Value Of '71T
02-11-2018, 08:50 PM
#16
Instructor
Thread Starter
complete rusty projects are approx 25k. Drivers are approx 50-60k and excellent original or restored cars are approx 100k plus or minus..
This car is basically a project.
You would be into a restoration once you started working on it.
Given the accident history, soft market and current condition i would say 25k low, 35k high.
Be prepaid to spend. A shop can spend a month doing disassembly and media blasting.
Metal shop can spend 3 months on body. Painter will take a month and final assembly will be another month.
Basically, 6 months if somebody was on it everyday. 40 hours a week. Shop rate. $$
All the items that need rebuild or replacment add up quickly.
It is a car worth saving and would be nice when completed.
You just need a proper budget to restore this car. You would want $100k in your jeans.
This car is basically a project.
You would be into a restoration once you started working on it.
Given the accident history, soft market and current condition i would say 25k low, 35k high.
Be prepaid to spend. A shop can spend a month doing disassembly and media blasting.
Metal shop can spend 3 months on body. Painter will take a month and final assembly will be another month.
Basically, 6 months if somebody was on it everyday. 40 hours a week. Shop rate. $$
All the items that need rebuild or replacment add up quickly.
It is a car worth saving and would be nice when completed.
You just need a proper budget to restore this car. You would want $100k in your jeans.
Completely agree with your assessment but think too, the buy in should/could be a bit lower.
The $100K to bring it back is probably on target but would also expect to spend more. So easy to do.
The following 2 picture segment is on the '63B Cab that we did with all the bagging and tagging completed by me once it was determined there was structural damage. Car out of Missoula, MT and stored in a barn for at least 20 years. Typical rust repair: pans, longs, battery compartment in addition to drivers door, and left front fender, mud seals.... A lot of rust covered in bondo, bathroom calk painted black then undercoated. It is a beauty now. Kirsten Rillos-Body/Paint. Jack Morris-Engine/Trans/Assembly. Steve Shepp- Interior/Top. A lot spent on this one, however, there was tremendous up-side for this Cabriolet.
Thanks again for sharing your knowledge here.
DJ
02-11-2018, 08:56 PM
#17
Instructor
Thread Starter
Thanks for adding to this thread.
DJ.
02-12-2018, 11:53 AM
#19
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Engine and tranny refresh.
Brakes and suspension.
Fuel tank and fuel lines.
Electrical and gauges.
The usual rust is now due to be repaired given its age. It is hard to do all that work and sit on current rust and previous repairs.
The car looks to be a decent as any LWB T project however. Complete and not sitting in a field is a bonus.
02-12-2018, 12:43 PM
#20
Instructor
Thread Starter
I cant see this car becoming a good driver in it's current condition. It needs far too much mechancially, and if you get that far into it your are on the road to restoration before you know it.
Engine and tranny refresh.
Brakes and suspension.
Fuel tank and fuel lines.
Electrical and gauges.
The usual rust is now due to be repaired given its age. It is hard to do all that work and sit on current rust and previous repairs.
The car looks to be a decent as any LWB T project however. Complete and not sitting in a field is a bonus.
Engine and tranny refresh.
Brakes and suspension.
Fuel tank and fuel lines.
Electrical and gauges.
The usual rust is now due to be repaired given its age. It is hard to do all that work and sit on current rust and previous repairs.
The car looks to be a decent as any LWB T project however. Complete and not sitting in a field is a bonus.
Again, appreciate everyone that has taken the time to post here.
DJ
02-12-2018, 03:54 PM
#22
Instructor
Thread Starter
02-12-2018, 04:39 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
Some guesstimates, if you are having somebody else do all the work:
To make it a safe but very ratty driver (assuming it is a running car) $10-15K:
Body repair/rust remediation: $5K (could be less if just the battery boxes, but that seems pretty unlikely)
If frame damage: Add $5k
Suspension: $2K if just routine stuff
Brakes: $500-1K
Wiring, battery, hoses, belts, line flush, random routine engine work, $2K ($1K more if there is extensive wiring damage)
If it's not a running car, add $3K or more:
$2K random engine work or more
$1K carburetor rebuild
If it needs engine/tranny rebuild add $10-15K:
$10-15K depending on what it needs
To make it really nice add >$30K:
Body work that I can see: $1K, but if hidden damage due to previous accidents could be up to $3K
Interior: $17K ($5K less if dash/doorcards/door pockets are truly OK, but restoring other things makes "OK" look unacceptable)
Paint: $10K (this always causes an argument here; we're talking a good paint job)
Rechroming: $4000 (I can't see condition of chrome, but a decent paint job will make even OK chrome look tired)
Could be more, could be less. But this gives some idea of ballpark at current prices.
