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Watched Harry's GT4RS review as he drove the car on a cold day in November. He is driving pretty hard in this video review and the tires, Cup 2s, are all over the place.
Off topic, but this car sounds absolutely amazing. If only the GTS could be made to sound like this but with the volume turned down a bit.
I don't think the RE71RS are available for the GT4 stock 20in wheels. I recently put on Yokohamas Advan A052 but haven't been to autocross yet. Other stock class autocross tires I see being used with 20in stock wheels are Nankang CR-S, and, if you live in hotter climates, Cup 2s and A09s.
I'm in the northeast US (PA). My CGTS's first 9K miles were on PS4S tires. Great tires!
Since I track my car several times per year, I figured the Cup2 tires would be an upgrade - after all, they came standard on the GT4 and Spyder, and Porsche knows what they are doing, right?
Well, I've had the Cup2 tires on for almost 3K miles now, including two track days and at least one AutoX - and they are NOT an upgrade for my use case! (85% street, 15% track/autoX) So I'm looking forward to getting the car back on PS4S tires.
For street driving in the northeast, it's hard to get Cup2 tires up to temperature except on warmer summer days. I'm actually shocked at how much less grip the Cup2 tires have when cold, compared to a PS4S tire at the same temperature. I've actually spent quite a but of time looking for a chart from Michelin that shows grip-vs-temp on these two tires, because I'm convinced that the Cup2's only have an advantage over the PS4S tires once they hit at least 140-160 degrees. That temperature is hard to achieve on the street in my neck of the woods! But of course, that's not a chart that Michelin would want distributed even if it does exist.
So for the OP, my $0.02 is to stick with the PS4S tires!
Did you track the PS4S tires too? I have those tires on my Spyder and I have tracked them. I’m a relative noob on the track, so I don’t really know what I’m missing with the cup2’s. For my use though, I need some wet performance and the PS4S has been really good there, and just good overall (still have fun on the track with them too).
Did you track the PS4S tires too? I have those tires on my Spyder and I have tracked them. I’m a relative noob on the track, so I don’t really know what I’m missing with the cup2’s. For my use though, I need some wet performance and the PS4S has been really good there, and just good overall (still have fun on the track with them too).
Like yourself, Im a track noob. This past weekend was my first ever event, in any car, and 10 seasons. I kept my PS4S on the car, which basically had 90% tread life on them. It was 40* out, windy as all hell, which dropped the ambient temps, and the sun barely made a presence over the course of the 3 days. They felt fine on day one, though I progressed quickly, and began to start threshold braking (max speed 134), into trailing braking. Honestly, I was a little concerned with my combo of tire choice, paired with Ferodo DS2500 pads at these speeds, with repeated cycles. Neither fell off during these sessions.. mind you Im not pushing the car 10/10ths like others who would have out drove this combo quickly. I did have a choice to run Cup2s, as I have a set with ~ 85-90% life on them in the garage… given the progress I made over the weekend, which will lead me to carry even more speed through the circuit as I get more and more seat time, paired with learning how to apply these skill sets more repeatedly; I think the Cup2s will serve me better next track session in June. I did thrash the hell out of the PS4S tires, fortunately with even tread wear on my semi aggressive track alignment (-2.3F/-1.7/R) Im considering using the PS4S in June, so I can feel comfortable trashing them bc they would be fairly worn out with another 10 seasons at my new pace, and buying another set for street use only, and either going with the Cup2s for the next two events Im signed up for, or going with A052’s. I feel like the wear that I put on the PS4S tires over the weekend might have altered their street ability over what a fresh set feels like - just my opinion.
Back on track to the OP… PS4S all day every day on street… I dont care if you canyon run back and forth to work or not. These can handle everything you can throw at them on the street, if not, then the person behind the wheel is driving out of control, and its not the tire that didn’t save them, its the lack of said persons driving ability. As others have said, Cup2 do have a more direct feel to them, I picked up on this instantly when I switched. PS4S on the street will be more predictable than Cup2. MP4S add a little more comfort on the road, and are nice to have if you get caught in a little rain.
