STRSHP

Apologies to those of you who have been helping me on the Pelican Parts site. But I am obsessed today and reaching out to several forums. For those folks, move on, for the Rennlisters who have not seen this, I am looking for some help.

Looking at 2 cars, both white Carrera's done in very different ways. There is a 69 912 body that has a 3.2l installed. Engine and trans was sourced from LA Dismantlers with 47k miles. Leak down test done by them and again by the shop that received the motor. An SC suspension and brake set up has been added with all new shocks. Mechanically the car seems an 8 to 8.5 (since I do not know the history of the motor, I cannot give it any higher marks). No heat exchangers, therefore no heat given the long tube headers. An SC muffler is installed, with a second outlet for better flow. The exterior has steel RS flares welded in, but the paint is dull. Probably will come back with some elbow grease. The interior is a 4 to 5. Lower dash needs complete restoration, upper seems good. Gauges need refurb, clock is inoperative. Has Recaro RS seats. Guy hauled his dog around, so it needs a fulll interior clean out. All in all a great runner, good sound, and the shop that has done the work is allied with The Racer's Group. Clearly they know Porsches.

The 72 is absolutely pristeen. 2.7l MFI motor 915 trans. There is not a spec of dirt anywhere on this car including fender wells, deep inside the door jambs, etc. Anywhere you can see, the paint is perfect and it is clean. It comes with factory RS bits, like the gas tank and the tail. Has racing shell seats which in my view need replaced. Composite bushings recently installed. All in all, as perfect as you can get. Seems to have been done like a master would copy a Monet, perfect, but a copy.

Here is the issue. The guy wants $90k for the 72. Best value I can see is less than $50k. But besides the seats (personal preference), the car needs nothing. However, the 72 is really just a 911T with RS bits. The 69 is listed for $25k and needs the help I mentioned. That car will always be a hot rod 912, nothing more or less.

Thoughts Rennlisters?

ivangene

pics of both?

so I understand, you are looking at a clone for $90k or a FankenPorsche for $25k ?

STRSHP

yep, you have captured the idea in very few words. Pics here, page 2 about half way down
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...e-value-2.html

ivangene

damn, I need a new keyboard from all the drewling I just did....


anyhow that 72' is a swet looking ride - not that the other isnt. I think in the end either car will inspire you to make changes since neither is original. So in that case starting with less out of pocket leaves more room for you to tinker with it.... if that makes sense

wpriller

I think that's crazy, would you pay $90k for a clone, I think $50k is high for a car that is not original, and it being a 911T on top of that. You could find an early S, original and in excellent shape when you're talking over 50k IMO.

500

The '72 sounds like it has terrific execution, but is simply overpriced.

The way I view the other car is that it is mechanically a de-contented 3.2. Only you don't get the galvanized body. You can get a very nice 3.2 for that money, or you can get a decent 3.2 and back date it for that money. Either car, in my view, is a better proposition than the '69.

joseph mitro

sounds like both cars are way overpriced IMHO.

the 912 being a "912" wouldn't mean squat to me, except IMHO it's not worth what the owner is asking, and the resale value won't be there either simply due to something as minute as having the "wrong" VIN

mclaudio

If you're willing to spend $90K on an early 911, would you consider an authentic 911S? Otherwise, I would prefer the 2.7MFI RS clone but at a much lower price i.e. below $50K.

What's your goal with the car? Race? Track? Street rides/rally? Show? Add to collection?

Minoclan

+1 million.

I purchased a 70 "RS" clone with a 3.2 and a 915 trans for $16K three years ago. It really was in perfect shape except for the rust in the front that cost me $5K to repair. I have done a lot of suspension work (thanks Ira and Chuck) to the car, but that was my choice. I now have about $45K in the car and it still is worth about $20-25K. If I ever decided to sell it the problem is that the purists don't want it, and the RS guys could care less about the car. I love it and probably will never sell it so the value is irrelevant to me. You are looking at TOP dollar for both cars and as mclaudio said above you have to decide why you want the car. Here is what I use it for.

STRSHP

You guys are asking the questions I have struggled with. Living in NoCal, I would use the car for wine country runs, weekend fun, & with a budget 3 to4 track days a year. The full breadth of options I am considering are; 04 GT3' 07 Twin Turbo & old school rides like the two I found. Another option clearly is building a hot rod myself. Agree w/ all who say these cars are overpriced. My gut tells me the 69 is worth high teens. Good starting point as Minoclan notes, but always worth only the investment to me. The 72 might be high 30's.

Think I will welcome in the new year & think a bit more on it. But having sold my 99 I am without Porsche $
& in a bit of withdrawal

Happy new year to all

ivangene

having come from a 99' myself, I think you should drive the 04' and 07' to rule them in or out - those are easy to find...myself, I have gone the way I wanted to (older) and I dont think I will be back in a newer one - though obviously way more refined and way faster they are also way heavier and way bigger. (even than your 99')

mclaudio

Based on your reply i.e. ex-99 P owner, track days, wine country runs, weekend fun, I would either vote for an 04 GT3 or a nice early 911E (similar price point as an 04 GT3). Both cars should hold their value reasonably well going forward and are highly regarded by a lot of P enthusiasts.

The choice between the two depends on your comfort level needs. For Sonoma/Napa wine country runs, a good ac would be nice. Besides, you may likely have a passenger who would appreciate more comfort. I lived in Sonoma for 10 months to race at Sears Point (Infineon) in Sonoma. I was driving a 911SC at that time and frequently wished I had a better ac while driving around Sonoma and Napa during the summer.

ivangene

I think the newer car could also spend more time on the road as older cars (not all but some) require more frequent tweaks to keep them going. If its a carburated car then you also have to deal with changing weather as they can be a bit tempermental at times. The newer car is just get in and go... less worries (IMO)

Daniel Dudley

I really like the idea of the clone, but you would take a bath if you decided to sell. People with nice cars tend to hold back at this time of year, waiting for spring and higher prices. You can always make an offer on the 72. Nothing to lose there.

Just wait. What you want will come along. Be vigilant and ready. Lots of nice cars go within 24 hours.

Minoclan

Having also had a GT3, i found it a bit rough for the pleasure runs. The value is very iffy with these cars. Lots of volatility in the price. It was fine on the track but then again if you can't afford to ball it up and walk away, don't track it.

I ended up buying a 997 C2S cab for the weekends (see my avatar). Great power, comfortable as hell, hit sport mode and it is a different car. I will always have a newer cab for the weekends.

I wouldn't build anything. There are too many track cars that always trade at deep discounts.