rberry951

Over the past couple of weeks I've been toying with the idea of a gas mileage chip. This would be geared toward people who drive their cars daily, but don't modify them for performance. The basic premis is you will indeed sacrifice a little bit of timing, but I can tune the chip to run 87 octane fuel, and get better mileage on it. Since 87 is 20-50 cents per gallon cheaper, you are assured a 30-35% overall fuel cost savings. This could also be coupled with the new Multi-board to have multiple maps, stock map for your performance and emission days, gas mileage map for round town driving, and/or any variation of the two elsewhere since you can have up to eithe maps.

Just trying to find out if anyone is interested in this, if so, I will build it, if not, I won't. It's up to you guys...

Regards,
Russell

Amber Gramps

Russ, I'm beginning to think that your chip I already have has allowed me to stop using gas all togeather. My wife says it runs so well it is giving her whiplash and my high octane provider says I never come and visit anymore. So, I'm left to think you have already given me a chip that gives killer performance and great gas milage all in one package.....How can you possibly improve things?

rberry951

The performance chips usually do increase fuel mileage because the stock chips run quite rich. Part of the tuning of the performance chip you have is working on true proper AFR for the engine based on the fuel you are using, so if you're using high octane fuel on my performance chips, you will indeed get better gas mileage, unless of course you enjoy the new found performance so much you drive every where with your foot to the floor...

I still need to send you the new AFM chip. After I did the MAF kit I put my AFM back on and have continued to tweak minor things when I encounter an area I feel I can improve upon. This chip I'm running now isn't much different from yours, just a few minor fueling changes and the idle cleaned up a little bit.

Here's an interesting fact. I wrestled with the cold start cycling these cars all seem to do, like it's hunting to find idle for a few minutes. I was able to map most of it out, but then one day I had changed nothing and I noticed the cycling was gone completely. Puzzled, I started checking everything out and found that I had left my oil cap off. Put the oil cap on and the cycling came back. I was talking to Sal about this, he says there is indeed a crankcase vent that goes back into the induction system. I think this venting system is causing the problem, and I'm going to reroute mine and see if it fixes it. When I do I'll post my results and method used to re route the vent.

Regards,
Russell

Amber Gramps

Remember my hard start issue? I have found that if I leave the key in the on position for 5 seconds or so before I hit the starter it fires right up. I'm beginning to think I may have a weak fuel pump or a soft fuel preshure regulator.

BTW...Did you hear I got a 71 PPM on my recent smog check? I got that at 25 mph in second gear with NO CAT and with your chip.

jakeflyer

Sounds like a good idea. As an SC owner, I would consider a Carrera upgrade if there was a gain in mpg. Not sure I would want to use regular considering the safety net of premium if there was a system failure.

I would be very interested to hear from STEVE and PETER regarding this idea.

rberry951

When I first got mine it had a stock chip in it, I had to drive it around for an hour before I could get it to pass. To date, I have not heard of anyone failing emissions with my chips.

Amber Gramps

To respond to the PM's click on the: http://www.maxhpkit.com/ in his signature and you will find his website.

(it was maxhpkit not maxhpchip)

rnln

Hi Russell, Doug,

I have read discussions between Steve Wong and some other people about the basic logic of performance chip, safty marginal, etc on SW chip. I am looking for similar information.

I went to http://www.maxhpkit.com/ site and went into the MAXhpkit Forums area but didn't find much information. Is there a thread on this or other discussion board where people post their results and/or discuss their experiences on these chip?

Regarding this chip, when you said "I can tune the chip to run 87 octane fuel", do you mean you take care of the "early detonation" issue people have been talking about on this and PP board? How about performance, how much power are we loosing compare to stock chip, or your performance chip?

Thanks.

rberry951

There have been a few posts on here and PP regarding my performance chips for the 911, but you will find much more in the 944 world, as that is where I started. You won't find any discussion about my 'mileage' chip because I haven't created it, but I can do it in a day. I've been coding for a long time, I'm not a new comer to the chip programming scene, just new to the 911 community.

To program a chip to run 87 octane fuel is a simple task really, dropping 2-4 degrees of timing in various parts of the part throttle and WOT maps. I would also lean out most areas of both, as well as idle, and this combination of changes would give better mileage on any fuel, plus allow you to run 87. You will suffer a power loss, that's part of the deal. Having said that, my performance chip customers claim better gas mileage. The reason for that is part of the performance tuning involves quite a bit of leaning.

