HELP! Sunroof just broke!
06-21-2002, 03:15 PM
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HELP! Sunroof just broke!
I was just done washing and drying my 944S and I was going to clean out the crevices in the sunroof, simple job. I had the key in the second position and I press the sunroof up button. Then I hear all this snapping and clanking back in the sunroof motor so I immediately stopped and looked. It looked to me like one of the lifters that you see come out and push the roof up wasnt coming out anymore. Now only one of those things come out and barely push the roof up on one side. This is very very aggervating because I love my sunroof and I dont see how just pushing the button could break it. Anyone ever have this happen to them, or know why it would happen?? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
06-21-2002, 04:20 PM
#2
Racer
I feel for you. I use my sunroof every time I'm in the car. It's one of those things I am just waiting for to break.
Sounds like all those plastic gears just broke apart....haven't really seen a repair kit for it though.
You'll need to track down the part numbers (relatively easy with the PET CD). Tracking down the replacement parts will be another story. Not sure if the dealer carries them. Sure you could find some used ones, but I'd question longevity.
Sounds like all those plastic gears just broke apart....haven't really seen a repair kit for it though.
You'll need to track down the part numbers (relatively easy with the PET CD). Tracking down the replacement parts will be another story. Not sure if the dealer carries them. Sure you could find some used ones, but I'd question longevity.
06-21-2002, 04:28 PM
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thanks a bunch, I do have the PET cd's and I'll look through them for the right parts. I also just found the lifting gears and lifting guides on ebay. I'n going to take the roof off and take a good look in there to see what all has broken, but I know it's not anything big like the motor. just old plastic parts that dedided to give. Lol man was I freaking out when that happened but I'm calmed down when I saw it was a relatively easy fix. Thanks!
06-21-2002, 04:51 PM
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Ok, here is what you do.
1. Goto a parts place (even a dealership) and get two sets of gears - not one, but two (they are like $6-10 each).
2. Remove the sunroof.
3. Push the button so the roof would go alll the way up, and then push the button in the opposite direction - this will "set" the arms in the locked postion (very important). The arms will be sticking out (well, at least the one that moves). If you hear snapping sounds while you're doing this - don't worry - that is plastic snapping under the headliner - you will be replacing those anyways. The most important thing is to get those arms in the correct position.
3. Now go in the back drivers side area, right by the hatch interior light. Pull back the carpet and you will see a black plastic cover over the motor. Also, unplug the interior light (two wires - big main wire and the smaller brown ground wire) - this will make the carpet fold back better and give you more room. Remove the black plastic cover (4 or 5 screws) and you will see the motor.
4. Now, if the arms are in the correct position - the motor should have hit Microswitch #1. I'll explain what the microswitches are. There are 4 of em'. One is in the front headliner of the car, between the visors. It's where the front lip of the sunroof goes in. With the sunroof out, you can physically push this switch with your finger - it's a triangle shape. This switch tells the motor of the roof is in or out. When this switch fails, it usually means the roof will work, but won't go up all the way. The other three microswitches are on the motor assembly. Here is how they work. There are two of em' that you can see from look at the motor. If you look from the top of the car downward at the motor, you will see two lil' Red and (can't remember the other color) rectangular shaped boxes. These are switces #1 and #2. If you look behind them, you will see they have lil' arms with rollers on them. These rollers make contact with a big plastic gear that is in the back of the motor - look behind the big front steel plate. What you need to do here is look at the microswitch arms and make sure that the top switch (#1) is being hit by that plastic gear. You should see that lil' roller resting on white plastic. There will be grooves in that white plastic. The second groove (you will know what I mean when you see it) is meant to hit switch #2. Don't worry about that right now. If the roller on the arm of switch #1 is at the very start of the plastic gear - it is all lined up. In order to check this - take out that tool in your Porsche Tool Kit (the one that came with the car) and use the bendy spark plug tool to turn the big nut under that lil' black plastic cap on the motor (right in the middle of the motor there will be a plastic cap that covers this big nut). Don't turn the smaller nuts, these are for setting torque. The tool will only fit one nut, so only turn that one. Manually turn the motor with this tool - you will see the plastic gear move. Turn it so it goes out of sight, then back again and listen very carefully for that switch to "click". Then it's set for sure.
