DSC Sport Controller - interchangeability?
12-13-2022, 12:54 AM
#16
12-13-2022, 04:53 AM
#17
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I ordered my DSC v3 in dec '20 for my 981 GTS but never plugged it into that car, instead used it in my 982 GT4 (after changing the calibration file) and it always worked perfectly without any changes.
12-13-2022, 05:20 AM
#18
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Which is what the DSC manufacturer and people here find impossible. So either DSC wants us to buy a new unit when it isn't actually necessary or you haven't noticed the DSC doesn't do its job properly on your GT4. No room for the truth to rest "somewhere in between" here.
12-13-2022, 05:30 AM
#19
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It seemed to respond as expected is all I can say, obviously it's not like I tried 2 different versions of the DSC. It was certainly driving the dampers correctly, cornering flatter and less dive under braking. Also switching between harder and softer maps certainly worked. I don't really see what more it could have been doing.
DSC are no strangers to forcing upgrades, if you buy an older controller from someone (or if you lose your windows install with the software on it) you can't change the maps anymore because they've taken the previous versions offline and you can't download them from anywhere else. And they won't give it to you if you ask them nicely either. There is no backwards compatibility with the latest DSC Tuner software.
DSC are no strangers to forcing upgrades, if you buy an older controller from someone (or if you lose your windows install with the software on it) you can't change the maps anymore because they've taken the previous versions offline and you can't download them from anywhere else. And they won't give it to you if you ask them nicely either. There is no backwards compatibility with the latest DSC Tuner software.
Last edited by JCviggen; 12-13-2022 at 05:33 AM.
12-13-2022, 05:45 AM
#20
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It seemed to respond as expected is all I can say, obviously it's not like I tried 2 different versions of the DSC. It was certainly driving the dampers correctly, cornering flatter and less dive under braking. Also switching between harder and softer maps certainly worked. I don't really see what more it could have been doing.
DSC are no strangers to forcing upgrades, if you buy an older controller from someone (or if you lose your windows install with the software on it) you can't change the maps anymore because they've taken the previous versions offline and you can't download them from anywhere else. And they won't give it to you if you ask them nicely either. There is no backwards compatibility with the latest DSC Tuner software.
DSC are no strangers to forcing upgrades, if you buy an older controller from someone (or if you lose your windows install with the software on it) you can't change the maps anymore because they've taken the previous versions offline and you can't download them from anywhere else. And they won't give it to you if you ask them nicely either. There is no backwards compatibility with the latest DSC Tuner software.
12-13-2022, 06:08 AM
#21
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"We do not offer firmware change."
"Like other manufacturers of products, we have to keep selling new products in order to stay business."
This sums it up, i'd say.
12-13-2022, 07:30 AM
#22
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I've just loaded the latest "RS" config to my allegedly 981-only controller. Not trying to say i "beat the Casino". Perhaps the FW is the key and the controller would not work as experienced in 981, but we'll see. When my Spyder arrives, i will put it in and (when the snows melt) see whether i can tell any difference against stock.
12-13-2022, 07:37 AM
#23
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If it doesn't you can always go to the "touring" file or something. It's very common practice for them to not make a newer file available even to controllers of the same generation but after a certain build date. DSC's "product support" basically cancels itself as soon as you no longer have the very latest version of what they are selling. I once had a guy kindly send me a newer map that was shipping on new V3s but that they didn't want to put up on their website lest they give something of value to people who didn't buy something in the past 6 months.
Interesting business model but clearly if you're the only one selling something you can be a bit dickish about it.
Interesting business model but clearly if you're the only one selling something you can be a bit dickish about it.
12-13-2022, 09:51 AM
#24
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1284...l#post17899131
"We do not offer firmware change."
"Like other manufacturers of products, we have to keep selling new products in order to stay business."
This sums it up, i'd say.
"We do not offer firmware change."
"Like other manufacturers of products, we have to keep selling new products in order to stay business."
This sums it up, i'd say.