As much as I would want to try another track tire over the Cup2, it just doesn’t make sense for me to sell them for pennies on the dollar, just to get a little bit better performance from another tire brand @ ~$2000. I’ll rip through both sets, buy another set of MP4S for street only, and add a track tire selection in the future, but by then, I’ll most likely have a dedicated track wheel/tire set, so I wont be beating the crap out of my OEM set while going back and forth changing tires in between track days. But if one does feel the need to keep only one set of wheels… its fairly cheap to swap out your track tire for the preferred street MP4S - its like $100 to have tires swapped.
Just my .02, I think people should be asking OP the fundamental question: "Have you EVER felt the lack of grip/performance from the PS4S?" Do you launch control at every stoplight? Does the tire pressure go from 28psi to 34(>+6 psi) every commute?(Indicating the tires get really really warm every time)
If you've felt the lack of grip - understeer/oversteer, tire slip when full throttle, etc while on commute often, yes you should consider trying Cup2s. If you've never experienced that, it's like buying a $200 calculus book when you haven't finished elementary school math.
Tire upgrade, along with brake pads/discs, should only be considered when there's a very specific complaint.
Tire loses grip too easily in dry,
Tire loses grip too easily in wet,
Tire feels too stiff, ruining the driving comfort, etc.
Same with brake pads - you only change it when you feel it fades too early, or you just cannot trigger ABS with it(meaning tire greatly outperforms brakes), etc.
It's different from other upgrades like suspensions/lights/etc. You should only upgrade/change tires&brakes when there's a specific flaw you can identify.
If you've experienced the lack of tire performance during commute... but only on cold/wet/snowy weather and your solution to that is changing to a almost semi-slick track tire, I have a great business opportunity for you: wire me $1million, and I'll double that for you by the end of this year. You seem gullible enough.
Last edited by jungleahri; 04-09-2024 at 11:13 PM.
If you've experienced the lack of tire performance during commute... but only on cold/wet/snowy weather and your solution to that is changing to a almost semi-slick track tire, I have a great business opportunity for you: wire me $1million, and I'll double that for you by the end of this year. You seem gullible enough.
I know you were being sarcastic, but I think you took it a little too far here. You can't blame people for getting the impression that Cup2 tires will be a step up from PS4S tires....nothing gullible about that.
Did you track the PS4S tires too? I have those tires on my Spyder and I have tracked them. I’m a relative noob on the track, so I don’t really know what I’m missing with the cup2’s. For my use though, I need some wet performance and the PS4S has been really good there, and just good overall (still have fun on the track with them too).
Yes, I got 7(!!) track days out of the stock PS4S tires using stock alignment, along with probably just as many autocrosses. Admittedly, I'm not an aggressive driver at the track, preferring to drive at 8/10ths most of the time. And the last 2 DE days with those PS4S tires, there wasn't much grip (or tread) because they had been heat-cycled to death at that point. I had to check the tires after every session to see if the cords were peeking through in the rear - which isn't very confidence inspiring, but I was trying to nurse them to time my tire change with my annual state inspection.
I tracked an NC Miata prior to this for 10 years, and that car was throw away money compared to the CGTS. So that's why I don't drive it as hard (I even get passed by NC Miata now). I did have one class win at the 2022 PCA Parade Autocross at Pocono Raceway, even beating all the stock 718 GT4s that were in a higher class (but presumably on Cup2 tires). Imho, a lot of the credit for that win goes to those PS4S tires, because it was a cool, cloudy day where Cup2 tires wouldn't get warm enough!
Yes, I got 7(!!) track days out of the stock PS4S tires using stock alignment, along with probably just as many autocrosses. Admittedly, I'm not an aggressive driver at the track, preferring to drive at 8/10ths most of the time. And the last 2 DE days with those PS4S tires, there wasn't much grip (or tread) because they had been heat-cycled to death at that point. I had to check the tires after every session to see if the cords were peeking through in the rear - which isn't very confidence inspiring, but I was trying to nurse them to time my tire change with my annual state inspection.
