Deposit is down on an 87 911 M491 Widebody Cabriolet
05-29-2014, 02:34 AM
#16
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
That's a great price assuming that is a real factory turbo look. There is also a really beautiful turbo look coupe for sale on Pelican Parts - http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...k-m491-fs.html. I spoke with the owner and I can tell the car has been really well taken care of, along with some impressive performance mods. I really wanted white and some sort of open top but I was really tempted by his car. Regardless of miles the car looks new.
Soundbehindyou - What clues do you see that the seats have been recovered? I'm not questioning it, just wondering how to spot it.
Soundbehindyou - What clues do you see that the seats have been recovered? I'm not questioning it, just wondering how to spot it.
05-29-2014, 11:32 AM
#17
Team Owner
That's a great price assuming that is a real factory turbo look. There is also a really beautiful turbo look coupe for sale on Pelican Parts - http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...k-m491-fs.html. I spoke with the owner and I can tell the car has been really well taken care of, along with some impressive performance mods. I really wanted white and some sort of open top but I was really tempted by his car. Regardless of miles the car looks new.
Soundbehindyou - What clues do you see that the seats have been recovered? I'm not questioning it, just wondering how to spot it.
Soundbehindyou - What clues do you see that the seats have been recovered? I'm not questioning it, just wondering how to spot it.
too many creases in the seats and not as snug a fit as factory
allmost 0 wear for a car that old ...
it wouldnt stop me from buying the car but i would say they are most likely recovered seats ..
compare the one on Pelican and look at the difference between the seats .. so how tight the material is on a factory seat ?
05-29-2014, 01:31 PM
#18
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Looks like a very clean T/L. Congratulations.
I've had mine for 7+ years and loved every minute.
Re performance, once you've put on a freer flowing muffler, a pre-muffler and a chip, about the only way to get more out of the car without spending buckets of money is to start deleting weight. My car has dropped a bit over 350# and the change is evident. Of course, delete everything isn't for everyone (the wife hates it - no A/C, stereo, heater, etc.) And, it doesn't help resale value, if that is a concern.
I've seen the piping on a lot of Euro T/Ls; can't speak to the rest.
p.s. - Norbert with the turbolook register http://www.turbo-look.de/index-en.php can also verify the 491 authencity based on the VIN.
I've had mine for 7+ years and loved every minute.
Re performance, once you've put on a freer flowing muffler, a pre-muffler and a chip, about the only way to get more out of the car without spending buckets of money is to start deleting weight. My car has dropped a bit over 350# and the change is evident. Of course, delete everything isn't for everyone (the wife hates it - no A/C, stereo, heater, etc.) And, it doesn't help resale value, if that is a concern.
p.s. - Norbert with the turbolook register http://www.turbo-look.de/index-en.php can also verify the 491 authencity based on the VIN.
Last edited by rfloz; 05-29-2014 at 01:34 PM. Reason: Add registry info.
05-29-2014, 02:01 PM
#19
Team Owner
Looks like a very clean T/L. Congratulations.
I've had mine for 7+ years and loved every minute.
Re performance, once you've put on a freer flowing muffler, a pre-muffler and a chip, about the only way to get more out of the car without spending buckets of money is to start deleting weight. My car has dropped a bit over 350# and the change is evident. Of course, delete everything isn't for everyone (the wife hates it - no A/C, stereo, heater, etc.) And, it doesn't help resale value, if that is a concern.
I've seen the piping on a lot of Euro T/Ls; can't speak to the rest.
p.s. - Norbert with the turbolook register http://www.turbo-look.de/index-en.php can also verify the 491 authencity based on the VIN.
I've had mine for 7+ years and loved every minute.
Re performance, once you've put on a freer flowing muffler, a pre-muffler and a chip, about the only way to get more out of the car without spending buckets of money is to start deleting weight. My car has dropped a bit over 350# and the change is evident. Of course, delete everything isn't for everyone (the wife hates it - no A/C, stereo, heater, etc.) And, it doesn't help resale value, if that is a concern.
I've seen the piping on a lot of Euro T/Ls; can't speak to the rest.
p.s. - Norbert with the turbolook register http://www.turbo-look.de/index-en.php can also verify the 491 authencity based on the VIN.
05-29-2014, 02:18 PM
#20
Drifting
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Belmont Shore in Long Beach CA
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Hi,
Thanks to everyone on this forum for the direct and indirect help as I fumbled my way back to Porsche ownership. There is such a wealth of information on this forum (and Pelican Parts) and it was very useful.