5. Now remove the headliner (before you do this, count the teeth on the sunroof arms that are exposed) and the two plastic covers over both arms that go up and down to move the roof. You will then see the broken plastic gears. Replace the gears and then put the arms back in in the exact same position they were in (same amount of teeth exposed).
Close it all back up and hope the motor is lined up right. If not - that is what those extra gears you bought will be for. Sometimes you have to do this a couple times before getting it right.
Sorry I'm in a rush to leave work - I'll give a more detailed explaination on Monday if you need it.
944S Boyeee
1. Goto a parts place (even a dealership) and get two sets of gears - not one, but two (they are like $6-10 each).
2. Remove the sunroof.
3. Push the button so the roof would go alll the way up, and then push the button in the opposite direction - this will "set" the arms in the locked postion (very important). The arms will be sticking out (well, at least the one that moves). If you hear snapping sounds while you're doing this - don't worry - that is plastic snapping under the headliner - you will be replacing those anyways. The most important thing is to get those arms in the correct position.
3. Now go in the back drivers side area, right by the hatch interior light. Pull back the carpet and you will see a black plastic cover over the motor. Also, unplug the interior light (two wires - big main wire and the smaller brown ground wire) - this will make the carpet fold back better and give you more room. Remove the black plastic cover (4 or 5 screws) and you will see the motor.
4. Now, if the arms are in the correct position - the motor should have hit Microswitch #1. I'll explain what the microswitches are. There are 4 of em'. One is in the front headliner of the car, between the visors. It's where the front lip of the sunroof goes in. With the sunroof out, you can physically push this switch with your finger - it's a triangle shape. This switch tells the motor of the roof is in or out. When this switch fails, it usually means the roof will work, but won't go up all the way. The other three microswitches are on the motor assembly. Here is how they work. There are two of em' that you can see from look at the motor. If you look from the top of the car downward at the motor, you will see two lil' Red and (can't remember the other color) rectangular shaped boxes. These are switces #1 and #2. If you look behind them, you will see they have lil' arms with rollers on them. These rollers make contact with a big plastic gear that is in the back of the motor - look behind the big front steel plate. What you need to do here is look at the microswitch arms and make sure that the top switch (#1) is being hit by that plastic gear. You should see that lil' roller resting on white plastic. There will be grooves in that white plastic. The second groove (you will know what I mean when you see it) is meant to hit switch #2. Don't worry about that right now. If the roller on the arm of switch #1 is at the very start of the plastic gear - it is all lined up. In order to check this - take out that tool in your Porsche Tool Kit (the one that came with the car) and use the bendy spark plug tool to turn the big nut under that lil' black plastic cap on the motor (right in the middle of the motor there will be a plastic cap that covers this big nut). Don't turn the smaller nuts, these are for setting torque. The tool will only fit one nut, so only turn that one. Manually turn the motor with this tool - you will see the plastic gear move. Turn it so it goes out of sight, then back again and listen very carefully for that switch to "click". Then it's set for sure.
5. Now remove the headliner (before you do this, count the teeth on the sunroof arms that are exposed) and the two plastic covers over both arms that go up and down to move the roof. You will then see the broken plastic gears. Replace the gears and then put the arms back in in the exact same position they were in (same amount of teeth exposed).
Close it all back up and hope the motor is lined up right. If not - that is what those extra gears you bought will be for. Sometimes you have to do this a couple times before getting it right.
Sorry I'm in a rush to leave work - I'll give a more detailed explaination on Monday if you need it.
944S Boyeee
06-21-2002, 05:40 PM
#5
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Paragon Products has a good price for the gears – they were about $4.00 each a year ago. Do buy two sets (4 gears).
I think that the above write-up is excellent, but I did mine a little differently. To position the arms in the new gears, I put the key in #1 position and I pressed the retract button as if I were going to remove the sunroof from the car. I positioned the arms so that they were as retracted as I could get them. I tested the position by engaging the sunroof in position #1 to make sure that all was working well. I got it right on the first try.
Best of luck.
