Advice on Huntley Racing
12-23-2002, 12:02 AM
#47
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[quote] Has anybody else noticed that Derek from Huntley is conspicuously absent from this discussion? <hr></blockquote>
Thats because he is on vacation apparently- or at least his shop is.
Thats because he is on vacation apparently- or at least his shop is.
12-23-2002, 10:52 AM
#48
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Unfortunately one thing I have repeatedly seen is that shops/techs who race tend to be at the worst end of the customer service spectrum, even though it still is the everyday customers with street cars that tend to pay the bills. Of course, there are still exceptions in both directions, from my local Euro autoparts place who race religously (meaning, they race Volvos 
to my local P-car dealer who don't race, near as I can tell, but have the worst customer service anyway (so I mail-order from Holbert a/r). It's cool to know that your shop races, just make sure that's not their #1 priority.
to my local P-car dealer who don't race, near as I can tell, but have the worst customer service anyway (so I mail-order from Holbert a/r). It's cool to know that your shop races, just make sure that's not their #1 priority.
12-23-2002, 12:29 PM
#49
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Guys, isn't it obvious....if you listen to all the issues over the years that everyone has had with Huntley, most all of them fall into 2 categories:
1) take order, charge credit card, don't ship for a long time.
or
2) send shipment, and its not what is needed/promised/etc, so customer returns items, but Huntley takes FORWEVER to credit back the CC.
Its obvious guys....he uses his order flow and returns to provide his working capital. He is likely short money to fund his inventory, pay salaries, etc, so he gets creative with his cutomers billing to cover his float. REALLY stupid, IMHO, as all it does is **** off his custs. If you remember he was trying to sell the business a while back, but I guess no takers. Obviously things are tight, and he is struggling to keep things afloat. Otherwise, I can't imagine why he would f~ck with customers.
Not defending Derek, but it IS expensive to carry the inventory required for our cars, and since so many of us have the "I need the part here tomorrow by 9am so I can make the DE this weekend" attitude, suppliers who want to be successful need to be able to offer the parts on short notice. Huntleyt has tried to do that, but obviously has stretched WAY to thin in the capitalization of his business.
It does seem Derek has some good traits, as he spends much time on the phone with people whether or not they are customers (I know he did with me...luckily I never got trapped in the morass of ordering from him and being "backlogged"). He just needs to (1) get more working capital so he doesn't need to use his cutomers', (2) stop trying to offer products in a time frame not reasonable given his ability to deliver, and/or (3) charge more for his products so that he can cover the TOTAL costs of doing business which includes inventory/other capital costs.
I know #3 is not a popular answer, but for Derek to be in business for as long as he has, and still have the problems he is having he is either (a) not fully recovering the costs associated with providing the products and services, or (b) a bad business man who shouldn't be in buisness anyway. By raising prices, he will either get recovery of his full costs and will stop f-ing with customers, or his higher prices will get him run out of business once and for all, and we can all stop bitching about his service.
JM $0.03
1) take order, charge credit card, don't ship for a long time.
or
2) send shipment, and its not what is needed/promised/etc, so customer returns items, but Huntley takes FORWEVER to credit back the CC.
Its obvious guys....he uses his order flow and returns to provide his working capital. He is likely short money to fund his inventory, pay salaries, etc, so he gets creative with his cutomers billing to cover his float. REALLY stupid, IMHO, as all it does is **** off his custs. If you remember he was trying to sell the business a while back, but I guess no takers. Obviously things are tight, and he is struggling to keep things afloat. Otherwise, I can't imagine why he would f~ck with customers.
Not defending Derek, but it IS expensive to carry the inventory required for our cars, and since so many of us have the "I need the part here tomorrow by 9am so I can make the DE this weekend" attitude, suppliers who want to be successful need to be able to offer the parts on short notice. Huntleyt has tried to do that, but obviously has stretched WAY to thin in the capitalization of his business.
It does seem Derek has some good traits, as he spends much time on the phone with people whether or not they are customers (I know he did with me...luckily I never got trapped in the morass of ordering from him and being "backlogged"). He just needs to (1) get more working capital so he doesn't need to use his cutomers', (2) stop trying to offer products in a time frame not reasonable given his ability to deliver, and/or (3) charge more for his products so that he can cover the TOTAL costs of doing business which includes inventory/other capital costs.
I know #3 is not a popular answer, but for Derek to be in business for as long as he has, and still have the problems he is having he is either (a) not fully recovering the costs associated with providing the products and services, or (b) a bad business man who shouldn't be in buisness anyway. By raising prices, he will either get recovery of his full costs and will stop f-ing with customers, or his higher prices will get him run out of business once and for all, and we can all stop bitching about his service.
