ToasterThief

Can anyone comment on Targa vs Coupe? I've been looking for Coupes, but currently finding more Targas for sale. Are Targas significantly louder inside? How's the driving feel? If a Targa roof is "fixed," does that pretty much mean it'll be good for the foreseeable future?

Keith Guidus

BUY WHAT YOU LIKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

r911

Targas have a more flexible body - tho one racer said he likes that.

Google "butt ugly targa" for how they look with the top on

They give a lot of conv. sensation and open air, and look fine w/o a top

The top is always a potential source of leaks & noise

My '73 is a sunroof coupe which gives the best compromise for me...

You may need to buy 2 911s...

997at

Drive the various cars and buy what you like. Many years ago I bought an 82SC because it was rust free condition and all original with no dash cracks or seat rips etc. I subsequently refreshed everything on the car over the next 5 years to where it is now a sympathetic restoration. I wouldn’t take a great condition 89 Carrera or even a great condition 993 over my car if it was even trade...and i’ve Driven them all extensively. They’re both heavier and not as rev happy or nimble as my SC. It’s what speaks to me as an old school 911. I have a 991 too for perspective. Don’t listen to all the crap about how 3.2s and G50s are so superior. If you follow all that logic then long hoods must really be lousy right....ever shifted a 901? Buy a car you love driving and can bond with. My $0.02 after years of hindsight.

sugarwood

If you lived near me, I would gladly let you drive my car.

Start a thread on PP and ask if someone in the Memphis, Nashville, or St. Louis area will let you test drive their car.
Leave at 6am, drive the car, get lunch, get home by 5pm. A long day, but it will get the job done.

GaryLY

Thanka for the input, everyone! I have some follow up questions.

Yesterday I test drove an 83 cabriolet. I was thoroughly impressed. The performance was better than I expected and the feel was amazing. Now for the questions:

After a 30 minute test drive, there may have been a little oil on the passenger side heat exchanger. Any guess on the issue there?

The car has about 160K miles and afaik no top end rebuild. There are many records and it appears very well taken care of. The cold start was perfect and it didnt smoke. Is a top end job likely in the near future?

AC and headlights have been updated. The paint has some scratches (very driver quality) and the back seats are somewhat worn. There is also a small tear in the back plastic window.

Any input on fair price?

500

If you enjoyed the driving experience this particular car gave, than that is a key box ticked. Next step I would suggest is a comprehensive PPI by an independent shop with good knowledge of air-cooled 911s.

As for the oil on the heat exchanger: A likely candidate is leaking seals at one or more of the oil return tubes. When the engine is first built (or subsequently rebuilt), one-piece return tubes are put in place and essentially sandwiched between the crankcase and cam carriers. However, replacement can be done with two-piece units which are a standard Porsche item and are cheap and easy to do (in a relative sense). That is not the only way oil could end up on an exchanger, but I think the most likely. A good PPI will sort this out.

Many of these cars have gone well over 200K before a top-end, so it is not an automatic given that you will have a top-end in the near future. If the PPI gives a clean bill of health, than don't worry about it. These are the two main items that may precipitate a top-end:

1. A broken head stud. This is pretty binary, if you have a head stud break, it is time for a top end. The car will function with a broken head stud, but don't drive that way for long, as damage will start to accumulate on cylinder mating surfaces. A PPI should include checking for broken head studs. Unfortunately it is impossible to predict the life. So, you could do a PPI today, find no broken head studs and then next week a head stud breaks... that is just one that you have to leave to fate
2. Excessively worn valve guides. Unlike head studs, this is not binary. It is more of an evolution that will manifest itself in gradually increasing oil consumption. If allowed to really progress, you can get into the realm of valve seat damage as the valve gets to very high levels of lateral play. A good PPI will be able to assess this (observing the exhaust in high-vacuum conditions - i.e. engine braking). Also, the PPI should include leak-down testing (which will primarily give you valve/seat condition) and compression testing (assesses ring/cylinder wear, which could also suggest time for a top end, but this is less likely to be an issue)

Your other questions, I am not much help on... Not familiar with the costs associated with cabrio roofs. Hopefully someone here has some input on what repairing the window entails. There may be some inexpensive stop-gap options that you can have done before a comprehensive repair.

For pricing, you may want to look at both the PCA mart as well the classifieds here to get a current feel. Is it a private owner sale?