To make it a safe but very ratty driver (assuming it is a running car) $10-15K:
Body repair/rust remediation: $5K (could be less if just the battery boxes, but that seems pretty unlikely)
If frame damage: Add $5k
Suspension: $2K if just routine stuff
Brakes: $500-1K
Wiring, battery, hoses, belts, line flush, random routine engine work, $2K ($1K more if there is extensive wiring damage)
If it's not a running car, add $3K or more:
$2K random engine work or more
$1K carburetor rebuild
If it needs engine/tranny rebuild add $10-15K:
$10-15K depending on what it needs
To make it really nice add >$30K:
Body work that I can see: $1K, but if hidden damage due to previous accidents could be up to $3K
Interior: $17K ($5K less if dash/doorcards/door pockets are truly OK, but restoring other things makes "OK" look unacceptable)
Paint: $10K (this always causes an argument here; we're talking a good paint job)
Rechroming: $4000 (I can't see condition of chrome, but a decent paint job will make even OK chrome look tired)
Could be more, could be less. But this gives some idea of ballpark at current prices.
Last edited by raspritz; 02-12-2018 at 04:56 PM.
02-12-2018, 06:53 PM
#24
it needs to be assessed in person - I don't disagree with any number posted so far - it depends on labor rates (So. of Taco-Ma or on top of Queen Anne hill??), expertise, and extent of damage which has to be viewed in situ to be more accurate
This is a rather special car, being owned by an SR71 pilot (assuming it is not just a fan sticker - would a pilot have had an "S"?). I'd try hard to get it to a relative. A 20-something nephew who wants to learn more about car restoration would be ideal. (!!)
Otherwise, if the sale can wait, then list if for $58k and see what happens.
if a quick sale is needed, try 40k
pics of the front underside - or, better, probing it - in the area where the front arms attach to the unit body could help with valuation
BUT, I bet a PCA or other old 911 club member in the area might visit the car and have a look for no charge
I would PUT ON A RESPIRATOR THAT CAN KEEP OUT HANTA VIRUS Etc., take a shop vac to it, round up any receipts form services or parts the PO bought, and then start looking around for a shop in the area or club member
Good Luck! It deserves a good home.
This is a rather special car, being owned by an SR71 pilot (assuming it is not just a fan sticker - would a pilot have had an "S"?). I'd try hard to get it to a relative. A 20-something nephew who wants to learn more about car restoration would be ideal. (!!)
Otherwise, if the sale can wait, then list if for $58k and see what happens.
if a quick sale is needed, try 40k
pics of the front underside - or, better, probing it - in the area where the front arms attach to the unit body could help with valuation
BUT, I bet a PCA or other old 911 club member in the area might visit the car and have a look for no charge
I would PUT ON A RESPIRATOR THAT CAN KEEP OUT HANTA VIRUS Etc., take a shop vac to it, round up any receipts form services or parts the PO bought, and then start looking around for a shop in the area or club member
Good Luck! It deserves a good home.
02-13-2018, 01:04 PM
#25
Instructor
Thread Starter
Some guesstimates, if you are having somebody else do all the work:
To make it a safe but very ratty driver (assuming it is a running car) $10-15K:
Body repair/rust remediation: $5K (could be less if just the battery boxes, but that seems pretty unlikely)
If frame damage: Add $5k
Suspension: $2K if just routine stuff
Brakes: $500-1K
Wiring, battery, hoses, belts, line flush, random routine engine work, $2K ($1K more if there is extensive wiring damage)
If it's not a running car, add $3K or more:
$2K random engine work or more
$1K carburetor rebuild
If it needs engine/tranny rebuild add $10-15K:
$10-15K depending on what it needs
To make it really nice add >$30K:
Body work that I can see: $1K, but if hidden damage due to previous accidents could be up to $3K
Interior: $17K ($5K less if dash/doorcards/door pockets are truly OK, but restoring other things makes "OK" look unacceptable)
Paint: $10K (this always causes an argument here; we're talking a good paint job)
Rechroming: $4000 (I can't see condition of chrome, but a decent paint job will make even OK chrome look tired)
Could be more, could be less. But this gives some idea of ballpark at current prices.