JM $0.03
12-23-2002, 01:24 PM
#50
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I don't if other Sates have similar agencies, but in CA you should check out
<a href="http://165.235.17.9/stdPage.asp?Body=/GenInfo/Publications/Auto_Repair_Guide-Jul_1998.htm&LB=NO" target="_blank">http://165.235.17.9/stdPage.asp?Body=/GenInfo/Publications/Auto_Repair_Guide-Jul_1998.htm&LB=NO</A>
<a href="http://165.235.17.9/stdPage.asp?Body=/GenInfo/Publications/Auto_Repair_Guide-Jul_1998.htm&LB=NO" target="_blank">http://165.235.17.9/stdPage.asp?Body=/GenInfo/Publications/Auto_Repair_Guide-Jul_1998.htm&LB=NO</A>
12-23-2002, 07:47 PM
#51
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To all the Tunners and part/service suppliers out there:
The Ten Commandments of goog business
1. Do not sell something that you dont have.
2. If you dont know when you will have it, do not make promisses.
3. If you dont have it, nor know when, DO NOT CHARGE IT TO THE CREDIT CARD.
4. Do not advertised false specs.
5. If you make a mistake (nobody is perfect), try to resolve the issue with the same hurry that you charge the credit card.
6. If the customer wants a refund, and everything is OK, give it to him. After all, IT'S HIS MONEY.
7. When a customer contact you for the first time, your'e as sweet as honey. Once the transaction is completed, your'e not so sweet.
8. Customer satisfaction? Is that important?
9. Think as if you are the customer.
10. Excuses only satisfied to whom made it.
The Ten Commandments of goog business
1. Do not sell something that you dont have.
2. If you dont know when you will have it, do not make promisses.
3. If you dont have it, nor know when, DO NOT CHARGE IT TO THE CREDIT CARD.
4. Do not advertised false specs.
5. If you make a mistake (nobody is perfect), try to resolve the issue with the same hurry that you charge the credit card.
6. If the customer wants a refund, and everything is OK, give it to him. After all, IT'S HIS MONEY.
7. When a customer contact you for the first time, your'e as sweet as honey. Once the transaction is completed, your'e not so sweet.
8. Customer satisfaction? Is that important?
9. Think as if you are the customer.
10. Excuses only satisfied to whom made it.
12-24-2002, 06:51 AM
#52
A few of these posts mentioned contacting the Better Business Bureau. This is a waste of time. The BBB is completely supported by their member businesses. Every try to report a problem with a business or find out if a business has problems? They are no help but the "Member of the BBB" looks good on a business card, etc.
An earlier post stated that in many states you can't be charged before product is shipped. The exact number of states would be 50. I worked in mail order for a number of years (Oops! You are supposed to call it "Catalog Retail". ) This industry is regulated by the FTC (Federal Trade Commission). The rules on how an order has to be processed are very clear and rather inflexible. In the United States it is against federal law to charge for product before shipping. Specifically you can authorize the credit card at any time in the transaction but the card cannot be charged until after it crosses the shipping scale. If you prepay the order by mail there are very firm rules about backorders. If they can't ship within 30 days the business MUST contact you and get your permission to remain on backorder or they MUST refund your money. When a company is investigated they must prove that they know that something can ship if they say it will. These rules apply to any company that takes orders by mail or by telephone.
The FTC has a great website that makes it easy to find lots of good information. <a href="http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/mailorder.htm" target="_blank">http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/mailorder.htm</a>
I would strongly suggest to everyone involved to report every precharged transaction that you have had with Huntley. In the long run it would probably be doing him a favor. It would force him to fix at least part of his business and would help repair his reputation. And if he doesn't, the FTC can fine up to $11,000 per instance. (The federal government has no sense of humor.)
Wayne
An earlier post stated that in many states you can't be charged before product is shipped. The exact number of states would be 50. I worked in mail order for a number of years (Oops! You are supposed to call it "Catalog Retail".
) This industry is regulated by the FTC (Federal Trade Commission). The rules on how an order has to be processed are very clear and rather inflexible. In the United States it is against federal law to charge for product before shipping. Specifically you can authorize the credit card at any time in the transaction but the card cannot be charged until after it crosses the shipping scale. If you prepay the order by mail there are very firm rules about backorders. If they can't ship within 30 days the business MUST contact you and get your permission to remain on backorder or they MUST refund your money. When a company is investigated they must prove that they know that something can ship if they say it will. These rules apply to any company that takes orders by mail or by telephone.The FTC has a great website that makes it easy to find lots of good information. <a href="http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/mailorder.htm" target="_blank">http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/mailorder.htm</a>
I would strongly suggest to everyone involved to report every precharged transaction that you have had with Huntley. In the long run it would probably be doing him a favor. It would force him to fix at least part of his business and would help repair his reputation. And if he doesn't, the FTC can fine up to $11,000 per instance. (The federal government has no sense of humor.)