Let me address something here. In my experience with the 3.2L 911 I made more power both on the street and on the dyno by manipulating AFR than I could by 'just' advancing timing. These engines don't benefit that much from timing advance compared to the 2.5L 944 variants, these engines respond better to proper AFR. When I say proper AFR, I don't mean 12.5-13.0 across the board. In fact there's been so much talk about 'flat AFRs' that I find it amusing in some of the threads I've read, even from respected vendors. I have found that a 'flat AFR' on a dyno or street, is NOT optimal. There are parts of the power band that respond better to different AFRs. I can actually pull stock timing back in certain areas of the maps and lean the AFR out to 13.4 and make more power than if I ran it at 12.5 with 2 more degrees of timing. And I'll be happy to discuss my techniques at length with anyone. Ask Doug or Sal.

I've said this before and I'll say it again, I didn't enter these 'markets' as a vendor, I entered the communities as an enthusiast just as yourselves. I started racing 951s 5 years ago, didn't like the performance of the chips available, and coupled my mechanical and computer expertise to create my own. In that market I have over 600 happy customers. In every market I bring a quality product at a competitive price, and I have developed tuning tools no one else has offered, as well as even sharing those tools with other vendors, including my competitors. I'm not in this to get rich, I'm in this to go fast and provide you the same experience I seek. As far as the 'mileage' chip, it's not just for 911s, it's for any car in the Porsche community I have products for, or will have in the future. I'm going to provide the same quality products for the 968, and 928 communities. When I'm done with Porsche models, I'll be moving on to BMW, Audi, Volvo, VW, etc. I'm in this for the long haul, this is what I'm going to do with the rest of my life is develop performance products for our cars.

When I have an idea like the mileage chip, I offer the idea to the community and see if the overall response makes the idea feasible for the product development phase. If it does, I'll bring it out. I also tend to couple product introductions. With this idea I envision a multi-board purchase (allows you to switch between 8 maps or chip images) where you could have a stock image, an 'economy' or 'mileage' image, and a performance image. Where the end user can tailor their driving experience to their needs on the fly.

Again, my emphasis is on developing quality products that will benefit the communities I serve.

And I wish you all a great 4th of July holiday weekend!

Regards,
Russell

rnln

wow, that nice. Do you have a general picture of how to do this yet? A set of 3 chips, or a software program which user can have on their laptop to reload/remap them on the fly?

Amber Gramps

Russell, I'm still scratching my head at the thought of an econo-chip. It just sounds backwards to me. It's a Porsche. It's purpose is to turn heads and snap necks. It isn't for saving money. For example...I get in my car and go to San Diego on a whim. First it's $10.00 at the car wash, $40.00 at chevron for 91 octane, then $40.00 at VPRacing for 100 octane, then $7.00 on the tole roads and $60.00 for dinner in Carlsbad. An econo chip that de-tunes the car is so not in that picture. I have sore neck muscles after a drive in my car. I have to remember that 100 MPH on the onramp quickly turns into 120 just a fiew seconds later and if cought, the car is gone. Your current chip is neck snapping, law breaking, clutch smokin', fun that you don't need to mess with. All you need to do is get the word out how strong the lower RPM's are. The car is "ON BOOST" at 1,500 RPM's all the way to 7,000. The 1,500 to3,000 range that your chip adds is where most driving is done anyway so you have made all driving fun. Drop the clutch and hold on. In other words, I love your current chip.

rberry951

For that type of functionality I created the Maxtronic system, which is comprised of the Ostrich chip emulator by Moates.net, coupled with my Maxtune software I wrote myself. This allows you to tune the car on the fly, on a dyno, street, whatever. It is a very powerful tuning tool and what I use for all of my development.

The multi-board is a very simple device, it's simply an adapter board with a newer, higher capacity chip in place, that can hold up to 8 chip images, selectable by a DIP switch. If you want to make the chips yourself using either my images, stock, other vendor, whatever. You will need the image stacker program I've created. This program will be a free download, so if your chip vendor is someone else, like Steve Wong, you can tell them what you want, they can download the program and create the image, and burn your chip for you. Here's a crude cell phone pic of the board itself.

Amber Gramps

Could that DIP switch be put on a cable that is outside the DME box so you don't have to take the box out every time you want to switch modes?

rberry951

Yes, the board in the picture is the first prototype, other versions will have a right-angle mount DIP switch that you can get to by opening the computer, but not having to separate the boards to get to it, and yet another version will have the switch hanging outside the DME computer for easy access.

Regards,
Russell

Amber Gramps

So, I could use your equipment (board, switch, and chip) to find out someone else's chip program is better for my car that your chip program? That's gotta hurt. What I'm saying and what I think you are saying is I could stack different programs into the same car and test them all one after another to find the one that best fits me and my car. that one could be yours or it could be Steve Wongs, or anyone's. I see real world aplication for this. a car that is a daily driver and goes to autocross. Sweet.