Not quite
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1101...l#post17127740
12-13-2022, 11:37 AM
#25
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Either it is and their customer support sucks or it isn't and then you're riding a dead horse so to say.
I have emailed DSC again with a screenshot of the post you linked asking specifically about the FW update. Let's see which of the above it is.
12-13-2022, 11:40 AM
#26
Ok, so on 30 Dec 2020 (your post) they might have offered FW update, on 11 Jan 2022 (my post) they say they don't do FW updates at all. While exchanging emails about interchangebility between 981 and 718 with DSC recently, no one mentioned a FW update possibility to me even when i asked when would the newer V3 controller version be back in stock. Yet according to you the FW update definitely IS an option....
Either it is and their customer support sucks or it isn't and then you're riding a dead horse so to say.
I have emailed DSC again with a screenshot of the post you linked asking specifically about the FW update. Let's see which of the above it is.
Either it is and their customer support sucks or it isn't and then you're riding a dead horse so to say.
I have emailed DSC again with a screenshot of the post you linked asking specifically about the FW update. Let's see which of the above it is.
1. Update of firmware from an old version of the V3 to the newer version of the V3 — not possible based on your link
2. Conversion from one generation to another (991.1 to 991.2 aka 981 to 718) — possible with a $250 fee if your DSC warranty is expired
12-13-2022, 05:17 PM
#27
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Hello all. Please allow me to post the following tech facts to answer some of the questions in this thread. I am aware that some are not pleased with DSC's policies so I am just staying to product tech facts.
1. The DSC controllers are vehicle generation specific.
2. There are two generations:
3. The communication protocol are different between the two generations of cars. This is why other electronics companies have different products for each generations.
4. In *some* cases, it is possible to plug-in a Gen1 controller into a Gen2 car(or vice versa) without causing the fault codes to appear on the instrument cluster. This will depend on the factory configured threshold and the factory options on the host car. In this respect the factory controller has narrower threshold than DSC controller.
5. The DSC calibration file contains the instructions for the output command to the dampers per every given input, but it cannot change the architecture of the inputs. The input architecture is what defines the vehicle generation for this context. In some cases, they can be pretty close but not the same. It is stated on the top portion of the DSC calibration file web page that the calibration file cannot change the vehicle type.
6. DSC controller can successfully use the same calibration file for mid-engine and rear-engine cars because the factory suspension package(dampers, springs, and sway bars) are factory-matched for each model(981, 982, 991.1, 991.2) and each trim(base, S, GTS, GT4, etc.) by the car maker to begin with. DSC controller commands within the output range of the factory suspension package to G-force and other driver inputs. The car's behavior(weight distribution) to G-force and driver inputs is universal.
Hope this helps to clarify.
1. The DSC controllers are vehicle generation specific.
2. There are two generations:
- 981 and 991.1 is Gen1, takes DSC controller part # 01-9911-00-v3
- 982(718) and 991.2 is Gen2, takes DSC controller part # 01-9912-00-v3
3. The communication protocol are different between the two generations of cars. This is why other electronics companies have different products for each generations.
4. In *some* cases, it is possible to plug-in a Gen1 controller into a Gen2 car(or vice versa) without causing the fault codes to appear on the instrument cluster. This will depend on the factory configured threshold and the factory options on the host car. In this respect the factory controller has narrower threshold than DSC controller.
- Will the controller work if installed in a wrong generation car? To some extent, yes. But won't work as fully intended, since there are background operations at play. The input-to-output values aren't the same.
- Will it work optimally as developed and fully intended? No.
- Are the two part numbers made up by false pretense to fool the market? No. In fact, it would be better for DSC if the car makers didn't make generation changes that requires DSC to acquire every new gen car to re-engineer.
5. The DSC calibration file contains the instructions for the output command to the dampers per every given input, but it cannot change the architecture of the inputs. The input architecture is what defines the vehicle generation for this context. In some cases, they can be pretty close but not the same. It is stated on the top portion of the DSC calibration file web page that the calibration file cannot change the vehicle type.
