Continuing this whole "Is 130 on the highway ok" discussion...
12-02-2003, 10:17 PM
#1
Drifting
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Continuing this whole "Is 130 on the highway ok" discussion...
I noticed the thread about whether travelling above the speed limit is ok or not got alot of responses and stirred up alot of controversy.
Recently at Clubs Days at the University of British Columbia (where I go to school) here in Vancouver, the UBC Sports Car Club had a special guest.
It was a police cruiser; not just any police cruiser, a tricked out Honda Civic SiR. This obviously attracted alot of attention, and begged questions like "Is that a real police car?", and "oh great, our tax dollars are going into ricing out police cars so that our cops can look extra cool..."
In Vancouver there is a high amount of illegal street racing fatalities that occur each year, above the average amount. The Vancouver Police Department has taken an initiative to create a program, called P.A.C.E.R., to create awareness about illegal street racing. They have this Civic, so that any eager and accelerator-happy racer might be more inclined to take his high-speed driving to the track and race a cop in the Civic than risk his life and those of others on the streets. The car, completely done up, was donated by a local tuning shop that deals with Honda's, as they realize that their cars are involved in these incidents quite frequently. I also think perhaps the large asian community here in BC has helped increase an interest in cars within the past 10 years, especially imports (we just had Import Fest here last weekend). But this passion and interest (READ: NOT asian people) for these flashy and extremely fast vehicles have lead to an increased amount of illegal street racing.
I spoke with the cop, and he was quite knowledgeable about the whole thing; he gets to drive it because he races himself in his spare time.
Myself I think this is a great initiative to try to control illegal street racing. If there were tracks and events made available to young speed demons, I think that many (NOT ALL) of these drivers with their heads screwed on right would avoid racing in the streets, and possibly endangering themselves and pedestrians.
This won't solve all problems, but it may help...
What do you guys think?
Recently at Clubs Days at the University of British Columbia (where I go to school) here in Vancouver, the UBC Sports Car Club had a special guest.
It was a police cruiser; not just any police cruiser, a tricked out Honda Civic SiR. This obviously attracted alot of attention, and begged questions like "Is that a real police car?", and "oh great, our tax dollars are going into ricing out police cars so that our cops can look extra cool..."
In Vancouver there is a high amount of illegal street racing fatalities that occur each year, above the average amount. The Vancouver Police Department has taken an initiative to create a program, called P.A.C.E.R., to create awareness about illegal street racing. They have this Civic, so that any eager and accelerator-happy racer might be more inclined to take his high-speed driving to the track and race a cop in the Civic than risk his life and those of others on the streets. The car, completely done up, was donated by a local tuning shop that deals with Honda's, as they realize that their cars are involved in these incidents quite frequently. I also think perhaps the large asian community here in BC has helped increase an interest in cars within the past 10 years, especially imports (we just had Import Fest here last weekend). But this passion and interest (READ: NOT asian people) for these flashy and extremely fast vehicles have lead to an increased amount of illegal street racing.
I spoke with the cop, and he was quite knowledgeable about the whole thing; he gets to drive it because he races himself in his spare time.
Myself I think this is a great initiative to try to control illegal street racing. If there were tracks and events made available to young speed demons, I think that many (NOT ALL) of these drivers with their heads screwed on right would avoid racing in the streets, and possibly endangering themselves and pedestrians.
This won't solve all problems, but it may help...
What do you guys think?
12-02-2003, 10:46 PM
#2
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In the 80s, everyone was concerned about this new fangled sport of skateboarding, with all these young hooligans skating around in parking lots and such. Today, even the hick central Kansas town of 15,000 that I live in has a skate park, and rarely do you see kids skating on the street. So if you want to stop street racing........and please don't say SCCA, from what I've read (no I haven't participated) the average person off the street can't participate, there is required equipment and there are fees required. Helmets are a must, but most high schoolers aren't going to equip their Civic with a full cage. Make it cheap, make it easy, and they will come.
12-02-2003, 11:24 PM
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In the 80s, everyone was concerned about this new fangled sport of skateboarding, with all these young hooligans skating around in parking lots and such. Today, even the hick central Kansas town of 15,000 that I live in has a skate park, and rarely do you see kids skating on the street. So if you want to stop street racing........and please don't say SCCA, from what I've read (no I haven't participated) the average person off the street can't participate, there is required equipment and there are fees required. Helmets are a must, but most high schoolers aren't going to equip their Civic with a full cage. Make it cheap, make it easy, and they will come.
Your right most highschoolers aren't going to equip a car with a full cage. But i know people who participate in track events without a full cage. Go to any auto-cross, most time trials, some dirver education and any sanctioned drag race with an open class and your able to race without a cage. I'm a highschooler and partipate in autocross as much as i can. If i wanted to join every club in my area and do all there events i could easily do 30+ in a year. But that year lasts from april to october because of snow. My other big complaint with it is that you have to work at the events (if your over 18
). In an idea world you could set up somthing similar to a skate park, but make it more like an auto-cross course. Use the glue that is used to attached the little road markers you see sometimes, hire someone to keep track of timeing, and put senors in the cones so you can see if you hit them. This would be a cheapish solution that could solve some of the probloms that street racers are causing. And it could be used to educate teenage drivers about car control.
