need help 911 engine/suspension
12-26-2002, 07:30 PM
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need help 911 engine/suspension
I need help choosing which 911 engine and suspension to used in a Porsche 356 replica I am considering to be custom built by Intermeccanica. I don’t have any experience with older Porsches and all I know I have learned by reading over the last two weeks. Any help would be appreciated
Background: This will be a daily driver (no track use) to be used by both my wife and I. My wife has some arthritis and we would like a tiptronic. She thinks she will also need PS and PB, but I have been told they are not necessary in a car this light (about 2,400 lbs.). PS and PB are still a question? We are looking
for a set up that will not just be fast, but will be easy to drive fast i.e great handling but also predictable handling. Previous cars were a 1999 Porsche 996 with tiptronic and 1995 BMW M3. These are the standard which we would like to come close to handling wise. (We also owned a 2000 M roadster that handled like a POS). Performance should be faster than a standard corvette (0-60 less than 5 sec. and top speed at least 170 mph.).
Issues: Engine- Based on power to weight calculations for corvette, I estimate I need a minimum 250 hp. I also want a lot of torque and a wide power band. From what I can tell the “best” engine would be a 993 3.6 engine with Varioram. But I have concerns that this may be more than I need with unnecessary cost , though I was told by someone that all rebuilt 911 engines will cost about the same ($15,000?).The extra cost could come from complicated engine install? From a simplicity standpoint (and possibly budget) I wonder if a 3.2 motronic with upgrades like twin ignition, chip, air flow improvements, performance exhaust would be better? Any thoughts about which approach is most practical? Will a tiptronic hook to the 3,2?Also looking for limited slip.
Suspension: It appears that the 993rear multilink suspension and front and rear coil over is a preferred suspension over the previous trailing arms and torsion bars. But I don’t know yet if this will fit the car (still have to talk to builder ). Can the old suspension be tuned to handle like I want with upgraded torsion bars, sway bars, etc.? I plan to use 17” Boxster wheels with 245 or 255/40 in back and 225/45 in front. I was told that standard mid 80’s Carrera brakes would be adequate for this light car. But I would like ABS and assume that I would need a later set-up for that?
A big concern of ours is the so called “tail happy” nature of the older Porsches. I read that this is not an issue with a properly set up chassis, as long as you stay away from the cars handling limit (then it can bite without warning). If this is the case I don’t have a problem, as we would not be pushing the limit (assuming it has high limits), but is this an issue in emergency handling (i.e. swerving to miss a dog in the road)?
Based on what I am trying to accomplish, what is the most practical from an initial and ongoing cost, reliability, maintenance standpoint? Cost is an issue, if it is too high we will buy a new M3, but sure would like the unique Porsche.Thanks
Steve
Background: This will be a daily driver (no track use) to be used by both my wife and I. My wife has some arthritis and we would like a tiptronic. She thinks she will also need PS and PB, but I have been told they are not necessary in a car this light (about 2,400 lbs.). PS and PB are still a question? We are looking
for a set up that will not just be fast, but will be easy to drive fast i.e great handling but also predictable handling. Previous cars were a 1999 Porsche 996 with tiptronic and 1995 BMW M3. These are the standard which we would like to come close to handling wise. (We also owned a 2000 M roadster that handled like a POS). Performance should be faster than a standard corvette (0-60 less than 5 sec. and top speed at least 170 mph.).
Issues: Engine- Based on power to weight calculations for corvette, I estimate I need a minimum 250 hp. I also want a lot of torque and a wide power band. From what I can tell the “best” engine would be a 993 3.6 engine with Varioram. But I have concerns that this may be more than I need with unnecessary cost , though I was told by someone that all rebuilt 911 engines will cost about the same ($15,000?).The extra cost could come from complicated engine install? From a simplicity standpoint (and possibly budget) I wonder if a 3.2 motronic with upgrades like twin ignition, chip, air flow improvements, performance exhaust would be better? Any thoughts about which approach is most practical? Will a tiptronic hook to the 3,2?Also looking for limited slip.
Suspension: It appears that the 993rear multilink suspension and front and rear coil over is a preferred suspension over the previous trailing arms and torsion bars. But I don’t know yet if this will fit the car (still have to talk to builder ). Can the old suspension be tuned to handle like I want with upgraded torsion bars, sway bars, etc.? I plan to use 17” Boxster wheels with 245 or 255/40 in back and 225/45 in front. I was told that standard mid 80’s Carrera brakes would be adequate for this light car. But I would like ABS and assume that I would need a later set-up for that?
A big concern of ours is the so called “tail happy” nature of the older Porsches. I read that this is not an issue with a properly set up chassis, as long as you stay away from the cars handling limit (then it can bite without warning). If this is the case I don’t have a problem, as we would not be pushing the limit (assuming it has high limits), but is this an issue in emergency handling (i.e. swerving to miss a dog in the road)?
Based on what I am trying to accomplish, what is the most practical from an initial and ongoing cost, reliability, maintenance standpoint? Cost is an issue, if it is too high we will buy a new M3, but sure would like the unique Porsche.Thanks
Steve
12-26-2002, 11:31 PM
#2
Instructor
As I remember, Intermecanicana uses VW Beetle pans for their replica cars. I would love to have the car you are describing but believe it would probably be cost prohibitive to build. In order to use 993 type suspension and a tiptronic transmission or the front end of an older torsion bar 911 a lot of modifications will be required. It would probably be cheaper to have a custom chassis built that incorporated coil over double wishbone suspension such as the suspension used on street rods. retrofitting a VW chassis to accomodate 993 suspension pick-up points and a 3.2 Motronic w/ aTiptronic gear box is going to be a bear to fabricate and I would think would be much more expensive. Without extensive re-enforcement,it it also would not be nearly as rigid as a purpose built custom chassis.
12-27-2002, 12:35 AM
#3
Advanced
Cool idea on the rear, however, I wouldn't use the 993 front. Either stay with the standard or go with the 911 because the 993 front really doesn't work all that well. I've done a bunch of different combination with the 993 and it's a great peice to work with pretty easy to trans plant to most chassis.
Now heres the hard part. The 993 rear is about 3 inches wider on each side compared to a 911 (6 inches over all) I think the brake rotor might stick out past the body work. If you us a 6 cylinder you can't really move the carriers in any closer because they'll hit the engine.
Again, great idea but, lots to consider.
Now heres the hard part. The 993 rear is about 3 inches wider on each side compared to a 911 (6 inches over all) I think the brake rotor might stick out past the body work. If you us a 6 cylinder you can't really move the carriers in any closer because they'll hit the engine.
Again, great idea but, lots to consider.