willyexner

Hi 911 Rennlist fellow members,

Novice to this forum (what a great place!) I am an old bones automotive project engineer, live in Europe and have owned in my life several exotic Italian sport cars, mostly Italians, but never a Porsche.

I am contemplating the idea of buying this baby,



a 1985 PORSCHE 911 Turbo WPO ZZZ 93 ZFS 00 3XX which you may see in detail by clicking this link taking you to a pictures gallery.

History:

I have been shown by the seller, the third owner from 2003, a Porsche Certificate stating that the frame number is was originally a 911 Turbo built in 1985.

The second owner is said of having bought the car at a justice auction after a legal seizure lasting ten years. The car history previous is wholly unknown. The having been stored in unsuitable conditions, the body needed repainting, the seized engine (said to be stamped 930/66 S, kit 330 bhp, front radiator, larger intercooler, K27 turbine) had new gaskets, new valves and new turbine. The car is now said to be in fair running order, missing a fuse cover, the intercooler top gasket and to have a (said to be a common defect of 911 turbo) a drop of oil between engine block and gearbox.

On pictures the slantnose conversion looks rather professional. Is there any way to tell if it was one made by the Factory special service department that was making these conversions?

For reasons of distance I have not yet inspected the car yet.
Obviously, being totally inexperienced on the specific make/model, I will be thankful for any advice from Porsche gurus as to what and where to look for weak spots, corrosion and any other hidden bug I may fail to notice.

Thanks and cheers!

*****

Sameer

*****,
Welcome to the forum.

Isit an original slantnose and how much are they asking?
What mods have been done to it?
Has it been tracked? If yes how often and how hard?
When was the last engine rebuilt?
Any accidents?
Any rusts?
Any leaks?
Do you get full boost(0.7 to 0.8 bar)?
Does the car go straight?
Have it inspected by a good Porsche mechanic before taking the plunge.

slownrusty

***** - Absolutely great looking car!! I cannot believe that the mileage is only at just over 51,000km - that is incredibly low.

A couple of things I picked-up in your description:
1) That front radiator is an oil cooler

2) You can inspect the exact type of Turbo as it will have a riveted plate on it describing the exact model (basically verifying if it is a K27)

3) I would be weary of buying a car that had a seized engine at such a low mileage and then rebuilt, UNLESS you can have it inspected by a Porsche Specialist verifying that the engine is infact healthy. Which gaskets have been replaced? Furthermore you said that the engine is in "fair running order", tha does not give me the warm and fuzzies. I was hoping you would say it is a blast to drive with power to spare.

4) Body and interior look excellent, espcially the low front spoiler lip does not look like there is a scratch on it - this is a good thing! Or it just recently came out of the Body Shop?

5) That top intercooler gasket is prone to come off like you say and it is only a rubber seal between the top of the intercooler and the inside of the whale tale to direct air over the top of it. Not a big deal to replace.

Sameer makes some great points to also consider.

If the price is good and an independent Porsche garage says that the car is healthy I say go for it!!

Yasin

senna21

Welcome to the forum.

I'd say you need to go to the Air/Oil cooled section of the Forum and then click on the 911 section.

At the top of the Forum listings there you'll see one with Pre-Purchase inspection in the title. Click on that and read it. It'll help clear up what you should look for or have looked at by another party. This is known as a PPI or Pre-Purchase Inspection. It should be done with any car but especially with one where repairs can often match 50% of the price its self.

GOOD LUCK! I hope it checks out. Fantastic looking car.

willyexner

Sameer,
The present owner says tht it is an original slantnose apart of the front spoiler (nice looking though)
and the strakes on the doors which he was told was a period gadget available in after market.
I am collecting all possible info before inspecting so to ascertain it is an S slantnose, alternative if she was period built with proper Porsche AM pieces.
Thanks fopr your advice...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

slownrusty ,
I agree she looks cute...
1.) Yes, oil cooler.
I learnt it was dropped in later m/y to get the MOT, as hot oil may flash in case of a crash leak...
2.) Turbine is a K27
3.) Engine... if it was a Ferrari or Alfa Romeo of the period \i could rebuild it eyes bandaged, in a dark room... on this one I am to get a Porsche expert's opinion.
4.) Leather skin shows it want storage dry, but no wear... there are products to bring it back full shape.
In general I am hooked... she is a sexy devil... so if nothing BIG is against I may well end up in bed!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Senna21
Thanks for the welcome and for the trail to the PPI, I definitely go for it now!

senna21

If you do get it I'd love to hear your driving impressions in comparisons to a Ferrari 308QV. I'm well aware that this is indeed faster, I've driven both myself, but it's been a while. My main focus is driving position and driver controls. I.E. the difference in reach to the shift ****, steering wheel position, floor mounted pedals to hanging, response to driver input, weight transfer, you get the idea.

willyexner

senna 21

I've been racing single seaters for nearly two decades, so I get the idea from your words and look forward to get the real feel from the low end of the spine....


*****

Mongo

I've never seen a slant nose with that particular pumper or the gills in the rockers extending to the door as trim. They don't make bodykits like that either to my knowledge. This might be a Special Wishes Program Slantnose.

