Are Ceramic brakes worth it?
12-02-2014, 05:52 PM
#46
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12-02-2014, 06:07 PM
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12-02-2014, 06:11 PM
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12-02-2014, 06:16 PM
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12-02-2014, 06:55 PM
#50
Race Director
The only thing I use leaf blowers for are the leaves in the yard. Using it on your car is like brushing your teeth with a broom. : )
My car blower:
https://www.metrovacworld.com/Air_Fo...B-3CD/overview
My car blower:
https://www.metrovacworld.com/Air_Fo...B-3CD/overview
12-02-2014, 07:01 PM
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12-02-2014, 07:04 PM
#52
David, thanks again for pointing the board to this short piece in Pano. Sure enough, when I returned from my travels late last night, the issue was in my huge pile of mail. I read the article before unpacking. I must say, it did not make me feel better about switching my order to PCCBs.
Thanks, Chuck. I think your analysis is fair. I've really been torn on this issue. My heart says PCCBs. My head says (already quite excellent) standard brakes. I wish there were some hard data available for the generation 3 PCCBs versus cast-irons. All of the data are soft and subjective -- "PCCBs are the cat's meow" v. "You are a marketing guppy if you buy these." Helpful but not like performance test data would be.
Thanks, Chuck. I think your analysis is fair. I've really been torn on this issue. My heart says PCCBs. My head says (already quite excellent) standard brakes. I wish there were some hard data available for the generation 3 PCCBs versus cast-irons. All of the data are soft and subjective -- "PCCBs are the cat's meow" v. "You are a marketing guppy if you buy these." Helpful but not like performance test data would be.
Also yellow, red or whatever, I like the look of the PCCBs because the disks are bigger. They just fill out a 20" rim better at least on a turbo: 410mm front, 390mm back (instead of 380mm for front/back for the iron rotors). That doesn't sound like much, but it amounts to the PCCB disks having a 16% larger area on the fronts.
[Note that on the S/4S, standard-to-PCCB diameters are 340/330mm vs. 350/350mm, so the area difference isn't as pronounced there, but still amounts to 13% on the rears]
I don't track this car, so it's also really nice just not worrying about the brakes wearing out... like ever
The fact they perform better is gravy :-)
12-02-2014, 07:06 PM
#53
Race Director
Good for focused trim pieces and general water sheeting across panels. When I drive my car, there are zero drip marks most of the time.
Money well spent.
12-02-2014, 08:27 PM
#54
12-02-2014, 08:30 PM
#55
For me, having wheels that are pristine all of the time is worth it. Before the PCCBs, my wheels always looked dirty like *one drive* after a wash.
Also yellow, red or whatever, I like the look of the PCCBs because the disks are bigger. They just fill out a 20" rim better at least on a turbo: 410mm front, 390mm back (instead of 380mm for front/back for the iron rotors). That doesn't sound like much, but it amounts to the PCCB disks having a 16% larger area on the fronts.
[Note that on the S/4S, standard-to-PCCB diameters are 340/330mm vs. 350/350mm, so the area difference isn't as pronounced there, but still amounts to 13% on the rears]
I don't track this car, so it's also really nice just not worrying about the brakes wearing out... like ever
The fact they perform better is gravy :-)
Also yellow, red or whatever, I like the look of the PCCBs because the disks are bigger. They just fill out a 20" rim better at least on a turbo: 410mm front, 390mm back (instead of 380mm for front/back for the iron rotors). That doesn't sound like much, but it amounts to the PCCB disks having a 16% larger area on the fronts.
[Note that on the S/4S, standard-to-PCCB diameters are 340/330mm vs. 350/350mm, so the area difference isn't as pronounced there, but still amounts to 13% on the rears]
I don't track this car, so it's also really nice just not worrying about the brakes wearing out... like ever
The fact they perform better is gravy :-)
12-03-2014, 03:33 AM
#56
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Wrong on so many levels.... My life is vacuum and whilst it's true that in high and ultra high vacuum (molecular flow) the radiated heat through emissivity is the only cooling media (assuming no embedded cooling) ... It is NOT true for higher pressures and the emissivity pales into insignificance against convection cooling (even in rough and medium vacuum above molecular flow)...
