Canadian Motor Speedway -- What's up?
12-09-2009, 02:16 PM
#16
Drifting
While I understand the 'hope' behind developments of any kind that can create 'real' jobs and (over and above whatever the odd 1st time poster who has come on here with an agenda and without connection to anything 'Porsche' says…) - my only wish is for this project to go ahead with 100% PRIVATE funding.
If this can be done - then another auto racing site within Ontario is more then welcomed. I think everyone here knows of my doubts, doubts based upon past oval development attempts by many other people and the metrics involved in these types of things.
I don't know why people argue emotionally over what I view as a financial issue but it is what it is I guess. However, there are no emotions in the numbers - they either add up or they don't. You wouldn't buy a car this way - why would you treat a huge development any other way?
Simply put - if these guys asked everyone in the Niagara region (or Ontario) to give them $1000 of your own money as an 'investor, would you do it? Probably not, right? Then why when politico types give YOUR money away don't you storm the gates - because it IS the same thing when they hand over the farm and title to it.
Bad enough we gave an off shore group (AGR) money for the Toronto Honda Indy race - at last count $5 million over five years. I have a connection to the Toronto race having worked the event since 1986 as a volunteer and I voiced my objections (in a letter to the Premier) in 2008 when it was first proposed the Province “fund” any shortfalls for AGR.
Many of the organizations who stood to benefit by this race, (offshore owned hotel groups) now realize the fallacy of the ‘visitor’ numbers bandied about as the reasons for Government funding, (equating to filled hotel rooms).
There is a report that will never see the light of day and that report showed that the vast majority of the Indy fans in July 2009 came from within the GTA and spent very few dollars downtown while at the race. It cost all of us in this Province $83.33 for each of those fans (estimated count = 12'000) who attended the race on the Sunday. We should have just thrown open the door to the event, an event that we BOUGHT so that at least several thousands more of the local taxpayers could have made the event ‘look’ better on camera.
The Cities of Fort Erie, Niagara and the Region will learn just as Toronto has - that any races held here will only attract ‘drive up’ locals from within a 100km zone and very few of them will be spending much time in the region other then on the QEW.
So yes, I am raising the spectre of perhaps far more public funds being sought out here. I hope not. I hope I'm wrong. I hope this is the most successful privately owned oval anywhere. I hope that they get the two NASCAR dates per year they will REQUIRE to remain open. I hope you all have track rental days that will ‘only’ cost $200 per car. It requires a lot of hope – a leap of faith, but then again, I don’t answer my door on Saturdays to well dressed guys with briefcases carrying brochures either..
I'll shut up now and sit back and see how this all turns out.
Happy Holidays everyone.
If this can be done - then another auto racing site within Ontario is more then welcomed. I think everyone here knows of my doubts, doubts based upon past oval development attempts by many other people and the metrics involved in these types of things.
I don't know why people argue emotionally over what I view as a financial issue but it is what it is I guess. However, there are no emotions in the numbers - they either add up or they don't. You wouldn't buy a car this way - why would you treat a huge development any other way?
Simply put - if these guys asked everyone in the Niagara region (or Ontario) to give them $1000 of your own money as an 'investor, would you do it? Probably not, right? Then why when politico types give YOUR money away don't you storm the gates - because it IS the same thing when they hand over the farm and title to it.
Bad enough we gave an off shore group (AGR) money for the Toronto Honda Indy race - at last count $5 million over five years. I have a connection to the Toronto race having worked the event since 1986 as a volunteer and I voiced my objections (in a letter to the Premier) in 2008 when it was first proposed the Province “fund” any shortfalls for AGR.
Many of the organizations who stood to benefit by this race, (offshore owned hotel groups) now realize the fallacy of the ‘visitor’ numbers bandied about as the reasons for Government funding, (equating to filled hotel rooms).
There is a report that will never see the light of day and that report showed that the vast majority of the Indy fans in July 2009 came from within the GTA and spent very few dollars downtown while at the race. It cost all of us in this Province $83.33 for each of those fans (estimated count = 12'000) who attended the race on the Sunday. We should have just thrown open the door to the event, an event that we BOUGHT so that at least several thousands more of the local taxpayers could have made the event ‘look’ better on camera.
The Cities of Fort Erie, Niagara and the Region will learn just as Toronto has - that any races held here will only attract ‘drive up’ locals from within a 100km zone and very few of them will be spending much time in the region other then on the QEW.
So yes, I am raising the spectre of perhaps far more public funds being sought out here. I hope not. I hope I'm wrong. I hope this is the most successful privately owned oval anywhere. I hope that they get the two NASCAR dates per year they will REQUIRE to remain open. I hope you all have track rental days that will ‘only’ cost $200 per car. It requires a lot of hope – a leap of faith, but then again, I don’t answer my door on Saturdays to well dressed guys with briefcases carrying brochures either..
