boman993

Hey guys, quick question for all of you. Does anyone know where I can access
"Canadian Red Book" values..? About to pull the trigger on my first Porsche,
and want to have an idea of what the value MTO will use to charge me HST
on... Apparently they don't always go by what's on the bill of sale..

trickydisco

Yo Jakob... my experience has always been that the bill of sale was used to calc taxes.
I think the declared price would have to be a pretty far outlier for them to discard the bill of sale in favour of the RedBook.
Having said that, i've seen them at public libraries.
....black on cashmere?

Turbodan

Get the used vehicle package that by law a private seller if local must provide. It shows red book. If it is over 14 yrs old it needs an appraisal unless it is from a dealer

LastMezger

They had my 1990 964 in their computer when I sold it last spring. I believe $15,000 was the value they put on it but buyer paid taxes on actual transaction amount which was higher.

boman993

Thanks for the replies! Yeah, I realized later that the average wholesale/retail
pricing is listed in the UVP.

Christien

This is accurate - unless your bill of sale is ridiculous, they'll go with that. When I bought an 83 944 for $3000, they looked at me funny, because it was a Porsche, but when I explained, then said "go outside and look at it" they accepted it.

Huh? Where did you get that from? That's not even slightly accurate!

Turbodan

Chris,
what do you think it is? please correct me if I am wrong,
my understanding (according to recent changes) is that if you buy a car from a private seller that is over a certain age, and I think it is 14 years, then you need an appraisal from an appraiser or a dealer or maybe a garage.

Christien

The only time you would need an appraisal is if your price is suspiciously low, maybe because it's a project car, parts car, etc. and the MTO clerk doesn't believe you. Or for a 19a insurance policy, of course. I'm not sure where you got that info from, but it's definitely incorrect. Mto has all the info on their website, if you want to verify.

Cosmo Kramer

Danny is correct, when I bought my 928 three years ago, the MTO would not let me register it without an appraisal. They wouldn't even give me a trip permit to drive it home from Mississauga, I had to borrow a dealer plate from a friend. The appraisal was BS anyway, the appraiser asked me what I wanted it to say and filled it out accordingly.

Sciloh

appraisals are only required if you have the 19A endorsement on your insurance

JimV8

I did an internal transfer and sold my van to myself from the business for a dollar and got hit with 8 cents RST. The clerk didn't question the sale even though the sellers package had a range of 1500 to 2500 for the truck so there seems to be flex in the system.

Cosmo Kramer

Two different appraisals, the one for 19A is a lot more involved and more costly. The MTO one is required for vehicles that are 20 years old or more and it can be done by dealers or appraisers. I think I paid 75 bucks for the one I had done for the MTO.

Jaak Lepson

When I bought my 02 Beepster with a blown motor, the garage filled out a form for MOT that explained why the low value. Mine stated the motor was blown and need to be rebuilt. I got the ownership changed and did not plate it. Later (month) I went to plate it after I got a 15 day permit (used my old plates from sold 951) so I can certify/e-test and they only charged me for the sticker. No additional tax was required as it was paid when the engine was rebuilt and re-installed. I brought the receipts just in case ... did not need to show them. No issues to this date.

Turbodan

I actually am a licensed appraiser with the ministry (have been semi-retired up until this month, and this was a fun business I did with my freetime). I personally get calls from people that need an appraisal in order to transfer their privately purchased over 14 year old car. The ministry offices seem to deal with this differently but most in GTA follow the rules and require an appraisal. So Chris unfortunately I feel you are incorrect in your information. This appraisal is just a one page form whereas the appraisal for insurance that I also do are about 10 pages complete with pictures.

Christien

Well, it wouldn't be the first time!

I've never heard of this before and twice registered 14+ year old cars in my name personally (my 72 911 which i bought privately in 04 and an 83 944 which i bought in 06 or 07).

Admittedly, I've done everything as a dealer for several years now, so something could have changed for private transactions that I wouldn't have heard of.

I did search the mto website and found nothing that mentioned anything to do with 14 years, or appraisals required for paying taxes, except with regard to when there's a question as to the car's value.

But mto has been known to do weird things, including different practices in different jurisdictions. So who knows...