Screwynewy

Ok, here's the deal. I am looking for a second car for spirited driving after work and weekends. I will be signing up for my first DE soon and would like to get into some autocross events, maybe 4-5 times a year. Price of the car is not the determining factor although cost of maintenance and repair is a consideration. I will probably drive the car 8,000 to 10,000 miles a year. Oh yeah, I live in NC and I am 38.

Here are the to car options:

1) 1988 Porsche 951 S w/ 112k miles, new clutch, water pump and timing belt replaced at 102k. New brake rotors and pads on all 4 corners. The car supposedly needs nothing at this time, all records available. Price $12,500.

Pros: Thrill to drive, true sports car handling and performance, exclusive/unique, always loved and wanted a 951, holds value better than M3

Cons: Cost to own, reliability, what else am I missing???

2) 1995 BMW M3 coupe 5 speed w/ 89k miles, 2 owner car, perfect condition and fully maintained. New waterpump and radiator, motor mounts, shock mounts, transmission mounts, M1 used since new, new Yok ES100 tires. Meticulously maintained by both prior owners. Price $13,500

Pros: Reliability, everday driveability, low end torque, low cost performance mods, newer/safer.

Cons: Less performance, I have owned a 97 M3 sedan w/ auto (so that shouldn't count), more potential for depreciation, not as exclusive as the 951.

Since I have never owned a 951 my main concerns are reliabity and daily driveability. Please make any suggestions or recommendations based on your own experience with either of these cars. Thanks for your input.

M@rk951

I had the same consideration 3 weeks ago and i went with the 951 my friend is swapping a motor into. The 951 kicks the M3's *** in performance and just plain amazingness lol. <3 Turbo's. I had a e36 325 before and it had a lil better interior but after riding in the 951 .... i went with the 951. Its got the flares and all the goodies and for the money you can get A LOT more power from the 951 and they are a very popular auto x car. My vote is for the 951s

CPTdooberhead

What part of NC are you located in?
-Randy

hacker-pschorr

I'd take the M3 just for the case of reliability. Yes I know plenty of people will swear up and down their 944 is a daily driver for many years with no problems. It can happen, more likely with the M3.

Honestly, neither car is a good choice for a relied upon daily driver that will also be a DE car. Track events are 100x's harder on any car vs a street car. When you blow a head gasket on the track, you shurg your shoulders and pull the head. If it's your street car, what are you going to drive for the 5-10 days it's being fixed. Even a small repair like a cracked rotor can cause your car to be laid up 3-4 days while you wait for parts.

I'd work into the budget a "beater" daily driver then go with the 951 for a pleasure vehicle/track car. If you can only buy one car no matter what, I feel the M3 will last longer on the track.

Sorry, no "you 944 basher" posts please.

hacker-pschorr

Post the link to the BMW list where you posted the same question.

GOBOGIE

You'll get the obvious answer on this board. I two considered the BMW route prior to purchasing my '89 951. It's truly a choice of different cars. BMW's are wonderly made cars, as are Porsche's. I think the best thing to help you decide is determining what you plan on using the car for. Mind you that the 951 isn't the best auto-x car... little to now low end torque. On the other hand, it will impress the hell out of you during a backroad driving sprint that will leave a smile on your face that few BMW's will hold a candle to.

Enjoy making the decision... win - win situation here!!!

Screwynewy

ECUdooberhead,
I live in Raleigh. I graduated from ECU in 1989 and grew up in Kinston. I've been lurking here for a month or so and have seen you post quite a bit. Hope to be a 951 owner soon.

joseph mitro

several people have already posted this question so do a search. but basically, my take is this.....

as my avatar suggests, i own an E36 M3. I also owned a chipped and slightly modded 86 951. as for the "951 kicks the M3's ***" statement,..... i hardly think so. Yes, the 951 is faster when the turbo spins, but in stock to stock comparison, the M3 is as fast from 0-60 as a 951S. additionally, the driveability and reliability are much higher with the M3. AND the M3 holds it's value better than a 951 (just do some comparison shopping). so here's my take:

M3: PROS: bigger engine, newer suspension design, excellent handling, great looks, everyday driveability, bulletproof reliability, can be an excellent track car with some mods, parts are cheaper
CONS: more difficult to get ultimate performance, heavier and taller center of gravity, not a PURE sports car

951S: PROS: pure sports car, top notch handling, excellent modification capability, great looks, turbo boost
CONS: horrible maintenance and repair costs, more mechanically complex, less reliable when pushed to the limit if modified above stock, 16 year old suspension design

so, you decide. truthfully, you can't go wrong either way. i would love to have another 951, but i'll wait until i rebuild my 944S

joseph mitro

www.bimmerforums.com is the best list i've found. www.m3forum.com is another one.

screwynewey - for an M3 with 89K vs a 951S with 112K.....you will get more miles before serious trouble with the M3 than the 951. my M3 has 99K and it's already seen two trackdays and two autocrosses with me in 6 months.

Screwynewy

Joseph, Thanks for the input....good points made. I am really not sure at this point, I could go either way. The bad part about that is I will probably doubt my decision 6 months after and end up selling one of the cars to buy the other.

Dmitry S.

That 951 is quite a bit overpriced in my opinion. Should be much closer to the 10k mark.

AndyK

I am currently thinking about a 97-98 M3 coupe to replace my S2. The A/C is shot on my S2, and I am kinda tired of always having to fix something on the car.

Problem is, the 944 blows the BMW away in the looks department! Nothing is a cool as the 944's wide fenders and 80's in-your-face stance. I know I would miss it.

That said, the 944 is raw, loud, and not as user friendly as the M3. And, as Joseph has pointed out (in several similar threads) the M3 has much newer(and better) tech when it comes to suspension, brakes, and panel tolerances.

Tough choice. If money is a concern (it certainly is for me), you can get a nice 951 for HALF of what you would pay for an M3, and put that money in the bank waiting for a service or repair bill on the 951, and still come out relatively even.

I do like a silver M3 with those Contour rims!

Serge944

If you are mechanically inclined, go for the 951; afterall, there is no substitute. Stock, 951's are very reliable; many people dont realize however..that when you produce 75% more hp than stock, you WILL have major reliability issues. Ive been driving my n/a 944 for 20k miles now (in 10 months) and it only let me down once with a broken heater valve hose (which is my fault because i never changed it when i did the engine swap).

If you never wanna wrench on the car, go for the M3. Theyre newer and are a little more hardy.

CPTdooberhead

Well if ya pick one up, or want to look at one and need an opinion let me know, I have fellow 951 friends in Raliegh/Cary, and I frequent the area often. Good luck
-Randy

Mighty Shilling

My dad has had both...had a 95 M3 coupe and now has an 88 turbo S. Well, in both his and my opinion, the Turbo S is overall more fun, and faster, handles better, and is an overall better SPORTS car. In terms of reliability, the M3 never had any issues in the year and a half that we had it, and it had about 50K miles. So far we've had the turbo S for about a month, so we don't really know anything about reliability, but my dad's become a boost addict and is now looking to upgrade....

IMHO, go for the 951 if you're looking for fun issues. If you're looking for reliability, go for the M3. I base the reliability on my 924S...each month, something gets replaced...it's the nature of an old car.