If you take you evaluation of this car further, I suggest getting high-res pictures of the car (inside, outside, underside, frunk and engine compartment) and post them here and ask for feedback. It is amazing what detailed observations you will typically get...

Dave Fulton

Gary Glad you drove one. Will not reiterate what 500 said but he was right in both cases. I have a 83 SC Coupe for the last 25 years taken care of maintenance wise not a garage queen and driven like a Porsche should be. I am never afraid to take it almost to red line the cars run best in the upper 1/2 RPM range. Mine ran flawless except for losing the original clutch no long after I bought it with about 50 k on it. The original ones had a rubber hub of sorts in the center known to fail and once lost my alternator about 10 years later. My head studs made it to almost 170 K and the engine was still running strong even with them broken but could hear the sound like an exhaust leak as it was leaking between the head and top of cylinder. I know of many that went well over 200 K with original engine.

Go drive some more if able to get a comparison unless the Cab really floats your boat. I probably checked out almost 12 of them before I found the right one for me. No matter what you do get a PPI with a recommended mechanic. Ask on here and sure someone will give you a good one in your area they have experience with. Good luck with your search.

sugarwood

How exactly does a shop measure valve guide wear using this method?

People put way too much faith in a PPI. The leap of faith can not be avoided no matter what measures one takes.
More importantly, most PPI's are very superficial in nature (under 1 hour) and definitely don't bother with compression, let alone a leak down.
You are describing a PPI that would cost over $500-$1000, with several hours of labor billed. It is possible, but hardly the norm.

r911

assess, not measure

500

It is not a measurement, just an observation that is pretty easy to do. Find the right shop, review ahead of time what you want the PPI to include and then a PPI can be a very good insight into the car. A good PPI won't be cheap though (and as such only makes sense when you are feeling really serious about the car).

yelcab

I owned a 84 Carrera Cab for 10 years, and then I owned a 1980SC for 10 years. Here are my thoughts.

Neither car is fast compared to today's standards. I remember being blown off by a Volvo Turbo Station Wagon in my Carrera. After that, fast is just a misnomer when it comes to 35 - 40 years old Porsche 911.

However, fun is a different thing. I remember coming off route 237 in San Jose, and taking a left hand turn straight on in my 1980 911SC. The rear end started to come around at 1/4 turn, and I remember thinking to myself "You idiot, do not lift up" and I kept the gas pedal down, the rear end came back in a 1/2 turn and just nailed the turn to the howling of the kids standing at the corner waiting for the school bus. I never did that again.

I enjoyed the 80SC coupe much more than the heavy-ish 84 Carrera Cabriolet. I worked on both cars and I do not mind the CIS injection system. My present toy car is a 1989 Ferrari 328 with its own CIS K-tronic system. Once you know it, you just know it.

Neither car is going to be your daily driver. Keep them for occasional commute in the Fall or Spring, and use the Boxster for summer heat. Both 915 boxes had to be rebuilt several times. They just do. Be prepared. If I had to choose again, I would take a 80-83 SC over a Carrera. It's lighter, feels like more torque at the low end, and you have less at the top end but ... who cares at the top end?

I would also throw out everything in the car that weighs it down: carpet, center console, AC bits, smuggler box, spare tire, jack kit, get a set of proper Fuchs light weight wheels, and away you go. By the way, get a coupe. You already have convertibles. You want something else.

Keith Guidus

GOOD POINTS!!!!!!! Still don't know how you guys notice 100 lb diff between SC and 3.2??????

yelcab

You would notice the 400 lbs difference between a 1980SC Coupe vs a 1984 Carrera Cabriolet.

Edward

I can absolutely notice when I have or do not have a passenger, even my waif of a daughter at maybe 105lbs. It's not just acceleration but also throttle response, especially in mid rpms. Get to a 200+ weight difference and you're really going to notice, especially in transient maneuvers like hard brake/cornering, switchbacks, and of course the track!!

FWIW, my 82SC (which I've owned and flogged --loviingly ) since the early 2000s has been mechanically flawless. CIS is superb (with SSI), engine fires up absolutely immediately every time as in I barely turn the key and it's alive, revs spiritedly to redline pulling hard, and zero surprises whatsoever. And here's the (extra) fun part: 2550 lbs ...yeah, I can feel it

Edward