gtapp

What are the advantages and/or disadvantages of a Euro mid 80's 911 vs it's US counterpart?

Rick K

I have an 84 Euro coupe - positives of these cars are a higher compression engine (231HP vs 207 '84-86 or 217 '87-on), side markers, smaller rear bumperettes and prob some other stuff I'm forgetting.

Not sure exactly how all these cars were delivered (mine, for example, had the US sugar scoops vs H4s - I assume to pass any grey market car inspection off the boat).

The only potential disadvantage would be emissions (especially if you're in Cali as your avatar says - but others can chime in here). Euro cars didn't have catalytic converters, just Euro Catbypass (which mine had) which could make passing inspection trouble. My car had some funky aftermarket technology plugged into the brain/ECU when I first bought it - it made the car run like ****, but it passed inspection w/o the cat present (they don't do visual inspections in good ole' Virginny if you know where to go). As soon as I got that inspection, my car was then exempt (25 years is the mark in VA) and I ripped that thing out, put in a SW chip, and it was like the car was truly re-born.

racer

Advantages to the Euro are, typically, lighter weight (cars came with fewer standard features/options than US cars) and slight HP improvements.

As mentioned, emissions can be one area of concern- need to check your states rules on that. Another would be undisclosed body damage (accidents) and rust. The europeans tend to actually drive their 911s year round, even when not in sunny climates . Other issues could be quyality/thouroughness of US/DOT conversions to get the car in properly.

You didn't mention if you were looking to buy/own one already in the states or importing your own.

Back in the 1980s, dealers were "penalized" for providing services on Euro cars... hence "gray market" moniker for such cars.

nikkoa

I also have ROW (rest of the world) 911, as mentioned above the higher compression can add horsepower etC. The side markers are cooler

A few things to keep in mind

- less mechanics know the fine adjustments of the ROW models. Timing is slightly different etC.
- insuring can be a pain in the *** (few companies cover grey market cars)

dave morris

I think the Euro 911 was less likely to have the sunroof.

Rick K

Great point - mine was already in the states, so I didn't have issues there...

g-50cab

true euro cars also have the built in cooler for the 915 transmission too.

Chris M.

I bought mine from a guy in CA, and it still has the sticker from when it passed emissions there. He had a USA cat on it instead of the factory euro premuffler (I have both if anybody needs one) and the CO had been set to zero, AKA no power. It's not, uh, set there anymore...

Derrick B.

Another RoW owner here. Passed VA tailpipe emissions with stock chip and no cat. I really like the smaller bumperettes and side markers. More power is a bonus. It does have a sunroof.

Bill Verburg

It would depend on the year of manufacture and the rules by which the cars were imported.

From '84-89 there was a non cat 231hp engine, 911.20 but from '87 there was also a RoW cat engine which made more tha US but less than the 231hp engine.

The most popular way to get them in back then was under the one time personal exemption rule which allowed a car to be brought in w/o conforming to EPA regs(the exemption) but all of them had to conform to DoT regs wrt, glass, lights & impact

Only the 231hp cars using 915 got the trans coolers

Helios59

Mine's a German-market '86 that came from the factory with the North American lower-compression engine and cats.

European delivery, I suppose. It was imported into Miami in 1986.

Smaller bumperettes, side markers, and rear fog lights.

UberXY

I had an 85 ZZZ, whale tail, no sunroof, Blaupunkt with voice in German. I had minor trouble with the DMV even though the car had been in the US for 8 years and minor trouble with State Farm, but all easily fixed. I put an aftermarket cat on and passed the rolling dyno emissions test in northern Virginia with flying colors. Only real advantages I saw to the car were the nice sidemarker lights on the front fenders and slightly lower rear end. I wouldn't import one, but I wouldn't turn down a nice one that had been already titled somewhere in the US.

THECARREAPER

i had a moss green special wishes 84 911 carrera coupe that i now miss that was a euro. had the 915, with cooler, a huge gold trombone oil cooler, and it was a blast to drive. sold it to a friend who ran it into the ground. it sits behind his house, and he wont sell it, or fix it. i have no emissions or inspections where i live. Hagerty never seemed to care about the euro vin. car had a clean clear title on it, and still does.

i just bought a clean 85 targa from a Pelican member, because i missed having a 3.2 so much. i was looking for a euro 911 or 930 for some time, and gave up. many of my Ferrari's and Lamborghini's have been true euro spec cars. i like he cleaner lines,a nd less weight / clutter on the cars.

misterbeverlyhills

I had a special order Euro 231 HP rocket, serviced by Peter Zimmerman at Redline. Great Purple color (not Prussian Blue) fully loaded navy interior with sportseats, tail, smaller bumperettes, one of the best 911s I have ever driven, babies forced sale.

In CA you will need ALL the DOT/EPA paperwork when you register, if you don't have it don't buy it. You will need to go to a referee station for smog and inspections every 2 years.

They are great cars IF they were federalized correctly but 99% were not; think Tom Cruise in Rainman. Peter Z tells me he has seen such outright butchery on cars that they wouldn't pass his PPI and that is the second problem, who knows enough other than someone like Pete to see if the conversion was done in an acceptable manner, not too many shops have that kind of experience.

Insurance was no problem through AAA and the car ran flawlessly on pump gas but no kidding, if you do not have the original fed paperwork RUN DON'T WALK FROM THE CAR.

You can add bumperettes (74 Carerra style) lower to Euro ride height and add the 7&8s most Euros come with and a Steve Wong chip to have the same basic car for a lot less than trying to fix a badly converted car or missing paperwork.

Or you can give up on the 3.2s like I did and buy a total sleeper like the 964 and have better everything for less money!

FranzBlamRacing

The fuel distributor heads are superior in the Euro cars, as well.