To make it a safe but very ratty driver (assuming it is a running car) $10-15K:
Body repair/rust remediation: $5K (could be less if just the battery boxes, but that seems pretty unlikely)
If frame damage: Add $5k
Suspension: $2K if just routine stuff
Brakes: $500-1K
Wiring, battery, hoses, belts, line flush, random routine engine work, $2K ($1K more if there is extensive wiring damage)
If it's not a running car, add $3K or more:
$2K random engine work or more
$1K carburetor rebuild
If it needs engine/tranny rebuild add $10-15K:
$10-15K depending on what it needs
To make it really nice add >$30K:
Body work that I can see: $1K, but if hidden damage due to previous accidents could be up to $3K
Interior: $17K ($5K less if dash/doorcards/door pockets are truly OK, but restoring other things makes "OK" look unacceptable)
Paint: $10K (this always causes an argument here; we're talking a good paint job)
Rechroming: $4000 (I can't see condition of chrome, but a decent paint job will make even OK chrome look tired)
Could be more, could be less. But this gives some idea of ballpark at current prices.
Car is not running or moving as the e brakes are frozen and guessing too the brake pads are welded to the rotors. Maybe just a few we’ll placed whacks with a dead blow hammer or other BFH.
Thanks again for your efforts here.
DJ
Last edited by DanielJ; 02-13-2018 at 01:43 PM.
02-13-2018, 01:33 PM
#26
Instructor
Thread Starter
it needs to be assessed in person - I don't disagree with any number posted so far - it depends on labor rates (So. of Taco-Ma or on top of Queen Anne hill??), expertise, and extent of damage which has to be viewed in situ to be more accurate
This is a rather special car, being owned by an SR71 pilot (assuming it is not just a fan sticker - would a pilot have had an "S"?). I'd try hard to get it to a relative. A 20-something nephew who wants to learn more about car restoration would be ideal. (!!)
Otherwise, if the sale can wait, then list if for $58k and see what happens.
if a quick sale is needed, try 40k
pics of the front underside - or, better, probing it - in the area where the front arms attach to the unit body could help with valuation
BUT, I bet a PCA or other old 911 club member in the area might visit the car and have a look for no charge
I would PUT ON A RESPIRATOR THAT CAN KEEP OUT HANTA VIRUS Etc., take a shop vac to it, round up any receipts form services or parts the PO bought, and then start looking around for a shop in the area or club member
Good Luck! It deserves a good home.
This is a rather special car, being owned by an SR71 pilot (assuming it is not just a fan sticker - would a pilot have had an "S"?). I'd try hard to get it to a relative. A 20-something nephew who wants to learn more about car restoration would be ideal. (!!)
Otherwise, if the sale can wait, then list if for $58k and see what happens.
if a quick sale is needed, try 40k
pics of the front underside - or, better, probing it - in the area where the front arms attach to the unit body could help with valuation
BUT, I bet a PCA or other old 911 club member in the area might visit the car and have a look for no charge
I would PUT ON A RESPIRATOR THAT CAN KEEP OUT HANTA VIRUS Etc., take a shop vac to it, round up any receipts form services or parts the PO bought, and then start looking around for a shop in the area or club member
Good Luck! It deserves a good home.
The original owner is the real deal and in fact was a SR71 driver, but not listed as “Pilot.” This fact does add intrigue and talking points when at Cars & Coffee, but adding value to the car, believe it does. Know nothing of extended family and to keep it the family would be a plus.
Have discussed this with a good friend that has been getting “pushed around in Porsche’s since 1965.” He has owned many like cars and he is less enthusiastic on this one while commenting on storage conditions and known previous accident damage. BTW, have all the receipts from bank financing to adding wiper blades.
Once again, really do appreciate your knowledge and desire to help here.
DJ
02-13-2018, 02:00 PM
#27
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The car has been sitting for a long time.
The rodent issue may very well have messed up the electrical which will make the project a dogs breakfast as "ratty driver" concept.
To get the car running (not driving), it is fuel tank, lines, spark and battery. Those need to be addressed.
The car will be smokey wilth oil coming out tail pipe and most likely weaps oil everywhere. Compression test it.
The engine will run, however i wouldnt count on it being ready for a sunday drive... You have 5k spent at this point.
Realistically it will require engine out and refresh. Easy 15k.
Bushings are most likely all toast. Wheel bearing and brakes all want rebuild and replace. Shocks are weak. Tires are toast.