I'll shut up now and sit back and see how this all turns out.
Happy Holidays everyone.
12-09-2009, 10:36 PM
#17
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They did talk about the money at the meetings, and they did say that it is privately funded from Canadian investors and their overseas partners.
Anyway - today's meeting was with the Planning Committee and it was also a success. My understanding is that now it goes for a council vote with the region. Here's the message I received.
Good day today for the Canadian Motor Speedway Project at Regional Council. The Region Planning Committee voted to send the application to council. A successful day. Step 2 complete. Onward!
PLEASE HELP THE SPEEDWAY BECOME A REALITY BY FILLING OUT THIS FORM. LET THE REGIONAL CLERK KNOW THAT YOU SUPPORT THIS PROJECT.CLICK ON THE LINK BELOW. IT ONLY TAKES A MOMENT AND IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT YOU DO SO. THANK YOU.
http://www.regional.niagara.on.ca/ma...ear&name=Clerk
Anyway - today's meeting was with the Planning Committee and it was also a success. My understanding is that now it goes for a council vote with the region. Here's the message I received.
Good day today for the Canadian Motor Speedway Project at Regional Council. The Region Planning Committee voted to send the application to council. A successful day. Step 2 complete. Onward!
PLEASE HELP THE SPEEDWAY BECOME A REALITY BY FILLING OUT THIS FORM. LET THE REGIONAL CLERK KNOW THAT YOU SUPPORT THIS PROJECT.CLICK ON THE LINK BELOW. IT ONLY TAKES A MOMENT AND IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT YOU DO SO. THANK YOU.
http://www.regional.niagara.on.ca/ma...ear&name=Clerk
12-16-2009, 01:34 PM
#19
Drifting
Here's a link as well: http://www.startribune.com/sports/mo...8cyaiUiacyKUUr
NASCAR is FREE to do as they please now. Anyone who knows the background of this track and the WHY it was built will understand what I have been talking about concerning this series. Wait for the Chapter 11 in a year or two and then when the appropriate time has passed - the buyout at a firesale price by ISC Inc.
When you get into bed with the devil - you better have a fire safety plan and good Nomex!
NASCAR is FREE to do as they please now. Anyone who knows the background of this track and the WHY it was built will understand what I have been talking about concerning this series. Wait for the Chapter 11 in a year or two and then when the appropriate time has passed - the buyout at a firesale price by ISC Inc.
When you get into bed with the devil - you better have a fire safety plan and good Nomex!
12-16-2009, 03:01 PM
#20
Drifting
Torontoworker, I respect your opinion, but I think we should all be supportive of this initiative as car loving people. We still have too few racetracks in the area, especially for the future as the noose gets tightened on our freedom to drive our cars everyday.
I appreciate your points about tax payer dollars, however I'd much rather the government spend this money on something we enjoy rather than on some silly project like a federal program that adds no value (ie, gun registry). I respect that decisions in a business need to have a cost/benefit analysis, however a government contribution should not; a government contribution should be based on the betterment of the people of Canada. In some cases, this means funding an arts related building and in other cases, a racetrack.
You're probably right that this will end in Chapter 11 (history tells us it will), but I gain no benefit by being pessimistic and can only benefit greatly by being optimistic and things working out Just another opinion.
I appreciate your points about tax payer dollars, however I'd much rather the government spend this money on something we enjoy rather than on some silly project like a federal program that adds no value (ie, gun registry). I respect that decisions in a business need to have a cost/benefit analysis, however a government contribution should not; a government contribution should be based on the betterment of the people of Canada. In some cases, this means funding an arts related building and in other cases, a racetrack.
You're probably right that this will end in Chapter 11 (history tells us it will), but I gain no benefit by being pessimistic and can only benefit greatly by being optimistic and things working out
Just another opinion.
12-21-2009, 10:19 PM
#23
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It would be nice to see it get built, but I won't hold my breath. With it located on the USA border it should have a better chance than most Canadian projects by that virtue alone. On a sad note, I just read that St.Thomas Dragway is in a foreclosure mode and up for power of attorney sale.
12-22-2009, 03:26 PM
#24
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It would be nice to see it get built, but I won't hold my breath. With it located on the USA border it should have a better chance than most Canadian projects by that virtue alone. On a sad note, I just read that St.Thomas Dragway is in a foreclosure mode and up for power of attorney sale.
http://www.icx.ca/propertyDetails.as...ertyId=8635758
On a happier note - Regional Council voted to approve the speedway - and so the project moves forward.
