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I did not grease them. I will tough. What type of grease do u use?
thxs
The manual calls for an aluminum based anti seize, as mentioned above by others. You can use aluminum or copper based anti seize
The anti seize is there for 2 reasons. First on the threads it helps with dissimilar metal galling. Second on the threads and under the cap ring helps with torquing the bolts, meaning the factory spec of 96 ft. lbs. is based on having anti seize on the threads and under the cap. If you torque without the anti seize you are not likely to get 96 ft. lbs. on them. It won't be far off but the spec is with anti seize.
Probably more info that you were looking for but there it is.
Here's a snippet of the info from the manual for reference
Second on the threads and under the cap ring helps with torquing the bolts, meaning the factory spec of 96 ft. lbs. is based on having anti seize on the threads and under the cap.
Just a heads up, the torque specification listed in the workshop manuals is for a dry fastener as Optimoly TA does not affect tightening torque. One thing I wonder is if this might be related to Porsche's more recent decision to increase the minimum tightening torque specification on newer models to 118 ft-lbs, because nobody was using TA and instead used whatever was cheapest (ex. Permatex), which does affect tightening torque?
Just a heads up, the torque specification listed in the workshop manuals is for a dry fastener as Optimoly TA does not affect tightening torque. One thing I wonder is if this might be related to Porsche's more recent decision to increase the minimum tightening torque specification on newer models to 118 ft-lbs, because nobody was using TA and instead used whatever was cheapest (ex. Permatex), which does affect tightening torque?
First let me clarify a bit, I agree it does not affect the tightening torque spec listed in the manual but when applied to the fastener, does affect the clamping force of the fasteners. It's pure physics. In a nutshell, the coefficient of friction between the two surfaces is reduced when a lubricant is applied. So when the same amount of applied normal force (torque) is applied to the fastener dry vs with a lubricant the the clamping force between the fasteners is greater.
Optimoly TA is simply an aluminum based anti seize, not a special Porsche magic physics defying substance
Also have to disagree that it's a dry spec, it states directly in the manual to apply anti seize, which lubricates the threads and they are not dry any longer.
Manimal...yes you should use an anti seize even with steel on steel. It still helps with galling and corrosion.
Optimoly TA is simply an aluminum based anti seize, not a special Porsche magic physics defying substance
Not magic but if it has nearly the same dynamic friction coefficient as anodized aluminum and hard steel on a threaded surface... then your choice of anti-seize might make a difference?
Originally Posted by mxracer
Also have to disagree that it's a dry spec, it states directly in the manual to apply anti seize, which lubricates the threads and they are not dry any longer.
Back in the 80s (see below) when Porsche originally started specifying (lubing with) OptimolyTA they never changed the torque specification and warned specifically, "Optimally TA does not affect tightening torque". And in fact they have always given that warning for TA and HT but not when switching to other coatings (ex. with dacromet the torque specs changed) on the same fastener. In your owners manuals, WKM and TSBs they don't write "Anti-seize" they specifically call out OptimolyTA. The variation in friction coefficient is quite dramatic between different brands of antiseize. That's why I question (i don't know) whether the torque specification is given for a dry/wet fastener.
And more recently, starting with the Cayman (but applying to all) the torque specification increased to 118 ft-lbs when using the newer black coated wheel bolts.
I used the Nickle based anti-seize on my Ti lugs. This stuff is the shizzle for all the turbo studs and nuts also. The Cu based stuff plates out at high temp and makes the nuts harder to remove.
Not magic but if it has nearly the same dynamic friction coefficient as anodized aluminum and hard steel on a threaded surface... then your choice of anti-seize might make a difference?
Back in the 80s (see below) when Porsche originally started specifying (lubing with) OptimolyTA they never changed the torque specification and warned specifically, "Optimally TA does not affect tightening torque". And in fact they have always given that warning for TA and HT but not when switching to other coatings (ex. with dacromet the torque specs changed) on the same fastener. In your owners manuals, WKM and TSBs they don't write "Anti-seize" they specifically call out OptimolyTA. The variation in friction coefficient is quite dramatic between different brands of antiseize. That's why I question (i don't know) whether the torque specification is given for a dry/wet fastener.
And more recently, starting with the Cayman (but applying to all) the torque specification increased to 118 ft-lbs when using the newer black coated wheel bolts.
I'm not sure I follow your suggestion of anodized aluminum and steel on a threaded surface. Are you saying that it would be the same as a lubricant?
I agree/acknowledge that in the Porsche manuals the application of Optimolly TA did not change the manufactures recommended applied normal force (torque) to the fastener. What I'm saying is that with that same applied normal force (96 ft lbs) with the anti-seize vs dry there will be a difference in clamping force between the fasteners. Obviously not significant enough for the Porsche engineers to change the spec but it's there. Equal force with less friction on a bolt equals more clamping force.
Most if not all anti-seize compounds have the same base ingredient, mineral oil, and as the base compound has the highest percentage in weight of the anti-seize. Mineral oil being a lubricant changes the coefficient of friction between the two surfaces.
My guess as to why they have changed it with the coated wheel bolts is that there is a significant enough change in the coefficient of friction between the coating and the rotor to decrease the clamping force. If we only had the friction coefficient for these scenarios.
05-03-2017, 07:32 PM
