vinoviva

As the owner of two (coupe and cabrio) '89 3.2 911's, I have wrestled with the idea of slight modifications. Problem is, both are very low mileage pure stock examples in concourse condition. I just couldn't bring myself to modify either of these cars. My solution--I spend a very long time looking for an exceptional third car to modify. Finally located a pristine '88 Coupe that met my requirements (sunroof delete). Pure stock as well, but with 100K miles.

I decided to bite the bullet and do it right. Off the car went to Jerry Woods Enterprises for a complete engine/ trans rebuild, as well as a complete new suspension. My goal was a top of the line car to track as PCA F stock.

After six months and several thousand $$$, Voila! Absolutely unbelieveable.
The total transformation exceeded my expectations in all respects. Thanks to Rich Walton and the guys at Jerry Woods and Smart Racing Products for an unbelieveable job. I got the car back last week and haven't been able to get the smile off my face since! If you have the bucks-these guys are the best!

good hands

pictures ?

vinoviva

Due up shortly.

Luus

Must have pics

spence88mph

and details of what was done....

good hands

i feel like i am struggling with the same problem. i tracked my 99 cab this year and caught the DE bug real bad. since i didn't want to wrap it into a tire wall i reaquired an 88 911 with the intension of turning it into my track car. I took it into my mechanic who said, and I quote " This car is too clean and nice to turn into a track car ". FIrst DE is in March so i guess i have about 2 months to do something. Funny thing is i may have it all backwards. The 88 seems to be appreciating and the 996 is depreciating. Maybe i should get a 944 already set up for the track ?

Jay H

Slowly but surely, we're going to see these very nice, low mileage older 911's start to really stabilize in depreciation and then most likely start an upward trend in value as they get older. Look what's happening to the long hood cars. It won't happen overnight, but I bet it'll happen to the SC's and Carrera's too.

Each year, we lose a few to crashes, more miles get put on them and some get turned into track cars (as this thread is debating).

When I bought my '90 964 back in 2000, you couldn't give away a 964, especially an early one like mine. However, in the right season of the year, I could probably sell my car in a weekend with the right pricing. I've been approached several times with very reasonably (well, down right good) offers for my car. That's got to tell you that there are definitely buyers out there that want a very clean, concours condition, low mileage 911 and they will pay the premium for it.

Let's face it, the money we have stuck in our cars would be much better sitting in a money market account or a CD (certificate of deposit) or maybe in the stock market if you like some risk. But if we must keep these Garage Queen type cars in our garages, keeping them mint and bone stock with reasonable mileage is probably the best way to hold some value yet and the only way that they will appreciate in value.

However, I'm still gonna drive the wheels off my '84 911 with 95k on the clock. These types of cars are great for driving since they aren't worth all that much anymore due to mileage and wear and tear.

Just my $.02

Jay
90 964, 84 3.2

Porsche Newbie

speaking of older 911's.. I buy the Auto Trader every few weeks for grins to see what is out there and how much ect.. I havent seen a decent 911 Coupe ('78-'85) in months! The relativley few that are listed have been modified and usually horribly with either re-dick body kits or horrible wheels or both.

Local Porsche- one man operation car lot..I stop by to see what he has now and again.. and he doesnt have the coupe's like he used to either. I dont know if guys are hanging onto them now or what but around here they seem to be "not for sale" more than they used to..

Mike Murphy

Jay, your $.02 is worth a lot more than that, IMO, based on what I've ready from you...

Scott, I can appreciate you not wanting to mod your car. My car is completely stock, but what I really love about these cars is that you can daily drive them and then take them to the track and they will still perform. Additionally, most pro drivers will tell you that you can be fast with a stock car. I've seen footage of a Honda beating a Carrera GT or a stock SC closely following a 996TT.

To combat the value issue, I just bought a high-mileage car (117,000). The car is very clean, but the car won't go down too much if I put another 20,000 miles on it.

A 944 is a great car. My driving instructor runs with a 944S.

GothingNC

What's the point of having a Porsche if your're not going to drive it in the way it was intended, hard & fast

John

Jay H

John,

Point well taken. However, keep in mind that different people enjoy cars for different reasons. I thoroughly enjoy leaving my 964 in the garage and just simply detailing it and competing with it at concours. That's my cup of tea. The car is just too nice to take it out and beat it up in daily driving conditions. It would literally take me years of searching to find another Baltic Blue over Silk C2 coupe with low miles. So, I choose to enjoy it in other ways than driving. Is that wrong?

I know one guy that concours' his '85 Turbo and puts about 80 miles per year on his car. He LOVES his car and enjoys every minute of it. I bet he knows more about that car than most Porsche people and the car is never driven.

However, I missed driving 911's as well and have been very fortunate in life to be able to pick up a second 911 that I can drive pretty much anywhere and not worry too much. It's a "beater" '84 coupe that is a hoot to drive. She's not all that pretty and won't win any concours, but she's good enough for goin' to work, stacking groceries in the back, taking the kids to Tae Kwon Do or school and flogging on back roads.

The world of collector cars is a completely different world as well. I've talked extensively with some of these guys that strictly collect Porsches and trade them like you would a vintage baseball card. All they care about is extremely low mileage, solid history and an overall excellent condition. Many times, we as the "general public" won't ever see these cars on the road since these cars are rarely driven.

So, to condem someone for having a car just sitting in a garage would be the same as for me to condem someone who strips out the guts of a Porsche, bolts in a bunch of aftermarket stuff and flogs it on a track. Even though I'm not a track junky and don't enjoy taking my cars out on the track, I'd never criticize anyone for doing that. Everyone has their focus and remember "to each his own". We're all enjoying these cars in different ways.

No flames intended!

Jay
90 964, 84 3.2

Jay H

Murphy, thank you for the kind words. Keep in mind that I'm no expert, just an idiot that observes a lot in the 911 world over the internet... I'll still argue that my typing is only worth $.02...!

Regards,

Jay

Jay H

...I think I might be exceeding my limit of allowable posts in one thread... but...here goes again...

I've got to agree about the limited number of older coupes around. I watch Pelican's site, AutoTrader, a lot of high end dealers and other stuff almost daily for cars and there are slim pickin's in the SC to early ('84-'86) Carrera coupes.

I too think the time of year is affecting the market. Most of the rust belt guys (and gals) put their cars away in the October to November time frame. We here in the snow know that it's a lousy time to sell a sports car, so if we wanna move 'em, we'll do it in August or September while it's still warm or wait until March before getting them out of storage to be sold. That limits the market and the available cars.

Good thread...! Sorry for all the rambling and pushing this thing a bit OT...

Jay

GothingNC

Jay,

No offense taken

Thank you for givng me the perspective of how a collector's perspective of Porsche ownership.
I'm sure if my Targa was in flawless condtion like your 964, I too would hesitate taking it out on a daily basis.

I guess it all goes back to the "Trailer Queen" debate that occur's at many automotive concours events.

John

Jay H

Over the years, I've heard that certain individuals will buy a nice car, then send it to a specialty shop, pay $30-$40,000 to have the car prepped for full concours and then get it back without doing anything but write a check. I would think part of the fun of having these nice cars is taking care of them of them yourself and prepping them for the judges, etc. But again, to each his own.

I've heard stories of owners of full concours cars that barely know how/where to start them up...