Gost

When I took apart all the brakes on my 85 Carrera I noticed that the hard lines are what looks like copper. I need to replace some twisted ones and std lines are steel. Is it OK to go with that? I hear that copper lines are illegal or a safety issue. Should I change the existing copper lines as well?
A search revealed little info.

Thanks

Gost

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Gost:

I cannot tell where you live, but copper lines are popular in the UK. Porsche installs steel lines from the factory so you might have some aftermarket ones on there.

FWIW,.....I prefer the steel ones.

Gost

Thanks again Steve. I'm in New York and as a note the lines that run through the center tunnel of the car are copper as well. It's definitely a US car as well so I wonder how they got there and if replaced by PO then why/how copper? I guess I'll change the short hard lines to steel and leave the tunnel lines as is, no harm in that right?

Thanks,

Gordon

Bill Gregory

In my 81SC and 93 C2, both US models, the brake lines are copper, I don't recall seeing any that were steel. Replacement parts attaching to the calipers have been copper also. Not saying that Porsche didn't use some steel lines somewhere, I just haven't observed them.

Gost

Thanks Bill, they must have been original and Porsche does whatever it feels like on any given day I suppose. Only makes sense.

Gost

GMS

Porsche uses the "phosphated" steel lines and has done, as has nearly all the European manufacturers for more than a few years. Probably, from my experience, since the early 70s.
In Europe we frequently changed the earlier steel lines due to corrosion damage and then the "phosphated" steel ones came in to help prevent, but not stop, corrosion. Part of service proceedures on 944s and 911s were to clean the lines and spray them with Wurth HHS2000 to keep corrosion away. We used to buy rolls of the brake line and boxes of unions as even the later ones needed replacement due to the use of salt on the winter roads.

pjc

Gost,

I put copper on my 2.7 some 15 years ago and they are as good as the day they were fitted - in the UK where salt and winter go together (weather forecast only has to say its getting cold and they start spreading the muck) then they are a good option. I also use silicon DOT 5 fluid - been in there the same time - no changes required.

PJC

JBH

Copper should never be used where there are salts of chloride or carbonates present. It will corrode very quickly. The copper water main entering my house was allowed to lay on the concrete foundation without insulation. In less than three years, the combination of salts in the concrete and moisture, caused it to corrode and split - what a mess! Imagine the disaster if you suddenly apply the brakes and experienced a similar failure.

If you car is always in the dry, then perhaps you are ok. If it was me, I would go to the nearest Swaglok dealer, get some SS tubing and fittings, and take out the copper.

Gost

My car has seen rain 3 times in the past 7 years and only once did I take her out when there was snow and salt on the ground, I was having major withdrawals one winter. When I removed my calipers and the short copper hard lines the fittings seemed frozen even rusted onto the pipe causing them to twist. Perhaps the PO drove the car year round. I will replace all the short hard lines to steel and my flex's will be SS. I wonder if there is a problem with dissimilar metal corrosion where the new SS flex lines attach to the existing copper lines running in the tunnel? The old flex lines had steel connectors so if Porsche thought it was OK then....was/is it...OK?

Thanks

Gost

kens911

Actually in Salt, stainless steel lines will corrode also it's called chloride stress cracking corrosion. the lines will appear to be ok then they will just crack usually at a bend or some other place where the most stress is located. they will still appear bright and shiney new looking but will be broken.

pjc

JBH,

There's copper and then there's COPPER - the grade is most important. Never is a word to use with caution.

PJC

Bill Verburg

The lines that look like Copper are a Copper-nickel alloy( C70600), an alloy of 90% copper and 10% nickel called Kunifer

Gost

You know Bill, I have been staring at them now and again and I put one to a wire wheel on the bench grinder and it cleaned up nicely but noticed that it did not look like normal copper but rather had this yellow tint to it. Interesting.

r911

... somebody please post a brake question that Bill doesn't know the answer to...

944ZEN

In my country, they spray salt to the roads every winther as soon as temperature is freezing. That's 3-4 month a year, and every car with steel brake lines are prone to corrosion; so even new cars may need to have brake lines changed after 6-8 years.
My friend owns a garage, where they service old cars (+10 years). And when he prepares cars for inspection, he almost allways change old steel lines with copper lines, as the inspectors tends to fail old cars with steel lines. Also the copper lines corrode with a protective layer of oxydation, that slows futher corrosion. Copper lines in real life seems to corrode/fail slower than steel lines. And Copper lines is more flexible to work with, and can be bend by hand. My friend by brake lines in big rolls (10 meters) and shape them himself. The ends is made by placing a nipple , and using a special tool that make the angled connection surface. I did make my own copper brake lines for my 1991 Astro, where the lines was almost gone, it's quite easy to shape the copper; Steel is prone to crack easy if you bend it to much.