Also, when someone at a school dies in a car crash they need to display the car right at the exit where the students leave with a big sign that says somthign like "speed kills" or "drinking and driving kills" Just to remind us that were all human.
sorry for ranting
David
12-02-2003, 11:36 PM
#7
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Originally posted by onewhippedlittlepuppy
In the 80s, everyone was concerned about this new fangled sport of skateboarding, with all these young hooligans skating around in parking lots and such. Today, even the hick central Kansas town of 15,000 that I live in has a skate park, and rarely do you see kids skating on the street. So if you want to stop street racing........and please don't say SCCA, from what I've read (no I haven't participated) the average person off the street can't participate, there is required equipment and there are fees required. Helmets are a must, but most high schoolers aren't going to equip their Civic with a full cage. Make it cheap, make it easy, and they will come.
In the 80s, everyone was concerned about this new fangled sport of skateboarding, with all these young hooligans skating around in parking lots and such. Today, even the hick central Kansas town of 15,000 that I live in has a skate park, and rarely do you see kids skating on the street. So if you want to stop street racing........and please don't say SCCA, from what I've read (no I haven't participated) the average person off the street can't participate, there is required equipment and there are fees required. Helmets are a must, but most high schoolers aren't going to equip their Civic with a full cage. Make it cheap, make it easy, and they will come.
Hahaha I skate but have only been to one park... 90% of my community skates wherever they want to...
But if the tracks are available and don't require too much - you are right people will come.
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12-02-2003, 11:44 PM
#8
Three Wheelin'
The drag racing scene has done much better with this than the road racing scene has. Here where I live....there are no autocrosses unless you want to drive for 2 hours one way to get to one (I can't even get to them as they would be over before I could get there on Saturdays since I work till 1PM right now).
However, if you want to drag race, on Tuesday and Thursday nights during the warmer months, for $10 you can drag race your car all evening. Now so long as you are under XX speed, you can take a passenger with you. If you are under another speed, you can go but no passenger and no helmet. If you get over that speed, you have to have the right equipment for your next pass or you won't run again. This is at the Bristol Dragway right behind the NASCAR oval for those of you who don't know where I'm hailing from. $5 lets you hang out all night and ride if you can bum one. Gets it off the street and lets people who can brag show what they have with a timeslip to prove it and the other guy can't moan and whine about whatever. They can go at it all night if they want to. I've not been, but I've considered going just to do tuning or something....no intention to all out race anyone since I'm not going to burn up my clutch!
No skating parks around here I know about!
However, if you want to drag race, on Tuesday and Thursday nights during the warmer months, for $10 you can drag race your car all evening. Now so long as you are under XX speed, you can take a passenger with you. If you are under another speed, you can go but no passenger and no helmet. If you get over that speed, you have to have the right equipment for your next pass or you won't run again. This is at the Bristol Dragway right behind the NASCAR oval for those of you who don't know where I'm hailing from. $5 lets you hang out all night and ride if you can bum one. Gets it off the street and lets people who can brag show what they have with a timeslip to prove it and the other guy can't moan and whine about whatever. They can go at it all night if they want to. I've not been, but I've considered going just to do tuning or something....no intention to all out race anyone since I'm not going to burn up my clutch!
No skating parks around here I know about!
12-03-2003, 01:35 AM
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I used to skate 80's and was harassed by cops always, skated in college too early 90's still harassed. As far as Porsches go I've had since I was 20, when I drive it it's at least 100 everyday, 120-140 once a week.
12-03-2003, 01:46 AM
#10
Race Director
Controlled events, be it drag racing, autocross, or road course driving are availabe in most areas. Some events are relatively cheap, others require some more cash and prep. Most clubs offer loaner helmets at autocrosses. (Suggestion: wear a bandana if you use a loaner! 
)
I am sure there are some of the younger crowd that will say, "Yeah, but I want to drive on a real race track, but I can't afford it yet." Well, I guess you'll have to wait a little more to experience that thrill. Remember what they say about instant gratification? I wished I could drive on the track when I was younger, but it was beyond my reach. Now, I do about 10 autocross and 8 DE events a year. My 'budget' for car expenses (including maintenance, autocross and DE entry fees, hotel, gas, tires...etc), was probably close to $10,000.00 this season! (Shhh: don't tell Mrs. Z-man!!). I've got a decent job, and can afford to spend $$ on such 'frivilous' things. I'm not saying this to brag, I'm just saying to those who wish but can't afford it, be patient, your time will come.
I commend the BC Police for doing something proactive to help with the street racing scene.
-Z-man.
