ulrichd

After I get the suspension put back togther this weekend I want to tackle my, currently dead, a/c system. I have read the great info on http://www.griffiths.com/porsche/ac/911ac/#Kuehlvent.

Now the question: Is replacement of the 40' of a/c hoses a DIY project? Are there special tool required for doing the connections?

Thanks.

bourgeois911

Well, I can tell you it wasn't all that bad removing my barrier hoses and I can't imagine it would be bad replacing them. I would describe it as more tedious than technical and I used no special tools. Feeding the connectors through the engine bulkhead may be a PITA.

Peter Zimmermann

Ulrich: Believe me, if you can put shocks and suspension bushings in your car, you can certainly do barrier hoses.
Pete

g-50cab

I plan on doing my own this summer if that makes you feel better..

Jastx

I did mine, along with the other components as well. Cold air now. There is some tedious work. The most difficult part was removing the belly pan under the steering rack and working with the hoses up to the smugglers box.

scottb

It's a dirty, messy job, but very DIY-able.

One thing that will make it easier is to buy hose in bulk (rather than with the ends aready fitted), and run the hoses without the end fittings on them. Of course, use duct tape to keep dirt out of the hoses. Then, once you have the hoses in place, fit your ends and mark them with a Sharpie. Then have them crimped. By doing it this way, you avoid the hassle of trying to snake the lines with the fittings attached. It can be done with the fittings, but it's more difficult.

www.rennaire.com sells a barrier hose kit if you want to buy hoses pre-cut, with the fittings already attached.

Good luck!

DonMo

I did mine, dirty, messy, yes, all that and more. Jack up on four jack stands and a weekend's worth of fun and your there. FYI, I found a local hydraulic hose dealer in the area and took the hoses off, he recrimped the fittings on brand new barrier AC hose(even replaced fittings if needed). $125. I think www.ackits.com will let you send your hoses to them and do the same. Tape the openings, use pull strings to get the fittings into the engine compartment from below. Good time to decide if you are going to do a 134 conversion (different fittings), procooler(subcooler), or third condenser (or belly condenser if you might turbo later). To make a long story short, very DIY.

rocket.science

So I just bought this hose kit from RennAire, which is of very poor quality, the OD of the hoses are a lot smaller than the original hoses I had in the car. There are no instructions, no sheet of what hose goes where. And to make matters worse , the hoses are longer, than the hoses that it (may ) replace and the fittings are different shaped , too. I called pelican parts, who I bought this from AND the manufaturer. The manufacturer was useless , saying to just replace the hose I took out with a new one. (thanks captn obvious, I would do that, if I could positively identify the hoses). No support from Pelican parts, and nothing online.

I'll post photo's later.
Update: I found some information on a competitors website. (how Ironic) maybe I should have called them to begin with.
two thumbs down RennAire, but you can still make it right. And everyone else who thinks of spending $400 on this , think twice.

Update II: Just got a call from Pelican parts (some person named Christina) and they said that they talked to the 'manager' of RennAire and that the hoses are non-stock (like I didn't know!!!) and therefore they don't have ANY documentation of how to install it. What a bunch of Baloney.
Also that the kit is supposed to be installed by a shop, which is no where indicated on the pelican parts website OR on RennAire website.
They DID however offer to let me send the hoses back for a refund. But I think it serves better to tell everyone about their business practices, as a fact it is OUR money , that pays for they jobs and their business, without us customers they won't have jobs. So do yourself a favor and buy go to your neighborhood shop have them custom made, save about $200 and get one on one customer support.
Pelican parts, this is the last time I shopped from you.

rocket.science

Also due to the thinner hoses, the clamps holding the hoses won't do their job anymore. Another thing to consider, IF you should still decide to give Pelican parts your money.

scottb

Been there, done that. This isn't rocket science (pun intended). Remove the old ones, lay them out on the garage floor, and line up the new ones. If there are some minor variations in sizes, you may have to compensate with some loops or minor re-routing during installation. As to the difference in diameter -- they're a different product. One is barrier and newer technology, and the other is non-barrier and older technology. You can probably get the right size clamps at your local Home Depot or Lowe's in the drawers in the hardware department. They sell padded clamps that should work just fine. Or you can buy them at Aircraft Spruce. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...?clickkey=3764. So, get to work and "git 'er done!"

rocket.science

The point is that there are no instructions or anything to seperate or even verify the content of the box with what was ordered.
Even the cheapest chinese products have installation instructions. And the product fits just as sloppy as these hoses for $400. (pun intended).
Made in USA should be something superior to Ikea or made in china.