Let's take another example... household radiators.... Yes they would be marginally more efficient if they were matt black... But so marginal that the vast majority are still sold and retained as gloss white... Go figure!
Let's take another example... household radiators.... Yes they would be marginally more efficient if they were matt black... But so marginal that the vast majority are still sold and retained as gloss white... Go figure!
Remember those old hand-held incandescent trouble lights...the ones with the stamped-steel-and-flash-plated guard/reflectors? Well, I had one of those for years. I'm not sure what material the plating was, but it had the appearance of matt aluminum...a kind of light grey color. I hated that light because I was constantly burning myself on the outside of that reflector. One day, a friend happened to be there when I earned myself a new welt from the light. He grabbed a spray bomb of flat black header paint off of the shelf and shot a thin coat of it on the outside of the guard/reflector...and I never burned myself on that light again. The guard/reflector had gone from scalding hot to merely quite warm. What could possibly have changed so much? The only change was that my friend had increased the emissivity of the outer surface by turning it flat black instead of a matt light grey. The guard/reflector was no longer retaining anywhere near the amount of heat that it had been because the outer surface was emitting so much more efficiently...in spite of the fact that there was a 1 bar atmosphere present in my garage the whole time, and in spite of the fact that there was no change in the airflow around the guard/reflector. That experience really brought home the effect to me. The sudden absence of physical pain and damage will tend do that for you...
A 20 amp outlet and breaker are only a few bucks at Home Depot. The hard part is that the wiring in the circuit needs to be upgraded from #14 to #12...that is, if it's going to be up to code.
Last edited by 1analguy; 12-03-2014 at 02:58 PM.
12-03-2014, 02:53 PM
#59
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Jeez...I'm really sorry for contributing to dragging this thread kind of off topic. The OP just wants to know whether or not PCCBs are "worth having". To me, no. But my reality may have little or nothing to do with his reality. He may be fortunate/flush enough that the initial cash outlay for PCCbs doesn't matter. The 20" wheels on the 991 make the perfectly adequate iron brakes look too small/cheap to him. His solution would be the larger, "better-looking", lighter PCCB setup. My solution would be smaller, lighter/better-performing wheels instead, but I'm resource-limited. So, I say if you're "bucks up" then go for the PCCBs. Just be very careful who you let work on your wheels...
12-03-2014, 10:26 PM
#60
+1
For me, having wheels that are pristine all of the time is worth it. Before the PCCBs, my wheels always looked dirty like *one drive* after a wash.
Also yellow, red or whatever, I like the look of the PCCBs because the disks are bigger. They just fill out a 20" rim better at least on a turbo: 410mm front, 390mm back (instead of 380mm for front/back for the iron rotors). That doesn't sound like much, but it amounts to the PCCB disks having a 16% larger area on the fronts.
[Note that on the S/4S, standard-to-PCCB diameters are 340/330mm vs. 350/350mm, so the area difference isn't as pronounced there, but still amounts to 13% on the rears]
I don't track this car, so it's also really nice just not worrying about the brakes wearing out... like ever
The fact they perform better is gravy :-)
Also yellow, red or whatever, I like the look of the PCCBs because the disks are bigger. They just fill out a 20" rim better at least on a turbo: 410mm front, 390mm back (instead of 380mm for front/back for the iron rotors). That doesn't sound like much, but it amounts to the PCCB disks having a 16% larger area on the fronts.
[Note that on the S/4S, standard-to-PCCB diameters are 340/330mm vs. 350/350mm, so the area difference isn't as pronounced there, but still amounts to 13% on the rears]
I don't track this car, so it's also really nice just not worrying about the brakes wearing out... like ever
The fact they perform better is gravy :-)