WERK-I

*****,
Maybe I can help. I own a factory 930S and have a few photos to help in your understanding of the car.
Front spoiler and front bumper unlike anything I've seen in photos of the Flachbau's. Not to say that the Special Wishes Program did just about anything for money back then. Same with the side skakes(sp.?).
Factory did a nice job of routing the oil lines under the front bonnet for the front oil cooler. The headlight linkage is also illustrated....headlights are round H-1's. The turbo provided in the S's is K27, a K27-7006, to be exact.
My VIN is exactly the same as yours with the last 3 digits, 3XX. Maybe they sat side-by-side in the Werk I facility back in the 80's.<grin>

Sameer

I thought the K27-7006 came abt only in the early 90's? Never knew it was out so early in the 80's.

willyexner

WERK-I
Must compliment you for your car!
Your contribution, like the pic you showed, is the kind of valuable help I am looking for.

Tell you what: there was a time that when it came to restoration and details of cars like Alfa Romeos Giulia and Giulietta, and also on Ferrari 257 GTB, 330 GTC, 246 Dino and Daytonas, I could hardly be beaten.

Sometimes one can either use a self-tapping screw or a rivet, either is mechanically legitimate but only one is right... Which?
Which is why when I wanted to go HC racing with a Lotus 23B, once individuated the right frame and engine I gave it to a person in England who was possibly the most experienced person existing on that make/model and let him perform his art. And he built for me the *right* car.

So, as I am a Porsche illiterate, if you may spare more pics like that showing the headlight motor linkage and the side of the boot... or some pics of underneath sensitive spots, or any kind of identity plates, or anything specific to the 930 SE... please...

For the remaining I appreciate the "balance" of your comments. The front bumper *** fog lights and the spoiler are unusual, but rather than calling them "wrong" or "fake" (as some did) you wrote "that the Special Wishes Program did just about anything for money back then".

To my scarce experience that arrangement is insofar unique seen, on the other hand I find it rather lovely to look at and, manufacturing quality wise, showing to be a professional piece of equipment. At least on pics.
So, I long to see it from close and touch it for real: till then I refrain my judgment.
Same as you did.

Same for the door strakes, again unique seen till now.
Aesthetically I have no complaints and once more they do look pro, not back yard garage.
So I wait to touch and see if they are made of the same exact material as those of the air intake (was it hard wood?). A contributor hinted they might be a Gemballa after market gizmo, I simply do not know.

I kept the cherry for last, as a topping... so to make you grin.
My hooker is frame number 00350 therefore, as you presumed, perhaps “they sat side-by-side in the Werk I facility back in the 80's.”

We all live in a small planet don't we?...

Cheers,

*****

CrAzYcArGuY

*****, I have seen a couple SE slantnose cars in a books from Europe just like yours less the side strakes. I am looking for the books now to verify but they are packed away. I would think many things would be very similar to WERK-I Daves car. I have a factory 87 US slantnose that I love and I wish you the best if you get this one. It looks beautiful.

willyexner

Hello CrAzYcArGuY,

Gee... that is an INTERESTING piece of info! I really hope that you find those books but whichever the outcome, thanks for your endeavor.

Sure that placing together pictorial information like that you have in you library or that which came and may still come from WERK-I Daves car (which has a VIN is only 4 digits distant from this 930 Se), plus information I'm gathering from other sources, I'll be able to compose a mosaic to place the car in a proper origin contest.

I thank you for the wishes... yeah, she looks beautiful, I agree!
Tell you what, I am an old fox, had many exotic cars, was so long in the classic cars game and have "given" so much that, if you asked me a couple of weeks ago, I would swear that I was vaccinated and that there could no longer be a thing on four wheels once more capable to make me fall in love at first sight.

Then she walked along, the beautiful, sexy lady, and look at me here, babbling, writing posts with an index finger and my Doctor annoyed because I should be in bed, horizontal and laying still, to help my fractured collarbone and ribs joining ends.
Life is hard... isn't it?

*****

willyexner

Hello Stig,

your comments on bumper and door strakes are correct and I answered them to the best of my present knowledge on the post to WERK-I, meaning with the benefit of inventory until I don't pass the car under microscope, hopefully end of next week, collarbone allowing...

Reason I'm writing is to tell one small story about how careful a foreigner apprentice should be. Reading in your post "This might be a Special Wishes Program Slantnose." I took it as if a stranger slapped my girl friend.

My interpreting was that, if she was addressed to as for having been made under a "Special Wishes Program" it was like saying her standards were, no offense meant to Mickey Mouse or the Disney Corporation, those of Goofy's Autotuning workshop.

But a little time later my temper boiled off, by learning that the Special Wishes Dept. is a way this Porsche community names a serious departement in the Stuttgart Works where...
See?

*****

WERK-I

Sameer wrote:
"I thought the K27-7006 came abt only in the early 90's? Never knew it was out so early in the 80's."

I don't know why you would think that. Nothing earth shattering about the design. The K27's are just better matched for the engines than the K26's.

*****,
You are very welcome! I don't mind taking pics.....one slight problem. My car is 160miles away. I just moved and I have yet to get the turbo up to my new residence. My internet connectivity is somewhat limited until Thursday next week, so I apologize for my slow response time in advance.
I do have a suggestion though. There is a web site that has been constructed by a gentleman in Georgia. He has provided links to the Slantnose manual for the '87 - 89 930's with the M505 option. It is not completely accurate when it comes to the Special Wishes cars of the early to mid-80's, because the factory took some shortcuts in assembly that differed from the Werk I facility. It does show the headlight linkage, the steel reinforcement panels under the bonnet, the "famous" $350 windshield washer bottle, the side jack point reinforcement tubes, to name a few. Here is the link;
http://www.930s.com/service.htm
Scroll down the page and you will find the "930S.com - Service Information List of Contents". Maybe if all the Special Wishes owners got together and provided tech info/pics to him, he could be the central repository? He has already put in some valuable time in constructing the site, it would be a waste not to utilize it.
What ya' think?