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I've only observed them at autocrosses. They are close to the same as SC's and Carrera 3.2s, I think, but the driver is so much more significant a variable that I can only tell you that I have a "general impression." Enough of an impression that I have often wanted an M3.
I just sold my e30 m3 and I only went to 1 open track day at Buttonwillow with it. I certainly "felt" faster in every Porsche I've driven or owned, but the e30 is misleading IMO. It doesn't have amazing power, but it corners like a go kart and is a lot of fun to drive. I sold it a little over a month ago and miss it every once in a while...all it takes is a quick spin in the Club Sport to get rid of the that feeling though!
I go to the track about 2 to 3 weekends a month and dice with the usual brace of Corvettes and M3's. I never have much trouble getting by the Corvettes or M3's. But the M3's I am talking about are the later E36 and the new one. But the original 4-cylinder E30 is a different story. Every time I approach one of those that is set up well, I have to turn it up a notch to get by. They are lighter than the newer fat M3's that waste much of their power just moving the extra bulk. The original M3's are more nimble and less forgiving. They aren't dumbed down like the latest BMW and Porsche cars are. They require more skill to drive well since you have to keep the engine on the sweet spot and will bite when driven improperly. In the hands of the wrong driver, they will not seem that fast. In the hands of the right driver I have seen them run rings around the newer M3's.
What is really quick is what some guy I know brigns out to the track once in a while. An 88 Factory BMW team DTM M3 that was driven by Johny Cecotto, Dieter Quester,Roberto Ravaglia, etc... Not only is it an original DTM car, but it is the factory team's championship winning car with all the "who cares what it costs" factory tricks. It is a beautiful car in white with the M stripes and all the original decals. What kills me is that I didn't pick this thing up. When I went to the Barrett Jackson this year, I saw this among a bunch of the usual Detroit stuff that litters that auction. It was the right car at the wrong auction. I knew it would go cheap since this is an auction that caters to redneck tastes. Well it did. When I saw it, I should have registered as a bidder right there and then. Oh well. Some day in the future, when I see one of these go for 6 digit money, I will kick myself. Considering the money it would take to do all the modifications required of a street E30 M3 to get it to this level, factory championship winning level in a brutally competitive series, the car becomes an incredibly good deal. Especially when you consider the collectible value of the car. For you guys that want to see it go to <a href="http://www.barrett-jackson.com/auctionresults/common/cardetail.asp?id=169463" target="_blank">www.barrett-jackson.com/auctionresults/common/cardetail.asp?id=169463</a>
I am pretty sure that the new owner of the car is Ron Checca. I saw it for sale on his website for quite a bit more than he paid for it. This was a couple months ago when I still had mine.
The guys at Bullet Performance in Huntington Beach CA set up one of the most tricked out e30 m3's I have ever seen. It was at willow springs about a month ago and I am sure it smoked a lot of Porsches
We have a well sorted 88 M3 running in our group at Circuit Mont Tremblant and Mosport and the lap times are similar to my SP2 944, sometimes he’s quicker by
one second , sometimes it’s me ... all depends on who’s got the fresher tires at the time.
Seems like he has less mechanical issues than my Porsche and parts are readily available for those cars !
Owned a e36 M3 and tracked it often and recently hopped in a friends race spec e30 M3 on track with the newer e46 motor swap and it was a freaking blast. Way more inviting to throw around the handling was very balanced and predictable where as the rear engine 997 can be a handful at speed or it is for me at least. Cant go wrong with either choice but the BMW will be a little more forgiving. GL
i have done several DEs in an e30 M3 and took a couple local BMW CCA autox championships in one. back when i owned mine, an e30 M3 would usually take FTD at our autoxes. we had several talented drivers in them. very neutral handling, but easy to rotate on the tighter courses. on the track, they handle extremely well but they're obviously a momentum car. after running the M3 on the track, i moved to an e30 325is and that became my SCCA ITS car. great fun and quick, when set up properly. a properly set up M3 is made for the track and should be able to handle any SC/carrera with comparable drivers.
I've never driven an e30 on the track (but I had 4 of them) and I've driven many other cars on the track.
I think the e30 M3 is fun and back in the day mystical, but today is perhaps the most overrated drive out there. It is downright boring and slow today especially for the money they command. Sure there is about 1k in the rpm band which seems perky and if you stiffen them up and live near some mountains you hardly have to brake.
There is a lot more going on with a 911 of same vintage.
I bought a new ‘88 M3 and a year later I wrecked it at PIR; oversteered hit the barrier and the rest is history. most of these cars have been hit along the way. In 1989 I went out and bought another left over, see photo. Two car loans early in marriage, I am amazed that my wife let me do it.
yes, they are peaky, have no torque, and the shifter buzzes like a foodmixer at high rpm, but every time I drive mine after 33 years I still love it! They are not over rated, just different. I have tracked plenty of new/old Porsches and don’t claim to be an expert and they are just different. I love the E30 M3.
07-04-2002, 05:43 PM
E30 M3 at the Track