When I started my search I was pretty sure I wanted a 3.2 Targa, similar to the 78 SC Targa I had many years ago. Or a Cabriolet. I naively expected to be sorting through all of my options to find the perfect white on black model out there for a screaming price. I now know the market is very different. Inventory is low and prices are high. So high that I started looking at 930s to expand my options. I love the look of the Turbo but in the end I decided that I didn't want the Turbo engine at this stage. I couldn't find what I was looking for anywhere. Then I saw a reference to Holt Motorsports as a source for high quality cars.
I jumped out of my seat when I found a white/black 3.2 with an authentic factory widebody with less than 50K miles on it. With white wheels. My only issue with the car is the boxed rockers which after seeing in person I will likely choose to replace with standard Turbo rockers. Deposit is down pending a PPI and details for shipping it across the country. Here are some photos:
http://www.holtmotorsports.com/carim...p?vin=171201#0
I know the added cost of the 3.2 M491 widebody cars leaves many people scratching their heads. 3.2 fans will give me grief for paying such a premium. Turbo fans will give me grief as they fly by me for having a poser Porsche
For me this isn't a compromise between the two...it's the perfect car for what I want. The aggressive looks, the breaking and the suspension of the Turbo with the 3.2/G50. Sold.
Comments welcome and suggestions on suppliers for the standard rockers much appreciated.
Thanks again,
Jeff
Thanks to everyone on this forum for the direct and indirect help as I fumbled my way back to Porsche ownership. There is such a wealth of information on this forum (and Pelican Parts) and it was very useful.
When I started my search I was pretty sure I wanted a 3.2 Targa, similar to the 78 SC Targa I had many years ago. Or a Cabriolet. I naively expected to be sorting through all of my options to find the perfect white on black model out there for a screaming price. I now know the market is very different. Inventory is low and prices are high. So high that I started looking at 930s to expand my options. I love the look of the Turbo but in the end I decided that I didn't want the Turbo engine at this stage. I couldn't find what I was looking for anywhere. Then I saw a reference to Holt Motorsports as a source for high quality cars.
I jumped out of my seat when I found a white/black 3.2 with an authentic factory widebody with less than 50K miles on it. With white wheels. My only issue with the car is the boxed rockers which after seeing in person I will likely choose to replace with standard Turbo rockers. Deposit is down pending a PPI and details for shipping it across the country. Here are some photos:
http://www.holtmotorsports.com/carim...p?vin=171201#0
I know the added cost of the 3.2 M491 widebody cars leaves many people scratching their heads. 3.2 fans will give me grief for paying such a premium. Turbo fans will give me grief as they fly by me for having a poser Porsche
For me this isn't a compromise between the two...it's the perfect car for what I want. The aggressive looks, the breaking and the suspension of the Turbo with the 3.2/G50. Sold.Comments welcome and suggestions on suppliers for the standard rockers much appreciated.
Thanks again,
Jeff
Forget about what others might think of your ride. Point is you're out driving it and it ain't parked wasting away is someone's barn in Wisconsin. Besides, was it just Valley Girls and Skaters buying up all the 80's Porsche Cars? Magnus Walker excluded!
05-30-2014, 01:57 PM
#22
Interesting thread! I also have a m491. Was debating on selling it and acquiring a 930, but just couldn't pull the trigger. The turbo look is a great car. Mine has been in the family for 20+ years but has only managed a little less than 50K miles. I'm working on putting some more on it. Love some the other cars posted, they look great. The black targa turbo look in particular is awesome.
05-30-2014, 03:37 PM
#23
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Beautiful car, I love the color. The coupe turbo / turbo look from this era is the quintessential Porsche 911 in my mind. I love the new cars too but as slick as they have gotten, I think this was the peak for Porsche. The one that has come the closest since for me is the 2014 Targa because of the throwback design.
Of course I love the drop-tops too as I wait impatiently to take delivery of mine
If you do decide to sell yours there is an incredible market for the M491. But over the next 10 years your car is likely to beat most index funds in terms of an investment. And you can't drive a mutual fund.
Of course I love the drop-tops too as I wait impatiently to take delivery of mine
If you do decide to sell yours there is an incredible market for the M491. But over the next 10 years your car is likely to beat most index funds in terms of an investment. And you can't drive a mutual fund.
06-01-2014, 02:43 PM
#24
When is it supposed to arrive?
Keep us posted w/ pics when it gets there please!