Wayne
12-24-2002, 12:04 PM
#54
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Yes, thank you very much Wayne. This is excellent information. If people do start taking this issue up with Huntley and he does get fined in every instance, I have a feeling he'll be out of business before long. Man, and all this could be avoided simply by being honest. Craziness.
12-27-2002, 05:12 PM
#55
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Not meaning to be too off the wall here, but in regards to TXHEDG's comments I totally agree:
"Its obvious guys....he uses his order flow and returns to provide his working capital. He is likely short money to fund his inventory, pay salaries, etc, so he gets creative with his cutomers billing to cover his float. REALLY stupid, IMHO, as all it does is **** off his custs. If you remember he was trying to sell the business a while back, but I guess no takers. Obviously things are tight, and he is struggling to keep things afloat. Otherwise, I can't imagine why he would f~ck with customers."
Sure. He's right. But, let's see here...what would you do with thousands of dollars in Porsche inventory without raising prices? If I drove a Honda I'd expect better cash flow, but the cars we're driving aren't Hondas. So I expect to wait.
No excuses for the guy, as it's wrong to do what he does. But again, let's not forget that we drive Porsches but largely associate with people who drive Honda, Toyota, Mercedes, Audi, and other more numerous brands. Thus, we see and hear reports of faster turnaround on these things. That's natural. But we shouldn't necessarily expect the same.
I've heard worse reports about Porsche businesses. That's all I'm trying to say. And comparing these against other Porsche businesses is fair comparison. But against more popular brand names, no.
And another thing: In people, it's good to find someone that knows the cars and spends time with the customer. And it's good to find an efficient businessperson. But finding both qualities in a Porsche shop? Good luck. That's a rare find.
"Its obvious guys....he uses his order flow and returns to provide his working capital. He is likely short money to fund his inventory, pay salaries, etc, so he gets creative with his cutomers billing to cover his float. REALLY stupid, IMHO, as all it does is **** off his custs. If you remember he was trying to sell the business a while back, but I guess no takers. Obviously things are tight, and he is struggling to keep things afloat. Otherwise, I can't imagine why he would f~ck with customers."
Sure. He's right. But, let's see here...what would you do with thousands of dollars in Porsche inventory without raising prices? If I drove a Honda I'd expect better cash flow, but the cars we're driving aren't Hondas. So I expect to wait.
No excuses for the guy, as it's wrong to do what he does. But again, let's not forget that we drive Porsches but largely associate with people who drive Honda, Toyota, Mercedes, Audi, and other more numerous brands. Thus, we see and hear reports of faster turnaround on these things. That's natural. But we shouldn't necessarily expect the same.
I've heard worse reports about Porsche businesses. That's all I'm trying to say. And comparing these against other Porsche businesses is fair comparison. But against more popular brand names, no.
And another thing: In people, it's good to find someone that knows the cars and spends time with the customer. And it's good to find an efficient businessperson. But finding both qualities in a Porsche shop? Good luck. That's a rare find.
12-29-2002, 03:55 PM
#56
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Yeah!!
But we are customers not investors. We just order something or request a service. And we pay for that, and expect to recieve it on time, and accurately. In no way I'm willing to give anybody my hard earning cash to be used as cash flow. Simply, this is not the way to do business.
But we are customers not investors. We just order something or request a service. And we pay for that, and expect to recieve it on time, and accurately. In no way I'm willing to give anybody my hard earning cash to be used as cash flow. Simply, this is not the way to do business.
12-29-2002, 04:05 PM
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That depends - I have NO problem with it (in a nitch market) so long as I'm told up front AND the product is delivered on the time-table given when the order is placed. For those companies though, I use a feature of my credit-card that allows a little more buyers insurance AND is limited to a one-time use. It's easier to dispute the payment if something goes wrong and the shop isn't capable of running multiple charges.
It's the shops that request money up front and Only accept cash/money order/cashiers check that you want to strictly avoid.
It's the shops that request money up front and Only accept cash/money order/cashiers check that you want to strictly avoid.
01-01-2003, 12:45 PM
#58
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I dissagree- While I definetely understand a supplier saying to me- "Hey thats a special order item- I need a deposit of X amount" I DO NOT understand billing the total amount before the project has even been started and I would feel just as hosed if it happened to me. As I stated earlier though- it would not have been so bad IF the part had only been a week or so delayed- but the amount of time we are talking about- and not on a one time deal- this seems to be a regular sort of occurrance- is unacceptable- just bad faith IMHO
01-01-2003, 08:58 PM
#59
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As a few have mentioned, Huntley Racing has been closed for nearly two weeks, re-opening the 2nd. I have just gotten back home and have been returning e-mails. I just got to the forums now and apologize for replying late, but it could not be avoided. Scott, your head has truly been a fiasco from day one, which nobody intended but nonetheless has. As you know the biggest issue here was the oversize valves for your head, which have taken so long to get. All the headwork and modifications were done long ago and have been simply waiting on valves. I left a few days before the shop closed and was expecting the head to go out. Either it did and has not arrived, or did not which I will have to investigate when we open tomorrow. We got the valves before I left which should have meant the head would ship shortly, I just can't be more specific until tomorrow. As Tim (SFR) mentioned the 'tuners' are often frustrated too with our own suppliers, which cause delays like this. Our portion of the job has been done for a long time and would have been shipped to you as expected should the parts have arrived on time to us. All I can do now is call you when I have some info in the morning, do what I had already offered before which was to ship as fast as possible at our expense, and as always put the best work possible in the head.
