we'll be talking over the Winter!!
I love my little NA, and have been incrementally improving it. It's main purpose in life is a 'quick' good weather highway cruiser (I have a 65 mile highway commute)...and a weekend fun ride! So I'm not looking for a neck snapping Mustang eating machine! I want to bring her up to more modern standards...things like a cup holder and one touch windows in the interior and power roughly equivalent to a base Boxster...that would be just fine for me!
John, thanks for the info on that 2.8l...that sounds like the perfect choice for me. I think we'll be talking over the Winter!!
08-07-2002, 11:40 PM
#43
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One of our customers has been running a 3.2 ltr 16V 12.8 to 1 CR N/A race motor all this year in his 86 944. He dynoed at 256 HP and 235 TQ at the wheels on a Dynojet. He sais he just laughs as he blows by the chiped turbo guys on the track! <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />
08-08-2002, 03:40 AM
#44
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[quote] I, too am aflicted with a desire to take something and make it better. That is my personality type. If you read Robert Pirsig's "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" you will find that for some of us it is the process, or the quest, that we love, not just the final product. Remember, "the cycle (car) we are working on is ourselves"
<hr></blockquote>
Of course, following Pirsig's logic (oops, I mean reasoning), we should not be working on the German-engineered machines (in his case the BMW motorcycles), but on good ol' 'Merican built ones that break down all the time so we can get all the "process" we want. Marx would say argue that to call "the cycle (car) we are working on...ourselves" is to be thoroughly entranced by commodity fetishism. Still, Pirsig is on to something to claim that the process of working on machines is a process of self-discovery or at least of self-reliance, however much it is a product of the cultural and historical specificics of masculinity in the United States.
Sorry, I'm a cultural anthropologist. <img src="graemlins/a_smil17.gif" border="0" alt="[blabla]" />
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
<hr></blockquote>
Of course, following Pirsig's logic (oops, I mean reasoning), we should not be working on the German-engineered machines (in his case the BMW motorcycles), but on good ol' 'Merican built ones that break down all the time so we can get all the "process" we want. Marx would say argue that to call "the cycle (car) we are working on...ourselves" is to be thoroughly entranced by commodity fetishism. Still, Pirsig is on to something to claim that the process of working on machines is a process of self-discovery or at least of self-reliance, however much it is a product of the cultural and historical specificics of masculinity in the United States.
Sorry, I'm a cultural anthropologist. <img src="graemlins/a_smil17.gif" border="0" alt="[blabla]" />
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
