Matt H

Clearly someone has never driven a Turbo Miata nor a Monster Miata (yeah, that would be a 302!).

The only thing that keeps me from really wanting one is that at my size I look like the bear riding the little car at the circus (Geo, remember me driving the White one at our fun run??)! They are a lot of fun to drive, handle terrific and feel much faster than they are due to the size.

To Geo's point, if you want to win often there is no really "cheap" way to do it. If you want to have a blast and be a mid pack/back of pack runner, I would bet that there would be little difference between the two.

If I was buying something to go race, I might consider an SE-R or an Integra. They can both be had dirt cheap, there are billions of people that make parts for them, and racing them is not that uncommon.

Since you mention PCA Racing, it does have some benefits, it is virtually contact free. That cannot be said of a lot of other "club racing" groups. Ironically, I have never seen as much contact as I did at a Ferrari Challenge race, you would think with the cost they would be careful...but they arent.
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M758

Clutch wear is non-issue in spec cars. (assuming you can heel & toe properly). Installed a new spring centered on in Jan 2003. I raced hard on it for a year and 1/2. (30+ races) Guess what. The pressure plate still has the machining groves in it and there are even some of the original stamping ink on the fricton surface. You can have an old clutch in the and it could fail or wear out, but under proper driving clutch wear will not be an issue at all in 944-spec car. Figure you may need to do it once. Probably if you pull the motor you should install a new clutch and never worry about after that.

M758

I think it still is out there, but looking at results I have seen 1-2 cars in the class.

Honestly 944-spec is great if you can race in Arizona or southern california. Since 944-spec is new it has not grown nationwide yet. You can run 944-spec in most any NASA event, but unless you are in Arizona or Southern California you will probably not have any other cars out there with you. We do have 2 or 3 northern california cars.
Here is complete list of all spec prepared 944 cars. Notice where they are based. PS... this pretty good growth since this class started in the spring of 2002.

http://members.rennlist.com/m758/driverlisting.htm


There is also an established racing group in the Northwest headed by Greg Fordahl. He has a group of 944s running in ITS and Porsche group up there. He as been taking with us in spec land and his cars are prepped to the same spirt as ours. I don't believe there is a NASA region there unfortunatly. SCCA in Az and Cal Club have adopted spec 944 rules class regionally only.

So if you are not in 944-spec area you have two choices.
1) Find the NASA group and build 944-spec in your area. We (944-spec) will help you and love to see the group expand

2) Pick another race group. Spec Miata, Honda Challenge, 944cup, SCCA IT,PCA, etc

Mighty Shilling

I'm interested. I want in. I've already got some training, and once at a DE, schooled a spec miata in my 924S... Either I'm good, they suck, or Porsches are just better

Joe, is it possible for 924S to run in 944-spec, or does this mean I have to go buy another Porsche?

M758

The track record holder for all so cal tracks were set in an 87 924S.

penguinking

Tim,

you're a local georgia racer - how is the competition in I-stock? is the class big? how much are the frontrunners spending vs the budget racers (since it is a "stock" class)

penguinking

M758 - you're right, spec944 is too far away for me. the closest thing is PCA or 944 Cup, which doesn't sound too bad, but looking at past race entries (mylaps.com) most of the I-stock races only have 10-15 cars competing. though there are other classes participating in the race. then i go and look at the SARRC divisionals and under "SM", and i see 50-60 car entries in the race!

so many variables, i still can't decide. i don't like the idea of bumping too much, especially since i'm new to auto racing (only kart racing experience...though bumping is quite frequent there too)

Geo

If you want to go auto racing on the cheap, in your area the absolute best choice is IT7. It's first gen RX-7s only, but prepped to IT rules unlike Spec RX-7. I know they run them at Road Atlanta and elsewhere in the SE region. The RX-7 is probably second most developed race car the world has ever seen (2nd only to the 911). You can probably pick up a decent one for $3,000-$3,500 with a current log book.

aeshultz

Hey Hacker:
Re: $500 Volvo 240 in SCCA IT - Having just finished my rookie season running as the slowest driver in an ITS field - I can tell you first hand that being dive-bombed for 20 minutes straight hardly qualifies as fun. Do not make the mistake of thinking that SCCA fields are warm and cuddly - those guys are kick-@ss fast.

Matt H

While George's idea of RX7 is a good one, I have had no less than 5 RX-7s. I have 2 core engines in my garage and a 3rd in the car. They are...um, the weakest single piece of automotive work I have ever seen. The good news is that a monkey could be taught to rebuild them!
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Geo

One of the nice things about an RX-7 is that the engine is actually virtually indestructable. The apex seals are an issue, but once those are refreshed there is little to worry about. Also, in IT trim there is very little to be done to them as well. Emissions are a PITA from what I understand, but in IT emissions equipment may be removed. The carbs (like most carbs) can be a bit tempermental as I understand it. But generally, they are about as easy as race car to own as you can find.

Matt H

George, gonna have to disagree with you on that one. The 12A, while less tempermental than the 13B is still not a reliable motor. Hell, take a browse through Ebay or Autotrader and count the number of RX7s for sale that say:
Low Compression
Does not Run
Hard to Start (a sign of low compression)
Runs Ok, blows some smoke (see above)

Aside from the Apex seal issue, they eat water seals (if it overheats, you might as well tear it down, it is toast, even if it is only for a 2 minutes), they blow oil (made worse by the direct oil injection), etc.
Not that it matter much in a race car but they get about 17 MPG on the street on the track it is probably closer to 8 (be sure to factor costs of fuel and oil, it is usually run as a premix).

All that said, you are probably right, I doubt you could find a cheaper race car. An early rx with a bad motor can be had for less than 200 bucks (hell I have had people offer them to me for free!)

On a side note, you can run really cool welded differentials that make ALL sorts of noise at low speeds (sounds like it is about to fall apart ) George, is right, RX7s are highly developed in the racing world, almost nothing that you cannot buy for one.
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Legoland951

Both the 12A, 4 and 6 port 13B motors have apex seal problems when revved to redline often (which they love to do, rev). When they go, often they damage the chrome in the rotor housings and there goes your motor. The gas mileage absolutely blows with the 4 barrel carb (unless you have the GSL-SE) and even with fuel injection, its still bad. Given those negatives, the cars can be bought very cheap and are very fun to drive. Matt, its been so long since I owned one of them I forgot about the rear differential symphony. If you gas, it makes a certain noise and if you deaccelerate, it makes another. I wore out a few of those diffs and the LSD pumpkins were always easy to sell. I should post a picture of the 81 RX7 with a chevy 454 and turbo 400 trans we built more than 10 years ago. Believe it or not, the hood shuts with a 1 inch dome for the carb (no air cleaner).

Matt H

Lego, I will snap some pics tonight of a "blown" rotor and housing, they arent pretty!
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StoogeMoe

Hey, what are the rules for 944-spec? Is there an official website? I need to check this out.