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To Whale tail or not to whale tail

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Old 10-24-2017, 09:10 PM
  #16  
r911
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Let's not confuse local downforce with total downforce.
Old 10-25-2017, 12:08 AM
  #17  
myflat6
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Originally Posted by 09mageec
A HUGE peeve of mine - A narrow body G, with a late model ('78 and up) 3.3 liter 930 Turbo 'Tea Tray' spoiler. Although that spoiler was also offered on the UK-only Sport Package for the 911 SC, I think it looks too bulky and disproportionate on a narrow car...

The much flatter profile "Carrera Whale Tail" with the large, flush vents for the grill looks much more proportionate on a narrow car IMO. If I remember correctly, this spoiler was introduced in 84' for the 3.2 Carrera, but Porsche was also putting it on the last few months of 911 SC - UK Sport Package (which began with the 'Tea Tray').

The BEST looking "whale tail"-like spoiler for the narrow cars, has to be the one that they introduced on the '80 Weissach Edition, and was derived from the '74 3.0 RSR. The first design of the 930 Turbo wing was very similar to this as well, but had and extra smaller grill towards the rear of the spoiler that changed in size once. Also, I believe the slight variations of this spoiler were also available on the '76/'77 Carrera 3.0 as well. Something about the Weissach spoiler's inset grill, keeping the proportion and contour of a regular non-winged lid, looks perfect to me!

If it were my Targa, I'd go with a Duck Tail, John. I think they are that perfect spoiler that works with just about any G series, whether it be narrow or wide body.

-Cam
The tea tray was also offered on US SC's as an option (mine was ordered this way). I personally do not like a spoiler on coupes but actually think they look great on Targa's -tea tray specifically - because the lines are more squared at the roof line than the coupes. But that is just my opinion - and it may be because I am biased
Old 10-25-2017, 12:12 PM
  #18  
911Dave
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IMO all fixed rear spoilers detract from the look of all air cooled cars, no matter what type they are. Duck tails look reasonably ok on longhoods, but still aren't as attractive as a clean deck lid. The smooth graceful curve from the top of the windshield to the rear bumper are one of the key styling points that make 911s of every year so attractive, and a spoiler of any type diminishes it.
Old 10-25-2017, 12:52 PM
  #19  
racerbvd
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Duck on my SC
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Last edited by racerbvd; 10-25-2017 at 04:05 PM.
Old 10-25-2017, 02:03 PM
  #20  
Dave Inc.
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Yep, just went duck here as well on my SC from a tea tray. I think it looks a lot better considering the lines of the car.


Should also mention that my tea tray and the rubber were OEM Porsche stuff (though the rubber has kind of a kink in it), what might those go for? They're just kind of sitting in a spare room right now...
Old 10-25-2017, 06:10 PM
  #21  
Bill Verburg
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Here's a summary of the aero characteristics of most air cooled through 1998
Old 10-25-2017, 08:40 PM
  #22  
r911
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I'd like to know the numbers for the Singer...
Old 10-26-2017, 10:03 AM
  #23  
Bill Verburg
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Originally Posted by r911
I'd like to know the numbers for the Singer...
Very similar to 964 turbo
Old 10-26-2017, 12:12 PM
  #24  
rfloz
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A OEM tea tray style whale tail weighs 24# more than fiberglass duck.

All that weight is high and to the rear, just where you don't want it.
Old 10-26-2017, 07:40 PM
  #25  
Bill Verburg
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Originally Posted by rfloz
A OEM tea tray style whale tail weighs 24# more than fiberglass duck.

All that weight is high and to the rear, just where you don't want it.
I never weighed the 3 all/f/g tails that I had over the years but they were all heavier than a stock steel lid which is 9#s, there are early and late versions of these but the weight difference is minimal

a late 930 tail is 23# + 9# for the lid it sits on

I settled on a Shaw all f/g tail @9# + 9# steel lid for mine
Old 10-26-2017, 09:06 PM
  #26  
rfloz
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FWIW, my stock tea tray (1984 TurboLook) weighed 39# and my no-name fiberglass one piece duck/lid was 15#, ergo 24# gone.

My use was/is auto-cross and street with minimal track days. The duck is a good compromise for this usage.

For race use, where down force (or reduced lift) is more important, an IROC tail is probably one of the best out there short of a real wing.

Last edited by rfloz; 10-26-2017 at 09:09 PM. Reason: speeling
Old 10-26-2017, 11:17 PM
  #27  
needspeed
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I'm of the opinion the lift reductions from whale tails and tea trays are from the extra weight. :-)
Old 10-27-2017, 12:05 PM
  #28  
theiceman
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Originally Posted by needspeed
I'm of the opinion the lift reductions from whale tails and tea trays are from the extra weight. :-)
that certainly is a mathematical factor, but still fairly small compared to the engine and transmission directly underneath it.
Old 10-27-2017, 04:27 PM
  #29  
Tremelune
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Originally Posted by r911
The front will need some treatment before putting anything on the rear.
Don't gloss over this. If you put a spoiler on the rear, you should have a spoiler on the front to balance it out aerodynamically. I assume it's as easy as buying the rubber lip and some hardware, but I've never done it.
Old 10-27-2017, 09:53 PM
  #30  
needspeed
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Originally Posted by theiceman
that certainly is a mathematical factor, but still fairly small compared to the engine and transmission directly underneath it.
Is there any data on lift reductions if only the front spoiler is installed? Curious how much having only the front would reduce lift.


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