I tracked an NC Miata prior to this for 10 years, and that car was throw away money compared to the CGTS. So that's why I don't drive it as hard (I even get passed by NC Miata now). I did have one class win at the 2022 PCA Parade Autocross at Pocono Raceway, even beating all the stock 718 GT4s that were in a higher class (but presumably on Cup2 tires). Imho, a lot of the credit for that win goes to those PS4S tires, because it was a cool, cloudy day where Cup2 tires wouldn't get warm enough!
This was precisely why I chose to stick with the PS4S last weekend @ NJMP - will have to link up with you next time!
Arguably on track the Cup2 will out pace the PS4S (weather conditions pending). I felt more lateral movement than I'd like when I finally started carrying more speed through turns 2-4 on the PS4S, and I had to be a little cautious on the throttle when tracking out in these sections - I dont think I was pushing the car to the limits either.. I might have been at 6/10ths - but then again, this could have all come down to finding a better line
Those of you that made the switch, has it helped with less rocks being thrown up at the car? My rockers with ppf have taken a lot of wear and tear in very few miles
FWIW, these pebbles got stuck to my PS4S, and gouges in the tread happened by just rolling the tires from my front door, to the car:
If I remember correctly, the Cup 2's carcass may be thinner than the PS4S (may have just been the treads, but they felt thinner overall). I got (3) puncture flats in the first 2.5 weeks of ownership with the Cup 2s. I wouldn't want the Cup 2s for "city" driving...at least not "my city".
Last edited by colnagoG60; 04-10-2024 at 01:21 PM.
I know you were being sarcastic, but I think you took it a little too far here. You can't blame people for getting the impression that Cup2 tires will be a step up from PS4S tires....nothing gullible about that.
Agree, especially given the Cup2's would've come with the OP's car (with an option to choose PS4S for a spyder).
This was precisely why I chose to stick with the PS4S last weekend @ NJMP - will have to link up with you next time!
Arguably on track the Cup2 will out pace the PS4S (weather conditions pending). I felt more lateral movement than I'd like when I finally started carrying more speed through turns 2-4 on the PS4S, and I had to be a little cautious on the throttle when tracking out in these sections - I dont think I was pushing the car to the limits either.. I might have been at 6/10ths - but then again, this could have all come down to finding a better line
That is just the worst feeling IMO. I HATE any lateral movement in the rear that are tire related.
For this was the one of the main reasons I moved to the SC3's & AD09's as my tire of choice on my GT4. Both have much stiffer sidewalls and the feel and confidence that gives you is amazing.
There is no room IMO for slop in a sports car and soft sidewall tires makes the lateral axis sloppy. Even the Cup 2's and Dunlop's suck in this regard.
If you don't track your car at all then Sport Cup 2 is a waste. My car came with Dunlop Sport Maxx 2 or whatever and due to low thread wear and no track switched to PS4S. Even with aggressive canyon driving the PS4S have been more than plenty. If you're pushing so much on the street where PS4S will not be enough, doubt Sport Cup 2's will save your butt
On a side note, did one track day just recently with PS4S and my front left tire has corded. A shop owner said I was running too little camber (-2.2F, -2.0R). But I also suspect the softer sidewalls may have been a contributing factor as well. So if you track, even if once or twice a year, than Cup 2's are ok, if not there's really no need.
FWIW, these pebbles got stuck to my PS4S, and gouges in the tread happened by just rolling the tires from my front door, to the car:
If I remember correctly, the Cup 2's carcass may be thinner than the PS4S (may have just been the treads, but they felt thinner overall). I got (3) puncture flats in the first 2.5 weeks of ownership with the Cup 2s. I wouldn't want the Cup 2s for "city" driving...at least not "my city".
colnagoG60,
I got (3) puncture flats in the first 2.5 weeks of ownership with the Cup 2s.
I wouldn't want the Cup 2s for "city" driving...at least not "my city".
100% Totally-Agree ^^^
Terry
USA
Last edited by tigerhonaker; 04-11-2024 at 11:11 AM.
04-09-2024, 12:58 PM