Easy 5k. That is if you plan on actually driving the car instead of leaving it as a roller...
Rust repair will be difficult as once you expose areas it is hard to band-aid. It is a can of worms and i wouldnt recommend opening it. Hard to decide where to start and where to stop.
Weather strip and rubbers will want attention along with trim brightwork....
Exterior paint can be buffed to a shine and interior can be mopped and glowed.
Anybody who hires a shop to do this and to turn this into a driver will want $30-40k ready. (restoration cost would be double that)
So you could buy this car for $25-35k, and be into it for $60-70k all said and done as a driver.
Not sure how long it will last until body require attention however...
At some point it will require a full restoration in which case it would be better to get it over with now instead of spending money to make it a driver for the short term. Unless you plan to flip it as a driver...
The rodent issue may very well have messed up the electrical which will make the project a dogs breakfast as "ratty driver" concept.
To get the car running (not driving), it is fuel tank, lines, spark and battery. Those need to be addressed.
The car will be smokey wilth oil coming out tail pipe and most likely weaps oil everywhere. Compression test it.
The engine will run, however i wouldnt count on it being ready for a sunday drive... You have 5k spent at this point.
Realistically it will require engine out and refresh. Easy 15k.
Bushings are most likely all toast. Wheel bearing and brakes all want rebuild and replace. Shocks are weak. Tires are toast.
Easy 5k. That is if you plan on actually driving the car instead of leaving it as a roller...
Rust repair will be difficult as once you expose areas it is hard to band-aid. It is a can of worms and i wouldnt recommend opening it. Hard to decide where to start and where to stop.
Weather strip and rubbers will want attention along with trim brightwork....
Exterior paint can be buffed to a shine and interior can be mopped and glowed.
Anybody who hires a shop to do this and to turn this into a driver will want $30-40k ready. (restoration cost would be double that)
So you could buy this car for $25-35k, and be into it for $60-70k all said and done as a driver.
Not sure how long it will last until body require attention however...
At some point it will require a full restoration in which case it would be better to get it over with now instead of spending money to make it a driver for the short term. Unless you plan to flip it as a driver...
02-13-2018, 03:16 PM
#28
Instructor
Thread Starter
The car has been sitting for a long time.
The rodent issue may very well have messed up the electrical which will make the project a dogs breakfast as "ratty driver" concept.
To get the car running (not driving), it is fuel tank, lines, spark and battery. Those need to be addressed.
The car will be smokey wilth oil coming out tail pipe and most likely weaps oil everywhere. Compression test it.
The engine will run, however i wouldnt count on it being ready for a sunday drive... You have 5k spent at this point.
Realistically it will require engine out and refresh. Easy 15k.
Bushings are most likely all toast. Wheel bearing and brakes all want rebuild and replace. Shocks are weak. Tires are toast.
Easy 5k. That is if you plan on actually driving the car instead of leaving it as a roller...
Rust repair will be difficult as once you expose areas it is hard to band-aid. It is a can of worms and i wouldnt recommend opening it. Hard to decide where to start and where to stop.
Weather strip and rubbers will want attention along with trim brightwork....
Exterior paint can be buffed to a shine and interior can be mopped and glowed.
Anybody who hires a shop to do this and to turn this into a driver will want $30-40k ready. (restoration cost would be double that)
So you could buy this car for $25-35k, and be into it for $60-70k all said and done as a driver.
Not sure how long it will last until body require attention however...
At some point it will require a full restoration in which case it would be better to get it over with now instead of spending money to make it a driver for the short term. Unless you plan to flip it as a driver...
The rodent issue may very well have messed up the electrical which will make the project a dogs breakfast as "ratty driver" concept.
To get the car running (not driving), it is fuel tank, lines, spark and battery. Those need to be addressed.
The car will be smokey wilth oil coming out tail pipe and most likely weaps oil everywhere. Compression test it.
The engine will run, however i wouldnt count on it being ready for a sunday drive... You have 5k spent at this point.
Realistically it will require engine out and refresh. Easy 15k.
Bushings are most likely all toast. Wheel bearing and brakes all want rebuild and replace. Shocks are weak. Tires are toast.
Easy 5k. That is if you plan on actually driving the car instead of leaving it as a roller...
Rust repair will be difficult as once you expose areas it is hard to band-aid. It is a can of worms and i wouldnt recommend opening it. Hard to decide where to start and where to stop.
