WJV

I am looking to upgrade the muffler on my '89 911. I am currently running a euro premuffler with the stock muffler. The possible muffler choices include B&B, GHL, Fabspeed, Monty, Dansk, etc. Any opinions? I am looking for a little extra power as well as a deeper exhaust note. I know this issue has practically been beaten to death in one form or another, however, I rarely see opinions regarding the vast selection of mufflers available. The discussion is generally limited to one or two specific brands. I appreciate the time.
-Bill

John D.

Hi Bill,

I installed a GHL when I rebuilt my 3.2 earlier this year. So far - I really like it... Sounds terrific..!!! You can see it here:

<a href="http://gallery.rennlist.com/gallery/album95" target="_blank">http://gallery.rennlist.com/gallery/album95</a> - click on the sub-album "The GHL Header/Muffler arrives...."..

HTH...

smoak

Bill, I have the Dansk euro premuffler and also purchased the Dansk sport muffler from Steve at Pelican. I actually got the non-ss version, I think its called the aluminzed (its painted black) sport muffler. Its $350. It supposedly has the same guts as the SS expensive one. A matter of taste, but you really cant see the muffler anyway. Cost was my factor and I didnt feel the need for SS. But thats just my deal. Good luck.

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Hi Bill:

LOL,..As you can see, a dozen people might offer a dozen different opinions.

We have had excellent success here with Monty Mufflers.

First-rate construction (304 SS) and materials, very nice sound level without being intrusive in the cabin, excellent fit and appearance, great power, and a lifetime warranty.

I use what works best for us and generates the fewest comebacks.

Hope this helps; ultimately you should try to see and listen to as many as possible and not be affected by the dollars involved. You will live with this decision for a while,....

LTan

I was told that if you only change the muffler to stainless, then you get the great sound, but if you want the extra power, then you need the headers as well. True?

How much extra power do you expect to get, and will you feel it? I still have my originals, and the mechanic says they will never wear out(stainless?), so I should go ahead an change to Monty's if I want to. Monty's are very popular here, but are about US$2.5K for headers/ mufflers !!! Worth it?

Leong
85 Carrera

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Leong:

A good sport muffler like the Monty adds modest power on the 3.2's, but the biggest gains come from using a 3-into-1 header or heater exchanger system AND that the sport muffler.

The OEM Carrera 3.2 heat exchanger design was not optimized for power; it was intended for emissions compliance and using the SSI or a header system (1 5/8") is much better than the OEM system. Combined with a dual in, dual out muffler, that presents the biggest potential power gains from an exhaust upgrade.

All things being equal, SSI's and the Monty muffler adds around 15-18 HP to an otherwise stock Carrera. A set of 1 5/8" headers will do even better, overall. Make sure than any system you might buy has the oxy sensor bung on that left side.

Whether its worth it is truly dependent on your budget and your power objectives. Certainly, its one of the prerequistes to getting measurable HP from these engines.

Lorenfb

Besides performance, you need to consider whether
the new exhaust will affect your emissions test
because its been altered.

Good luck
Lorenfb
Systemsc.com

WJV

Steve, thanks for your input. Do you and/or your customers use B&B at all? Does the Monty compare favorably to the B&B in performance and sound? Thanks again.
-Bill

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Hi Bill:

I avoid B&B's except for 930's, due to all the complaints from interior droning and cracking problems over the past 12 years.

Since I lose money whenever I must take something back or repair it, I no longer sell nor offer B&B exhausts, except for Turbo's.

Carrera51

WJV:
My father has a full B&B (headers with heat and a dual in/out muffler). The system has been on his 964 C2 since 1998. He hasn't experienced any cracking of the muffler as some have reported here (maybe just luck of the draw). He has had the muffler straps that came with it break, which he replaced with Porsche parts and hasn't had a problem since.

It does drone between 2000 to 2800 RPM so for cruising, it can get on your nerves. Since he doesn't drive it on the street very much, he doesn't mind the droning. Having driven the car on the track on numerous occasions, I can say that my "seat of the pants dyno" noticed a significant improvement in performance over how the car ran with the stock 964 exhaust, which I hear is very restrictive.

No affiliation with B&B.

alessandrini

I have to agree with smoak, I used a fabspeed euro pre-muff and a dansk aluminized and have no droning sound, it is much better sounding than stock and I picked up some great power. It also fit like a glove and was easy to install. The 70mm tip looks large against the stock unit and I get 26.6 MPG on the highway.

Ed Bighi

I have tried almost all exhaust systems. And after trying so many different mufflers, I only like two of them. Monty and Dansk. The beauty of Dansk is it's original style body which has a factory fit. It is something worthy of a Porsche part number. The Dansk should be very long lived. The beauty of Monty is it's next to perfect sound when used with either a pre muffler or cat bypass. I ran a 4 inch outlet one with a bypass alone and never had any muffler or header/muffler combo that sounded as good. And just like everything that is produced in no-nonsense Oceania, is of top notch quality. It also has a beautiful rounded body. I really like the unit made for the 3.2 and recommend the same unit for the SC instead of the SC unit since I prefer the look of the outlet coming horizontally. Can't go wrong with either Dansk or Monty.

As far as droning on B&B, it can be bad or very bad. And I won't even get into cracks. Just a muffler alone can be bad, but if using the entire exhaust system, it can get real bad. I have a friend whose SC, with B&B headers/muffler, gives me a headache if I sit behind it for long while at idle. Worse than any year RSR with no silencing whatsoever. I have a gutted factory muffler in mine which drones less, if at all. Even though it is two to three times louder above 4,000 rpm. After the money spent, you have to think about the sense of putting up with that kind of drone. Besides, I have never seen any car you pass the weekend before, suddenly pass you hard the next from an exhaust change alone.

jet911

Has anyone used Fabspeed's mufflers, single or dual outlet? They claim increased HP with no resonance or vibration (at least in dual outlet). How about Fabspeed's muffler and Euro-Premuffler Cat bypass pipe. They claim quite a bit of HP increase. Also has anyone used their Cup Performance Air Box - Claiming up to 8 HP increase. Thinking of an upgrade on my '86 Carrera.
Thanks!

greglepore

Can anyone explain how one "guts" a factory muffler? I keep seeing references to this. How do you split the muffler body and reassemble?

Stuttgart951

Jet, Im looking into Fabspeed right now, they are right down the road from me.

From what Ive heard, I think the sound is the best of all the brands, at least for what Im looking for. Its not a rumbling muscle car sound, and its not an annoying drone - I can describe it as a "raspy metallic" 'Porsche' sound. Low and subdued at idle, and screaming at WOT.

They have a package for 3.2L Carrera for around $1500 that includes a cat bypass pipe, a single in, duel out muffler, and custom burned software. They claim 28HP at the wheels after this "kit" IIRC.

Hopefully Ill get down to business and get everything sorted out in a mont or so and give my impressions.