Some have mentioned issues with charging credit cards before shipping out the goods. Mr. Anderson ordered custom headwork on his head which was legally charged to his card as soon as the work began. This is not 'mail-order' but ‘services rendered’ and thus are charged in this way. This is both legal and standard in the industry. Many of the products we offer are custom made to the customers needs and as such are pre-paid since they are being made to order. This is also common practice and legal. The other possibility is that parts are custom ordered which again are charged at the time of order since they are for the individual ordering them and not a normally stocked item.
We have certainly made mistakes in the many years we have been in business and though we try to better ourselves will likely make more. We are one of the oldest 'tuners' on this list and though we would like it the other way the reality is that people post about negatives 99% of the time and positives 1% of the time. The fact is we continue to grow every year with most of our sales going to repeat business and most of our new business from referrals of happy customers. Let us know when we make a mistake and let us either fix it or make some amends, that is the way we can do better for you.
As mentioned we have the best tech support around and some of the most knowledgeable salesman too. But we know that getting thru is not always easy. As such we have added an additional tech support person and two additional sales people to our staff. We also have increased the capacity of our phone system to assist in getting thru to us. Let us know how much this helps in the coming months.
Racers do good business too? I think this can be accomplished. For Huntley Racing it can be a challenge when you have a two-part business (mail-order & race preparation). When a big race weekend approaches the shop focuses on getting the cars to the track and many of our personnel are taken from mail-order fabrication work to race car fabrication and vice versa when the mail-order is busy. The trick is finding a balance of the two. Racing is as much fun as it is work. Many of the products pioneered at Huntley were developed, tested, and perfected on the track. Racing will always be a big part of Huntley and hence the 'Racing' in our name.
To finish, Scott said he would post the results of his order, which is the best end to this thread. The damage is done and all we can do is make the best results we can and make Scott as happy as possible given the circumstances.
Some have mentioned issues with charging credit cards before shipping out the goods. Mr. Anderson ordered custom headwork on his head which was legally charged to his card as soon as the work began. This is not 'mail-order' but ‘services rendered’ and thus are charged in this way. This is both legal and standard in the industry. Many of the products we offer are custom made to the customers needs and as such are pre-paid since they are being made to order. This is also common practice and legal. The other possibility is that parts are custom ordered which again are charged at the time of order since they are for the individual ordering them and not a normally stocked item.
We have certainly made mistakes in the many years we have been in business and though we try to better ourselves will likely make more. We are one of the oldest 'tuners' on this list and though we would like it the other way the reality is that people post about negatives 99% of the time and positives 1% of the time. The fact is we continue to grow every year with most of our sales going to repeat business and most of our new business from referrals of happy customers. Let us know when we make a mistake and let us either fix it or make some amends, that is the way we can do better for you.
As mentioned we have the best tech support around and some of the most knowledgeable salesman too. But we know that getting thru is not always easy. As such we have added an additional tech support person and two additional sales people to our staff. We also have increased the capacity of our phone system to assist in getting thru to us. Let us know how much this helps in the coming months.
Racers do good business too? I think this can be accomplished. For Huntley Racing it can be a challenge when you have a two-part business (mail-order & race preparation). When a big race weekend approaches the shop focuses on getting the cars to the track and many of our personnel are taken from mail-order fabrication work to race car fabrication and vice versa when the mail-order is busy. The trick is finding a balance of the two. Racing is as much fun as it is work. Many of the products pioneered at Huntley were developed, tested, and perfected on the track. Racing will always be a big part of Huntley and hence the 'Racing' in our name.
To finish, Scott said he would post the results of his order, which is the best end to this thread. The damage is done and all we can do is make the best results we can and make Scott as happy as possible given the circumstances.
01-02-2003, 12:23 PM
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ive spoken to huntley on the phone in the past, and luckily i was able to see thru his lies and deceit,. these guys or company is full of **** and i will never ever use them for anything other than paper to wipe my exit orifice. their company might be growing cause theres always a sucker out there somewhere whom either hasnt learned or heard of their "tricks" yet. lets keep on only using the good guys and maybe this clown will go bankrupt and then we can buy whats left of, if any, in a distress sale.
happy new year mr. huntless
happy new year mr. huntless