Keep us posted w/ pics when it gets there please!
06-01-2014, 05:07 PM
#25
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I don't have an estimated arrival date yet. The PPI will happen early this week and I'm not sure the lead time to getting it shipped out here by covered transport. Hopefully soon because the weather around here is finally turning beautiful and I'm missing out on some gorgeous driving days.
06-06-2014, 06:17 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Quick update for those interested. The PPI went great. Super clean car. Compression/leak down tests were great. No signs of any oil leaking ever. There were issues identified (alignment, older tires, AC, etc) but they were all on Holt Motorsports intake sheet and every single identified issue is being fixed as part of the deal. 4 new tires, new top latching motors, AC recharge, blah, blah, blah.
The car will hopefully be picked up next Wednesday and arrive in Seattle around the 18th or 19th. After shopping around for enclosed shipping companies I went with Image Auto Group, a small owner operated company. Very confidence inspiring and seem like straight shooters. No outsourcing/partnering with random drivers either.
Obviously I'm pretty excited that it is all working out so far and I can't wait to get the car. Pictures to follow shortly after...right after I get those rockers swapped
The car will hopefully be picked up next Wednesday and arrive in Seattle around the 18th or 19th. After shopping around for enclosed shipping companies I went with Image Auto Group, a small owner operated company. Very confidence inspiring and seem like straight shooters. No outsourcing/partnering with random drivers either.
Obviously I'm pretty excited that it is all working out so far and I can't wait to get the car. Pictures to follow shortly after...right after I get those rockers swapped
06-06-2014, 07:53 PM
#27
Congrats,
I've had a 3.2 Targa for almost 20 years, and used it as a Daily Driver for many of them. Frankly, if you keep the car over 3,500 RPM, in totally stock form, this car is still faster than any sane person would ever need on the street. You definitely want to preserve this car in as original condition as possible.
But, a few things you can do that will help the car and are totally bolt-on, bolt-off. Just keep all the original pieces.
Headers and a free flow exhaust will definitely add 15-20HP and make the car sound nice, but you lose the cat (so check your state's emission laws), and may lose your heat if the system doesn't have heat exchangers.
If you do the exhaust, adding a DME chip will also increase performance.
I wouldn't mess with the suspension... just make sure everything is up to factory specs, and get a first-class alignment. Even a low mile car is decades old... shocks leak, bushings harden, tie rods bind up. If everything is up to snuff, this car will be fun and exciting to drive.
There are two simple things I would definitely suggest.
The first is to replace the stock steering wheel. Lacking power steering, Porsche put a relatively large diameter stock steering wheel in the car to lower steering effort. Replacing this with a smaller 14-15" MOMO will transform handling. This is a one hour job, and saves the original wheel from wear.
Secondly, the brake and throttle pedals on these cars are not set up for heel-toe downshifts. This resulted when Porsche introduced vacuum assist, but did not change the brake pedals... this a common problem that is easily solved by adding an assist pedal on the throttle.... many are available and these can be replaced in an hour.
Have fun.
I've had a 3.2 Targa for almost 20 years, and used it as a Daily Driver for many of them. Frankly, if you keep the car over 3,500 RPM, in totally stock form, this car is still faster than any sane person would ever need on the street. You definitely want to preserve this car in as original condition as possible.
But, a few things you can do that will help the car and are totally bolt-on, bolt-off. Just keep all the original pieces.
Headers and a free flow exhaust will definitely add 15-20HP and make the car sound nice, but you lose the cat (so check your state's emission laws), and may lose your heat if the system doesn't have heat exchangers.
If you do the exhaust, adding a DME chip will also increase performance.
I wouldn't mess with the suspension... just make sure everything is up to factory specs, and get a first-class alignment. Even a low mile car is decades old... shocks leak, bushings harden, tie rods bind up. If everything is up to snuff, this car will be fun and exciting to drive.
There are two simple things I would definitely suggest.
The first is to replace the stock steering wheel. Lacking power steering, Porsche put a relatively large diameter stock steering wheel in the car to lower steering effort. Replacing this with a smaller 14-15" MOMO will transform handling. This is a one hour job, and saves the original wheel from wear.
Secondly, the brake and throttle pedals on these cars are not set up for heel-toe downshifts. This resulted when Porsche introduced vacuum assist, but did not change the brake pedals... this a common problem that is easily solved by adding an assist pedal on the throttle.... many are available and these can be replaced in an hour.
Have fun.