Also If I do an install like that , I would like to know beforehand what I need to purchase apart from the hoses.

wwest

You could avoid replacing the non-barrier hoses altogether via adding some system design aspects used by many other vehicle manufacturers of "this" era. My 1992 Ford Aerostar, for instance, has a HPRV incorporated in the system design. The purpose was to vent the R-12 to atmosphere should the high side pressure inadvertently rise to high beyond design pressure.

Apparently this HPRV design aspect was widely used throughout the industry to control/limit R-12 pressure.

"Vent to atmosphere''... R12? Say WHAT??!!

According to the 1992 Ford AeroStar shop/repair manual the HPRV is expected to activate ONLY in rare instances that might otherwise cause damage to the components.

HIGH day in August in Dallas, HOT engine and radiator post shut down, no radiator cooling airflow, no evaporator blower activity...

If even Ford foresaw this possibility why not Porsche...??

Or did they? At what pressure level does the R-12 refrigerant begin to FULLY permeate the factory non-barrier hoses? 300-500 PSI or even less?

What is the maximum pressure in normal operation that Porsche expected to see in our air-cooled 911 A/C..?

HOT day in August in Dallas, HOT engine and exhaust post shutdown, NO engine/exhaust manifold cooling airflow, NO evaporator cooling airflow...

How high might the refrigerant pressure in our A/C go in conditions compariable to those wherein Ford, Chevrolete, etc, had an expectation of the need to "vent R-12 refrigerant to atmosphere"..??

Now...

Since in normal operation R-134a operates at higher pressures than R-12, the EPA requires that conversions from R-12 to R-134a include a compressor high pressure limit to prevent any inadvertent "vent to atmosphere" incidents.

And now the GOOD news...

While your factory non-barrier hoses might allow full permeation with R-12, the EPA has now published an engineering white paper that discloses a new, more recent, laboratory finding, study.

Non-barrier hoses that were previously "conditioned" via long term use of R-12 will not leak the new R-134a refrigerant.

Convert to R-134a, prevent extreme high pressure excursions, your factory non-barrier hose wills provide service life beyond that with the use of R-12.

Read the paragraph on "permeation".

http://www.epatest.com/609/manual/609_section4.html

Amber Gramps

Dude, chill. What is your real beef? You are going to trash a great product and a great site sponsor because they they don't include paper instructions??? they are hoses. Perhaps they figure if you are bright enough to own a 911 that you are either paying a pro or have figure out lefty loosy righty tighty. I could do this job blindfolded. And if you want to use stock clamps wrap the hose in foam backed tape where it passes through the clamps.

scottb

It's not rocket science. There's no need for instructions. I sounds like you're just looking for a reason to complain. I can't speak for others who have done this job, but I suspect nobody had instructions included on how to install the hoses...I certainly didn't. Disconnect the fittings, remove the hold-down clamps, and pull the old ones out. Then, put the new ones in (I covered the fittings with duct tape to be sure nothing got inside during the installation). Not a difficult job (just time-consuming and messy).

Stop complaining and get the job done. Or complain and have hot air blowing out your a/c. Your choice.

Amber Gramps

Lol....Rocket Man.....just saw your first post. ( posted my rant based on your second and third post) you have way over reacted. Take a deep breath, put on your big boy pants, and enjoy an afternoon with your car. It isn't that big a deal. In reality, this set of hoses has made your life mush easier and is worth a couple extra bucks and in the end will have saved you many hours of work and running around.