6. DSC controller can successfully use the same calibration file for mid-engine and rear-engine cars because the factory suspension package(dampers, springs, and sway bars) are factory-matched for each model(981, 982, 991.1, 991.2) and each trim(base, S, GTS, GT4, etc.) by the car maker to begin with. DSC controller commands within the output range of the factory suspension package to G-force and other driver inputs. The car's behavior(weight distribution) to G-force and driver inputs is universal.
Hope this helps to clarify.
__________________
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TPC Racing stats:
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup Am Champion
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge GT4 Pro-Am Team Champion
2022 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup & 991 Cup Champion
2020 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2018 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
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PCA National Instructor
TPC Racing stats:
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup Am Champion
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge GT4 Pro-Am Team Champion
2022 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup & 991 Cup Champion
2020 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2018 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2016 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2013 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2006 Rolex-24 @ Daytona GT Champion
2004 Grand-Am SGS Class Champion
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sgreer78 (12-13-2022)
12-13-2022, 06:24 PM
#28
just to add, I have 991.2 V3 DSC installed on 991.2 gt3 2018, I took it out to install on our 2021 GT4..no issue and it works like charm..
I won't do the swap if it's DSC 991.1V3..
I won't do the swap if it's DSC 991.1V3..
12-13-2022, 09:09 PM
#29
Rennlist Member
Hello all. Please allow me to post the following tech facts to answer some of the questions in this thread. I am aware that some are not pleased with DSC's policies so I am just staying to product tech facts.
1. The DSC controllers are vehicle generation specific.
2. There are two generations:
3. The communication protocol are different between the two generations of cars. This is why other electronics companies have different products for each generations.
4. In *some* cases, it is possible to plug-in a Gen1 controller into a Gen2 car(or vice versa) without causing the fault codes to appear on the instrument cluster. This will depend on the factory configured threshold and the factory options on the host car. In this respect the factory controller has narrower threshold than DSC controller.
5. The DSC calibration file contains the instructions for the output command to the dampers per every given input, but it cannot change the architecture of the inputs. The input architecture is what defines the vehicle generation for this context. In some cases, they can be pretty close but not the same. It is stated on the top portion of the DSC calibration file web page that the calibration file cannot change the vehicle type.
6. DSC controller can successfully use the same calibration file for mid-engine and rear-engine cars because the factory suspension package(dampers, springs, and sway bars) are factory-matched for each model(981, 982, 991.1, 991.2) and each trim(base, S, GTS, GT4, etc.) by the car maker to begin with. DSC controller commands within the output range of the factory suspension package to G-force and other driver inputs. The car's behavior(weight distribution) to G-force and driver inputs is universal.
Hope this helps to clarify.
1. The DSC controllers are vehicle generation specific.
2. There are two generations:
- 981 and 991.1 is Gen1, takes DSC controller part # 01-9911-00-v3
- 982(718) and 991.2 is Gen2, takes DSC controller part # 01-9912-00-v3
3. The communication protocol are different between the two generations of cars. This is why other electronics companies have different products for each generations.
4. In *some* cases, it is possible to plug-in a Gen1 controller into a Gen2 car(or vice versa) without causing the fault codes to appear on the instrument cluster. This will depend on the factory configured threshold and the factory options on the host car. In this respect the factory controller has narrower threshold than DSC controller.
- Will the controller work if installed in a wrong generation car? To some extent, yes. But won't work as fully intended, since there are background operations at play. The input-to-output values aren't the same.
- Will it work optimally as developed and fully intended? No.
- Are the two part numbers made up by false pretense to fool the market? No. In fact, it would be better for DSC if the car makers didn't make generation changes that requires DSC to acquire every new gen car to re-engineer.
5. The DSC calibration file contains the instructions for the output command to the dampers per every given input, but it cannot change the architecture of the inputs. The input architecture is what defines the vehicle generation for this context. In some cases, they can be pretty close but not the same. It is stated on the top portion of the DSC calibration file web page that the calibration file cannot change the vehicle type.