Weather strip and rubbers will want attention along with trim brightwork....
Exterior paint can be buffed to a shine and interior can be mopped and glowed.
Anybody who hires a shop to do this and to turn this into a driver will want $30-40k ready. (restoration cost would be double that)
So you could buy this car for $25-35k, and be into it for $60-70k all said and done as a driver.
Not sure how long it will last until body require attention however...
At some point it will require a full restoration in which case it would be better to get it over with now instead of spending money to make it a driver for the short term. Unless you plan to flip it as a driver...
Words of wisdom on the pay me now, pay me later on driver and restoration.
Thanks again for your valued insight and for your time.
This looks to be a no stories car and is ready to roll with no apparent issues will be used to help us even more with "What To Do." https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1971-porsche-911t-17/
02-13-2018, 03:18 PM
#29
Instructor
Thread Starter
The car has been sitting for a long time.
The rodent issue may very well have messed up the electrical which will make the project a dogs breakfast as "ratty driver" concept.
To get the car running (not driving), it is fuel tank, lines, spark and battery. Those need to be addressed.
The car will be smokey wilth oil coming out tail pipe and most likely weaps oil everywhere. Compression test it.
The engine will run, however i wouldnt count on it being ready for a sunday drive... You have 5k spent at this point.
Realistically it will require engine out and refresh. Easy 15k.
Bushings are most likely all toast. Wheel bearing and brakes all want rebuild and replace. Shocks are weak. Tires are toast.
Easy 5k. That is if you plan on actually driving the car instead of leaving it as a roller...
Rust repair will be difficult as once you expose areas it is hard to band-aid. It is a can of worms and i wouldnt recommend opening it. Hard to decide where to start and where to stop.
Weather strip and rubbers will want attention along with trim brightwork....
Exterior paint can be buffed to a shine and interior can be mopped and glowed.
Anybody who hires a shop to do this and to turn this into a driver will want $30-40k ready. (restoration cost would be double that)
So you could buy this car for $25-35k, and be into it for $60-70k all said and done as a driver.
Not sure how long it will last until body require attention however...
At some point it will require a full restoration in which case it would be better to get it over with now instead of spending money to make it a driver for the short term. Unless you plan to flip it as a driver...
The rodent issue may very well have messed up the electrical which will make the project a dogs breakfast as "ratty driver" concept.
To get the car running (not driving), it is fuel tank, lines, spark and battery. Those need to be addressed.
The car will be smokey wilth oil coming out tail pipe and most likely weaps oil everywhere. Compression test it.
The engine will run, however i wouldnt count on it being ready for a sunday drive... You have 5k spent at this point.
Realistically it will require engine out and refresh. Easy 15k.
Bushings are most likely all toast. Wheel bearing and brakes all want rebuild and replace. Shocks are weak. Tires are toast.
Easy 5k. That is if you plan on actually driving the car instead of leaving it as a roller...
Rust repair will be difficult as once you expose areas it is hard to band-aid. It is a can of worms and i wouldnt recommend opening it. Hard to decide where to start and where to stop.
Weather strip and rubbers will want attention along with trim brightwork....
Exterior paint can be buffed to a shine and interior can be mopped and glowed.
Anybody who hires a shop to do this and to turn this into a driver will want $30-40k ready. (restoration cost would be double that)
So you could buy this car for $25-35k, and be into it for $60-70k all said and done as a driver.
Not sure how long it will last until body require attention however...
At some point it will require a full restoration in which case it would be better to get it over with now instead of spending money to make it a driver for the short term. Unless you plan to flip it as a driver...
Words of wisdom on the pay me now, pay me later on driver and restoration.
Thanks again for your valued insight and for your time.
This looks to be a no stories car and is ready to roll with no apparent issues will be used to help us even more with "What To Do." https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1971-porsche-911t-17/
02-13-2018, 03:22 PM
#30
One more tidbit - "Bushings are most likely all toast." will be true no matter how many miles are on the car.
See if anything on the repair or parts slips mentions bushings, suspension refresh, front end or rear end refresh, etc. Parts cost for replacement is not high, it is the labor cost that is expensive.
Same for the wiring - if the rodents were hungry or just curious...
Good Luck.
See if anything on the repair or parts slips mentions bushings, suspension refresh, front end or rear end refresh, etc. Parts cost for replacement is not high, it is the labor cost that is expensive.
Same for the wiring - if the rodents were hungry or just curious...
Good Luck.