06-07-2014, 05:34 AM
#28
Nice car with nice wheels! I love wide body cabs and like others mentioned get rid of those rockers! The seats do look like they've been re-covered but it isn't that bad. I personally like the momo prototipo but Nardi also makes some nice steering wheels as well. Which particular model was in your cart?
06-07-2014, 09:19 PM
#29
Instructor
Super. you figured out what is best for you and got it, when there is tight supply out there. And - in time for the perfect driving season.
And on the seat recovering the shift know and seats usually share the same wear, those seats look brand new. Is that passenger seat installed with a slant? The headrest in one of the pics looks a slight bit off.
Our cars look very similar, enjoy-you'll love it
And on the seat recovering the shift know and seats usually share the same wear, those seats look brand new. Is that passenger seat installed with a slant? The headrest in one of the pics looks a slight bit off.
Our cars look very similar, enjoy-you'll love it
Last edited by reachme; 06-07-2014 at 09:36 PM.
06-10-2014, 02:07 AM
#30
Rennlist Member
To the other advice already provided, I would add have the shifter refurbished as necessary. I thought about having a short shifter installed on my 1988 FTL Cab, but my mechanic suggested just having the stock shifter adjusted, new bushings, etc... So glad I didn't mess with it! The G50 is a fine transmission, and although the throws are long, they really work in this car.
Enjoy!
cag4
Enjoy!
cag4
Hi,
Thanks to everyone on this forum for the direct and indirect help as I fumbled my way back to Porsche ownership. There is such a wealth of information on this forum (and Pelican Parts) and it was very useful.
When I started my search I was pretty sure I wanted a 3.2 Targa, similar to the 78 SC Targa I had many years ago. Or a Cabriolet. I naively expected to be sorting through all of my options to find the perfect white on black model out there for a screaming price. I now know the market is very different. Inventory is low and prices are high. So high that I started looking at 930s to expand my options. I love the look of the Turbo but in the end I decided that I didn't want the Turbo engine at this stage. I couldn't find what I was looking for anywhere. Then I saw a reference to Holt Motorsports as a source for high quality cars.
I jumped out of my seat when I found a white/black 3.2 with an authentic factory widebody with less than 50K miles on it. With white wheels. My only issue with the car is the boxed rockers which after seeing in person I will likely choose to replace with standard Turbo rockers. Deposit is down pending a PPI and details for shipping it across the country. Here are some photos:
http://www.holtmotorsports.com/carim...p?vin=171201#0
I know the added cost of the 3.2 M491 widebody cars leaves many people scratching their heads. 3.2 fans will give me grief for paying such a premium. Turbo fans will give me grief as they fly by me for having a poser Porsche For me this isn't a compromise between the two...it's the perfect car for what I want. The aggressive looks, the breaking and the suspension of the Turbo with the 3.2/G50. Sold.
Comments welcome and suggestions on suppliers for the standard rockers much appreciated.
Thanks again,
Jeff
Thanks to everyone on this forum for the direct and indirect help as I fumbled my way back to Porsche ownership. There is such a wealth of information on this forum (and Pelican Parts) and it was very useful.
When I started my search I was pretty sure I wanted a 3.2 Targa, similar to the 78 SC Targa I had many years ago. Or a Cabriolet. I naively expected to be sorting through all of my options to find the perfect white on black model out there for a screaming price. I now know the market is very different. Inventory is low and prices are high. So high that I started looking at 930s to expand my options. I love the look of the Turbo but in the end I decided that I didn't want the Turbo engine at this stage. I couldn't find what I was looking for anywhere. Then I saw a reference to Holt Motorsports as a source for high quality cars.
I jumped out of my seat when I found a white/black 3.2 with an authentic factory widebody with less than 50K miles on it. With white wheels. My only issue with the car is the boxed rockers which after seeing in person I will likely choose to replace with standard Turbo rockers. Deposit is down pending a PPI and details for shipping it across the country. Here are some photos:
http://www.holtmotorsports.com/carim...p?vin=171201#0
I know the added cost of the 3.2 M491 widebody cars leaves many people scratching their heads. 3.2 fans will give me grief for paying such a premium. Turbo fans will give me grief as they fly by me for having a poser Porsche
For me this isn't a compromise between the two...it's the perfect car for what I want. The aggressive looks, the breaking and the suspension of the Turbo with the 3.2/G50. Sold.Comments welcome and suggestions on suppliers for the standard rockers much appreciated.
Thanks again,
Jeff