Insurance will not cover our car.
11-11-2018, 01:30 PM
#1
Track Day
Thread Starter
Insurance will not cover our car.
Called our insurance company to put insurance on our 1983 944. Thought all was god until we got a call from them stating that our car is a grey market car and could not be covered by them. Has anyone heard of this? What is a grey market car? Help please.
11-11-2018, 01:54 PM
#3
The term 'grey market' is usually given to a rest of the world (ROW) that has been federalized to US DOT specs....side markers, lens colors, bumpers, emmisions ect... Hagerty, Grundy, Great a American or other insurance companies should be able find an underwriter for a policy.
11-11-2018, 02:00 PM
#4
Nordschleife Master
Who is your insurance company?
I have Pekin (Farmer's) on my 928. They changed the VIN from "WP0ZZZ..." to "WP0JB0..." on the card, but my agent says that's not a problem, just that their system won't process a "ZZZ" VIN.
"Grey Market" is the old way of importing a car into the US. It used to be legal to bring a car into the US, bring it into compliance with US regs (pollution, lights & safety were the big ones) and get it inspected and approved. The process was known as "federalizing". There were quite a few 80 - 83 928S brought into the US that way. The Euro S had significantly more power than the US model. There were some 84 - 86 928 S2 brought in. That's what mine is. I don't know about the differences between US & Euro 944s, or how many were brought in.
The process was stopped in the early 90s. Mercedes got pissed that people could buy a car in Germany, bring it into the US, federalize it and sell it for less than they could sell it on the showroom floor (due to currency values). So they bought a bunch of congress-critters and had them pass laws to stop it.
I have Pekin (Farmer's) on my 928. They changed the VIN from "WP0ZZZ..." to "WP0JB0..." on the card, but my agent says that's not a problem, just that their system won't process a "ZZZ" VIN.
"Grey Market" is the old way of importing a car into the US. It used to be legal to bring a car into the US, bring it into compliance with US regs (pollution, lights & safety were the big ones) and get it inspected and approved. The process was known as "federalizing". There were quite a few 80 - 83 928S brought into the US that way. The Euro S had significantly more power than the US model. There were some 84 - 86 928 S2 brought in. That's what mine is. I don't know about the differences between US & Euro 944s, or how many were brought in.
The process was stopped in the early 90s. Mercedes got pissed that people could buy a car in Germany, bring it into the US, federalize it and sell it for less than they could sell it on the showroom floor (due to currency values). So they bought a bunch of congress-critters and had them pass laws to stop it.
11-11-2018, 02:37 PM
#6
Nordschleife Master
Yes.
Sort of anyway.
If the actual VIN has the ZZZ, then yes, it's a Euro/Grey Market import.
However, there is a 'chassis number' that will have the ZZZ no matter where it was sold.
If it's a grey market, there should be an importer's sticker, usually on the door jamb. It will have the original VIN, name of the importer and date imported. There may be a state 'special VIN' sticker (these stickers may or may not still be there) Some states issued their own VIN to these cars. New Jersey was one. My 928 has both the importer's sticker and the New Jersey 'special VIN' sticker. Fortunately, the title still shows the VIN the car was built with. There are stories of people who have that state issued 'special VIN' on the title and it causes all sorts of issues.
Sort of anyway.
If the actual VIN has the ZZZ, then yes, it's a Euro/Grey Market import.
However, there is a 'chassis number' that will have the ZZZ no matter where it was sold.
If it's a grey market, there should be an importer's sticker, usually on the door jamb. It will have the original VIN, name of the importer and date imported. There may be a state 'special VIN' sticker (these stickers may or may not still be there) Some states issued their own VIN to these cars. New Jersey was one. My 928 has both the importer's sticker and the New Jersey 'special VIN' sticker. Fortunately, the title still shows the VIN the car was built with. There are stories of people who have that state issued 'special VIN' on the title and it causes all sorts of issues.
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11-11-2018, 04:16 PM
#8
Hates Family Guy
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
The vin you posted in your intro thread is not a ROW vin
What's the vin on the title? What vin did the insurance company use? If they used the chassis number by the battery you have to convince them that is not the VIN.
If its an early car can anyone give me more details using the vin? It is WP0AA0940DN456046.
11-11-2018, 04:18 PM
#9
Drifting
You guys don't get "classic car insurance" down there? Here, you get an appraisal (100$) and insurance is around 10-20$ a month. You have to sign that you're only driving to events or occasional. But, nobody follows you around
11-11-2018, 05:04 PM
#10
Nordschleife Master
I have just 'standard' insurance on all of mine (944, 928, Cayenne). Liability & comp on the 944, full coverage on the other 2. While I understand the argument that comp is a waste of money on the 944, I like the idea that theft, fire or storm damage (like a tree falling on it) would be covered. It's not that much extra. Besides, I suspend liability & collision during winter storage.
11-11-2018, 05:20 PM
#11
Intermediate
mashed by a big Oak is what happened to my 912 Targa
Read the find print on that. There are some stories out there about 'classic' or 'specialty' car insurance refusing to pay on claims because the car wasn't in the garage, or the accident happened in a store parking lot. Both of which were in violation of the requirements of the policy.
I have just 'standard' insurance on all of mine (944, 928, Cayenne). Liability & comp on the 944, full coverage on the other 2. While I understand the argument that comp is a waste of money on the 944, I like the idea that theft, fire or storm damage (like a tree falling on it) would be covered. It's not that much extra. Besides, I suspend liability & collision during winter storage.
I have just 'standard' insurance on all of mine (944, 928, Cayenne). Liability & comp on the 944, full coverage on the other 2. While I understand the argument that comp is a waste of money on the 944, I like the idea that theft, fire or storm damage (like a tree falling on it) would be covered. It's not that much extra. Besides, I suspend liability & collision during winter storage.
11-11-2018, 08:03 PM
#12
Nordschleife Master
This is really bad advise, commiting insurance fraud is a criminal offense and the insurance companies and courts take it very seriously.
11-12-2018, 01:23 PM
#13
Read the find print on that. There are some stories out there about 'classic' or 'specialty' car insurance refusing to pay on claims because the car wasn't in the garage, or the accident happened in a store parking lot. Both of which were in violation of the requirements of the policy.
I have just 'standard' insurance on all of mine (944, 928, Cayenne). Liability & comp on the 944, full coverage on the other 2. While I understand the argument that comp is a waste of money on the 944, I like the idea that theft, fire or storm damage (like a tree falling on it) would be covered. It's not that much extra. Besides, I suspend liability & collision during winter storage.
I have just 'standard' insurance on all of mine (944, 928, Cayenne). Liability & comp on the 944, full coverage on the other 2. While I understand the argument that comp is a waste of money on the 944, I like the idea that theft, fire or storm damage (like a tree falling on it) would be covered. It's not that much extra. Besides, I suspend liability & collision during winter storage.
It's easy enough if you are only going to drive to shows, but trying to daily a valuable classic is a PITA from an insurance stand point.
11-12-2018, 11:04 PM
#14
Nordschleife Master
That's one reason I drive it regularly.
I do agree that driving anything really rare or valuable is taking a risk.
Insurance rarely pays out what they are really worth.
11-13-2018, 10:21 AM
#15
Same thing applies to mine! That's why I am currently leaving it unmodified and only fix important maintenance items. I really got burned on sinking months of nights and weekends into a car and then after the accident I had to buy it back, pull all my parts off it, find another shell, swap parts again... that really sucked and I'd prefer not to repeat the experience.