Speedyellow993

At $350,000 you could buy a used Ford GT and a 993 TTs and have enough cash left for a RS4 winter beater.

Three for the Price of One. It's a tough call.

Calling Jamie140..... Maybe Ford will treat you better then World Fine Cars...LoL!!!

boman993

Yes, that's why you see so many older RHD Japanese cars running around the
city, anything over 15 years and it's all good.

Didn't go this weekend.

911 Rod

I'd be all over this if it was red .... wait....

CarbonTT

Im gonna go by and check it out tomorrow

DALLWA

I'm in the market for a new ride. Was thinking GT3RS but ....

LastMezger

Probably the dealer principal.

Turbodan

there are a number of 959s here in Toronto. And since over 25 can be brought in no problem. IMO based on past cars offered and sales 350 is way over the top. most likely owned by owner of dealership on put on consignment to get some traffic in there. great cars though. Bill Gates had 2 one that he crash tested so he could license the other. Canepa in Cali specializes in these even though they are major scammers ( do a search on here). I would like a white one. I have a 1/18s one in red. cool mirrors. I believe it is water cooled too.

Imo000

What does this mean? Sorry but I'm not familiar with the lingo

BioBanker

Owner

theiceman

Although advanced for its day i see it is nothing special by todays standards. Cool. Factor alone justt doesnt do it for me.

swbatte

Oooooohhhh....

Torontoworker

Not exactly true. He didn't own two 959's and they didn't crash test any of them. The second car was actually Paul Allen's car that they bought at the same time when Allen was still his partner at Microsoft. All of the 959's imported were impounded and allowed to be stored in the back lot of Holbert Porsche under seal.

The cars were imported under a bit of a scam in that PCNA looked the other way as Holbert took deposits on the car and they were imported as 'race cars'. The deal for importation agreed to by the factory was that Holbert (who was hired as Porsche USA motorsports boss and shortly thereafter died in a plane crash) was going to take care of the ECU work, cat install and in fact one of the cars was 'supposed' to have it's frame put on a sled and crash tested with the NTHC watching. That was the story that was told to the factory. Did the factory turn a blind eye or was the head of PCNA being a little loose with the truth on US Government agreements? Was Al Holbert being used in this scam? Was he the impetus behind the plan or just a willing participant? No one in Porsche wants to talk about this era and was it coincidence that the head of PCNA was fired not too long after?

As far as the cars after Al died:

They sat in the back of Holbert's facility as the cars were found out to have been imported under falsely stated use, (illegal). None were race cars as the original stated purpose (to be used in a one make race series).

The cars were subjected to a 120 day 'in country' deadline (to make the cars pass EPA/CARB and DOT standards) and as a result of being in the country past the 120 days - the cars had seals placed upon their doors with a notice that these cars are 'impounded' by the US Customs branch and removal without approval was subject to arrest.

And they they sat and sat and... etc. In the meantime, several owners of these cars contacted the US Customs office to ask permission to remove their cars back to Germany and this was granted. Several US owners sold their cars for more then they bought them once the cars were repatriated to Germany and retitled there by the US owners, (then sold afterward). This method was 'encouraged' by Porsche and they were reported as being very 'helpful' and 'accommodating' for this preferred option. Rumors were that the factory 'helped' with the shipping costs, German re-registration and finding buyers for these cars brought home. What the factory didn't want was these cars remaining in the US market with people fighting the Government over and over to make them street legal. It was considered (and still to this day) a black eye for the organization.

The hard count on how many cars were left after this is fuzzy - but one PCA member (via Pano) who used to look over the back fence whenever his car was in for service estimated there were still a 12-15 cars there up to 2000.

The widow of the Holbert estate was the driving force behind the cars leaving the dealership when she sold her part ownership in the business. PCNA then had to find a place to store the cars and thereafter the remaining cars were sent to a warehouse in Vegas (PNCA had moved here for a short time in the early 90's) subject to Customs agreement.

Everything changed for the 959 when the 'show and display' law was passed in the US (thanks mainly to Bill Gates lobby efforts) as these cars could now be plated and driven as long as their total yearly mileage did not go over 2500 miles per year or some such low number. There was also a requirement that the cars had to pass the CARB tests even if not located in Calf. That's where Canepa's claim to fame comes from as he did the first cat install on Gate's car and through that connection (and experience) became the go to guy for getting a 959 to pass the CARB tests. A few of the other owners went to other shop's - hence the animosity from these groups who feel their contributions were overlooked or distorted by Canepa.

As far as this red one here:

The only 959 with a Transport Canada tag on the door sill (pre show and display law in the US) was the car mentioned here as being serviced by Brent Hunter. It was red, but I'm not sure it is the one pictured here. As far as I was told by Brent - it wasn't for sale and is stored safely away underground somewhere under a Bay Street condo along with the other multi exotic's the owner has. This car was the first one in Canada and the first to be plated legally in Canada and has been here for years. It came out of the back of Holbert's yard before the movement of the other cars to Vegas. 'How' it came to Canada and 'how' it got the Transport Canada sticker is really fuzzy...

I have no knowledge of the how and why but I can speculate that the owner must have had contacts high up in the Federal (Liberal party connections?) Government.

This is the car that Brent Hunter serviced (photo from his website)


It's all a moot point now as these cars can now be imported into Canada as per many have mentioned here as to their age. It is interesting to note that any that were here 'illegally' (and there were a few) had to be shipped back to Germany and re-imported in order to qualify under vintage rules. Of course taxes are applied once again as Transport Canada do not recognize the car as legal no matter how long it was here or how it got here! It would be interesting to hear the reactions from your insurance company when you give them a 1997 or 1998 VIN# from a 959!

My wife has a girlfriend with a TVR that she was trying to sell to an American - what a complicated mess. She would pretty much have to wait until the car is 25 years old before she (and an American) would have a decent and hassle free chance of selling it down there. Show and display would be the only way the guy could import it into the US as apparently TVR's seem to be more hated then 959's! The buyer walked.

LastMezger

Yes...the owner's car.

I always assume (perhaps erroneously) when I see a Ferrari at a Hyundai store or a $350,000 Porsche at a Ford store that it's probably the guy that owns the dealership(s).

Just because he sells Fords doesn't mean he drives one;-)

Christien

There are many ways of getting around this. Not legal or legit, but cash greases hands very efficiently.

I had the unfortunate luck of having a car go through auction that turned out to have been illegally imported into Canada many years ago. The best we could deduce was that it crossed the border into Windsor with US plates and was registered here at an MTO office by someone's friend, which probably included a couple pink or brown bills. Dealer went bust long ago, and I was left holding the bag with a car that couldn't be resold.

Richard930

I remember seeing that 959 at a UCR Concours a few years back at Appleby. One of the not-too-highly-respected used car places that deals in Porsches (World Fine Cars or Autoforum or one of those places) brought it out and showed it off. I seem to remember back then that they were looking for $350 - $400k for it. By todays standards the performance is just OK, but back in the late 80s it was pretty much the "dogs bollocks" as the Brits would say, along with the F40. As an 80s technological tour de force there was nothing else that could compare at the time. Great for a collector but I'd hate to see the costs of owning it - you probably couldn't drive it in any traffic for fear of body damage as those carbon kevlar body panels are pretty much irreplaceable (I heard $40,000 for the engine lid/tail alone). Still, if I had the means I'd be interested!

IIRC, heads were water cooled like on the 962