I think that the above write-up is excellent, but I did mine a little differently. To position the arms in the new gears, I put the key in #1 position and I pressed the retract button as if I were going to remove the sunroof from the car. I positioned the arms so that they were as retracted as I could get them. I tested the position by engaging the sunroof in position #1 to make sure that all was working well. I got it right on the first try.
Best of luck.
06-24-2002, 11:45 AM
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Michael - thanks for saying my write-up was good. I started typing it and then the guys from PCO came to my work to spray for an ant problem -so I had to super-rush. I didn't put in everything I wanted.
Your idea about setting the gears in the complete retracted position is a good one, I actually did that the second time 'round - it makes more sense. But the downside to that is the fact that the gears usually strip due to the torque on the motor getting too high and retracting the arms all the way with high motor torque spells more snapping. I still haven't set my torque yet, so when I take my roof out, I have to make sure I don't detract the arms too far. As a matter of fact, I pushed "down" when I should have pushed "up" the other day when putting my roof back in and SNAP - I lost a tooth. Roof still works fine, just one side is about half an inch higher than the other. Gotta take the arm out on the "shorter" side and match it back up.
I'll keep running a gear with one tooth missing - I'm just wacky like that!!!
944S Boyeee
Your idea about setting the gears in the complete retracted position is a good one, I actually did that the second time 'round - it makes more sense. But the downside to that is the fact that the gears usually strip due to the torque on the motor getting too high and retracting the arms all the way with high motor torque spells more snapping. I still haven't set my torque yet, so when I take my roof out, I have to make sure I don't detract the arms too far. As a matter of fact, I pushed "down" when I should have pushed "up" the other day when putting my roof back in and SNAP - I lost a tooth. Roof still works fine, just one side is about half an inch higher than the other. Gotta take the arm out on the "shorter" side and match it back up.
I'll keep running a gear with one tooth missing - I'm just wacky like that!!!
944S Boyeee
06-24-2002, 01:06 PM
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Where is the other micro switch? And what does it do? You mentioned there were for of them. In your post, there were only three.
The reason I'm asking is because my SR won't come off. The arms won't disengage, and I'm trying to figure out why.
Casper
'87 944S
The reason I'm asking is because my SR won't come off. The arms won't disengage, and I'm trying to figure out why.
Casper
'87 944S
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06-24-2002, 01:21 PM
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There are 4 microswitches. One in between the visors that tells the motor if the roof is in or out. Two on the front of the motor - these control where the roof stops in the closed position and the forth switch is in the back of the motor. The forth switch is the one that stops the roof in the fully open position.
If you cannot get the arms to retract, the it's Microswitch #2 (on front of motor). Once the roof is in the locked postion, switch #1 (front of motor) is activated. With the key in postion 1, the arms should move in the oppposite direction they would if the key was in postion 2. Microswitch #2 tells the motor that you are trying to retract the arms instead of extending them. If this switch is failing or is not being contacted, the arms will not retract.
944S Boyeee
If you cannot get the arms to retract, the it's Microswitch #2 (on front of motor). Once the roof is in the locked postion, switch #1 (front of motor) is activated. With the key in postion 1, the arms should move in the oppposite direction they would if the key was in postion 2. Microswitch #2 tells the motor that you are trying to retract the arms instead of extending them. If this switch is failing or is not being contacted, the arms will not retract.
944S Boyeee
06-24-2002, 05:39 PM
#9
Nordschleife Master
[quote]Originally posted by Casper:
<strong>Where is the other micro switch? And what does it do? You mentioned there were for of them. In your post, there were only three.
The reason I'm asking is because my SR won't come off. The arms won't disengage, and I'm trying to figure out why.
Casper
'87 944S</strong><hr></blockquote>
Have you followed the instructions for removal in the manual? Just checking, in case you don't have a manual.
<strong>Where is the other micro switch? And what does it do? You mentioned there were for of them. In your post, there were only three.
The reason I'm asking is because my SR won't come off. The arms won't disengage, and I'm trying to figure out why.
Casper
'87 944S</strong><hr></blockquote>
Have you followed the instructions for removal in the manual? Just checking, in case you don't have a manual.