6. DSC controller can successfully use the same calibration file for mid-engine and rear-engine cars because the factory suspension package(dampers, springs, and sway bars) are factory-matched for each model(981, 982, 991.1, 991.2) and each trim(base, S, GTS, GT4, etc.) by the car maker to begin with. DSC controller commands within the output range of the factory suspension package to G-force and other driver inputs. The car's behavior(weight distribution) to G-force and driver inputs is universal.
Hope this helps to clarify.
A remaining question...
Some members above suggested that a Gen 1 (01-9911-00-v3) might be hardware upgradable at TPC to Gen 2 ( 01-9912-00-v3) for a nominal fee. Is this possible? I have a DSC Gen 1 in my current 991.1 Turbo S and might migrate it over if it could be upgraded for significantly less then the cost of a new Gen 2. I've never heard this before, likely wishful thinking, but worth asking...
12-13-2022, 09:58 PM
#30
Rennlist Member
Hello all. Please allow me to post the following tech facts to answer some of the questions in this thread. I am aware that some are not pleased with DSC's policies so I am just staying to product tech facts.
1. The DSC controllers are vehicle generation specific.
2. There are two generations:
3. The communication protocol are different between the two generations of cars. This is why other electronics companies have different products for each generations.
4. In *some* cases, it is possible to plug-in a Gen1 controller into a Gen2 car(or vice versa) without causing the fault codes to appear on the instrument cluster. This will depend on the factory configured threshold and the factory options on the host car. In this respect the factory controller has narrower threshold than DSC controller.
5. The DSC calibration file contains the instructions for the output command to the dampers per every given input, but it cannot change the architecture of the inputs. The input architecture is what defines the vehicle generation for this context. In some cases, they can be pretty close but not the same. It is stated on the top portion of the DSC calibration file web page that the calibration file cannot change the vehicle type.
6. DSC controller can successfully use the same calibration file for mid-engine and rear-engine cars because the factory suspension package(dampers, springs, and sway bars) are factory-matched for each model(981, 982, 991.1, 991.2) and each trim(base, S, GTS, GT4, etc.) by the car maker to begin with. DSC controller commands within the output range of the factory suspension package to G-force and other driver inputs. The car's behavior(weight distribution) to G-force and driver inputs is universal.
Hope this helps to clarify.
1. The DSC controllers are vehicle generation specific.
2. There are two generations:
- 981 and 991.1 is Gen1, takes DSC controller part # 01-9911-00-v3
- 982(718) and 991.2 is Gen2, takes DSC controller part # 01-9912-00-v3
3. The communication protocol are different between the two generations of cars. This is why other electronics companies have different products for each generations.
4. In *some* cases, it is possible to plug-in a Gen1 controller into a Gen2 car(or vice versa) without causing the fault codes to appear on the instrument cluster. This will depend on the factory configured threshold and the factory options on the host car. In this respect the factory controller has narrower threshold than DSC controller.
- Will the controller work if installed in a wrong generation car? To some extent, yes. But won't work as fully intended, since there are background operations at play. The input-to-output values aren't the same.
- Will it work optimally as developed and fully intended? No.
- Are the two part numbers made up by false pretense to fool the market? No. In fact, it would be better for DSC if the car makers didn't make generation changes that requires DSC to acquire every new gen car to re-engineer.
5. The DSC calibration file contains the instructions for the output command to the dampers per every given input, but it cannot change the architecture of the inputs. The input architecture is what defines the vehicle generation for this context. In some cases, they can be pretty close but not the same. It is stated on the top portion of the DSC calibration file web page that the calibration file cannot change the vehicle type.
6. DSC controller can successfully use the same calibration file for mid-engine and rear-engine cars because the factory suspension package(dampers, springs, and sway bars) are factory-matched for each model(981, 982, 991.1, 991.2) and each trim(base, S, GTS, GT4, etc.) by the car maker to begin with. DSC controller commands within the output range of the factory suspension package to G-force and other driver inputs. The car's behavior(weight distribution) to G-force and driver inputs is universal.
Hope this helps to clarify.