)I am sure there are some of the younger crowd that will say, "Yeah, but I want to drive on a real race track, but I can't afford it yet." Well, I guess you'll have to wait a little more to experience that thrill. Remember what they say about instant gratification? I wished I could drive on the track when I was younger, but it was beyond my reach. Now, I do about 10 autocross and 8 DE events a year. My 'budget' for car expenses (including maintenance, autocross and DE entry fees, hotel, gas, tires...etc), was probably close to $10,000.00 this season! (Shhh: don't tell Mrs. Z-man!!). I've got a decent job, and can afford to spend $$ on such 'frivilous' things. I'm not saying this to brag, I'm just saying to those who wish but can't afford it, be patient, your time will come.
I commend the BC Police for doing something proactive to help with the street racing scene.
-Z-man.
12-03-2003, 01:47 AM
#11
Nordschleife Master
I became big on skating when i was 13 and still am big on skating at the age of 18. My friends and I are hassled all the time by the police in my town for skating the few (but pretty decent) local spots. Their is still no skatepark in my town, the only being about 20-25 minutes away 3 towns over...we have wrote a few letters to the youth board but never heard back. I agree, build it and they will come (no pun intended), but it has to be reasonable to get too and to use.
12-03-2003, 02:50 AM
#12
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I agree with you Z-man. I'm a student right now, and maybe I would be able to enter autocross events, but I would not be able to keep up the maintenance on my car required after being run so hard at an event. I'm perfectly happy waiting for an opportune time to enjoy my car to the fullest, when I have a bit more money to play with.
I think it's great the Vancouver police are doing something like this....does any equivalent exist in any other cities out there?
I think it's great the Vancouver police are doing something like this....does any equivalent exist in any other cities out there?
12-03-2003, 02:58 AM
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I'm sorry but skate parks and illegal drag ricing are not in the simples terms equal! I’m sorry VC has a problem, obviously the local law enforcement isn't dong their job.
Don’t get me started because I have a 12 year old that goes to the local skate parks with the appropriate pads and he doesn't take out my 944 for the local street racing. He does go with me to the PCA/POC sponsored events so he can witness how safety and track control are the most important elements in staying alive, besides maintaining your car.
I explain to him the differences of highway driving and racing on a controlled course, i.e., the width of the course compared to the curbs inches away. I’m sorry BC, Canada has a problem with drag ricing. The local officials shouldn’t be sponsoring it by build one to support the habit but enforce the infractions and prevent the deaths. They’re not doing you a just service in my opinion.
GO TO A SCCA TRACK EVENT OR A PCA/POC EVENT. Drag ricing is too short (life or time)!!
Don’t get me started because I have a 12 year old that goes to the local skate parks with the appropriate pads and he doesn't take out my 944 for the local street racing. He does go with me to the PCA/POC sponsored events so he can witness how safety and track control are the most important elements in staying alive, besides maintaining your car.
I explain to him the differences of highway driving and racing on a controlled course, i.e., the width of the course compared to the curbs inches away. I’m sorry BC, Canada has a problem with drag ricing. The local officials shouldn’t be sponsoring it by build one to support the habit but enforce the infractions and prevent the deaths. They’re not doing you a just service in my opinion.
GO TO A SCCA TRACK EVENT OR A PCA/POC EVENT. Drag ricing is too short (life or time)!!
12-03-2003, 03:04 AM
#14
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Well also a lot of the deaths in Vancouver/BC arent always race related, a lot are just plain outright STUPIDITY, like those FOUR kids in a honda CRX on vancouver island a few weeks ago 
The driver was the only one who left the scene alive IIRC, and he didnt last long in the hospital IIRC.
With idiocy like that, sometimes its better that they die, just a shame that the government had to change the already annoying young drivers system to basically castrate a lot of good teens.
The driver was the only one who left the scene alive IIRC, and he didnt last long in the hospital IIRC.With idiocy like that, sometimes its better that they die, just a shame that the government had to change the already annoying young drivers system to basically castrate a lot of good teens.
12-03-2003, 10:34 AM
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I'd like to put in a bit here.
Don't complain about having to work an event like an autocross. If everybody had that attitude, no auto-x would ever get done. Auto-x is one those events that isn't put on by a professional staff, on somebody's payroll, that has to be scheduled a year in advance. If you want to play, you've got to pay. To carry this a bit further, most amatuer races, track days, and DE events are put on and worked by volunteers. We don't do this just for you to come out an get your speed jollies while we stand idly by and watch. We like to drive too, so expect to do you time in the corners with a flag. If any of these events required professional workers, expect much, much higher entry fees, putting it even further out of the reach of the average guy. The point is, do your time both in the seat and on the course. You might learn something watching up close.
Don't complain about having to work an event like an autocross. If everybody had that attitude, no auto-x would ever get done. Auto-x is one those events that isn't put on by a professional staff, on somebody's payroll, that has to be scheduled a year in advance. If you want to play, you've got to pay. To carry this a bit further, most amatuer races, track days, and DE events are put on and worked by volunteers. We don't do this just for you to come out an get your speed jollies while we stand idly by and watch. We like to drive too, so expect to do you time in the corners with a flag. If any of these events required professional workers, expect much, much higher entry fees, putting it even further out of the reach of the average guy. The point is, do your time both in the seat and on the course. You might learn something watching up close.