mducharme

Hi everyone
I've been following the post regarding importing from the US. I'm going to put it in perspective now that I have some free time. I'm posting a new topic so no one will miss it.
If your reason is to save money, It will cost you just as much if not more. I'll explain, Lets try 16000.00 for a carrera (about average) 60 to 100,000 miles. Convert to Can. dollars around 22,600 . Now the money has to be brought out of Canada . ( canada customs kwows your intent) Now over to the US side (now they know your intent ) I'll get back to this in a little while. You need a way to carry all that money in another country, I wasn't comfortable with carrying cash, Couldn't use a money order, (cross border takes a week to clear) Certified check same thing.I decided to use travellers checks. This cost me another 150.00. If anyone is wondering why I didn't just wire the money . If the car is private , would you wire money to someone you don't know. And if its a dealer , its pretty hard to negotiate after they have your money.
I used a 100 mile radious to search for a car so I drove , factor the gas ,border cost, lunch, plus the day off work. I'm an ironworker so 200 in wages ,50 in gas, 10 for lunch, 10 for the border, call it 270 + or -.
Two hours on the highway, I'm there. Take a look at the car, Luckily it looks pretty good . I'm very interested so now its PPI time . Car checks out with only a few minor issues , another 200 US.
Now the car is paid for,time to drive it home right, wrong , The title has to be transferred and brought to US imigration for a 72 hour search, If they find any discrepincy in the paper work, you're **** out of luck. I didn't worry to much about this , I bought mine from a dealer. I'm not so sure how I would have felt buying private. After the car is in your name its your baby, If they happen to find a 15 year old lean you're responsible, Broken lease agreement , failed emission same thing. Better to buy from a dealer.
Three days later I'm back at the border getting my title and showing the dealers bill of sale to customs ( dealers don't give phoney bills to guys crossing the border to save tax) . It cost another 150.00 US to have the flat bed deliver the car to the border .
At this point I can head for the Canadian side to pay the applicable taxes gst 1770.00 plus 100.00 excise plus 182.00 process fee (ouch)
Now its off to the ministery of transport for the pst 1900.00 (ouch ouch) Almost forgot safety check 100.00 E-test 40.00 had to do this before I hit the ministery.
So for all you guys thinking its a great deal think again. It cost me nearly 30,000 to get this car home. It kinda took the fun out of it for me.
It's definately not like sneaking a bottle across the border. Way to much money to play games with. Borders play for keeps. Luckily I didn't have to get day time running lights or any imediate service.
I hope this helps Good luck
Mducharme 86 930 turbo
84 carrera cabrio (for sale)

mducharme

Sorry I forgot to get back to the part about money/ borders part, anything over 10,000 has to be declared leaving the country and entering another country. If you don't and they catch you customs will seize it. (non refundable). At both borders they count it and make you sign for it. This makes it very hard to play with the car purchase numbers or tax numbers.All this paperwork has to match when you bring your car back to Canada.
Mducharme

adie

Do you not have to pay pst/gst on a car if brought in Canada any how, as well as safty and emissions. You could drive around Canada looking for a car (apparantly it's bigger than the US, but from what I see there one and the same) seems to me although there are a few more costs, it's not as if the car of you dreams is going to park out side your house and the owner put a for sale sign on it right in front of you. I know I'll have to do a lot of searching for my 993 but I don't think it's going to be cheaper from th US, just more to choose from.

bcameron59

Hey M, great post, and how timely that you should post this as I'm looking seriously at US cars right now, entirely because the selection is vastly better.

However, I'll have to add the nickle and dime "gotchas" you've listed onto my currency conversion & costs spreadsheet. Also, I'd try to get prospective seller to put a condition on sale re: passing US immigration.

Question: the GST looks about right but didn't you have to pay import duty at 6%?

JimV8

Thanks M, good info and you are right of course, there is no free lunch. I think Adie makes a good point about choice though. Still finding the right car is going to take some time regardless. BTW, hope you're happy with the car.

mducharme

Hey Adie , I'm aware the selection is bigger in the US, its how I ended up searching there myself. I live in Windsor , Detroit, Ohio, Indiana, is in my back yard , I consider this my neighborhood. I'm showing you how I bought in a 100 mile radious. What if the car is farther than this ? What if you have to fly there? What if the car doesn't check out? Are you purchasing this 993 with cash you have laying around the house, if not , money has to be in order, Cost of borrowing , cost of converting and so on. You have to kiss alot of frogs to find a prince when it comes to porsches. These guys selling a car love canadian buyers, think about it, You travel along way, you are almost certain to buy. Emotions take over instead of a clear head. This is why I kept my search area so tight. Worst case senario, I blew half a day.
You wouldn't believe how many cars I considered that were not up to snuff because I was sick of traveling to see them.
I know what a good porsche is, still my judgement became clouded at times. I've owned five of these cars in the last 15 years. I kwow them inside and out.
About the PST/GST , When in Canada I always look private, Call any dealer over here and ask about the records, He'll tell you "Oh yeah we have them" When you get there , no records . But alot of excuses.
Private bills can be massaged taxes saved , safty etest 99% of the time are included .
Besides talking with an owner I can tell in the first five minutes if I'm interested or not.
Good luck on the 993
sincerly Mducharme 86 930 turbo
84 carrera cabrio (for sale)

mducharme

Hey B.
The 6% will apply to cars over 1985. Another thing to consider depending on the state there's "state tax" that will have to be paid to have the title (US) transfered to your name,another 6% US. You will see this at the bottom of a dealers bill. If you buy private, it will be payed at the local DMV. by you. (This varies from state to state)
Good luck B
Mducharme 86 930 turbo
84 carrera cabrio (for sale)

adie

Seems like I've been real lucky so far, Still not used to the whole process as the in the UK you justr need the log book, the plates stay with the car and the MOT is valid for the year, no matter who takes ownership. I've never brought a 'posh' porsche as I have always brought the cheapest one I could find and as long as the body looks good I can deal with the rest, not so I fear on the 993, I just want a good everyday car that woun't have to see garage duty in the winter time. I had no Idea the dealers and sellers could manipulate you with telling you they have the paperwork. I wasn't going to figure on taking out a loan, I figure $10000 for my 2 porsches, $25000 from my savings and then use my spare money to find and sort out the car, I don'y have any real intentions of crossing the border though as I'm just too lazy and I have to work, I can't see them letting me take a day off work to look for a car but I can always try. How on earth can you regain the ownership if the car does not have any???? does it become a trust thing??, Everytime I have brought a car (both of them so I qualify as an expert) they have had either the package telling the history ( I know this in only an Ontario thing but I figured that all provinces have the same type of deal except Quebec (but who would want to go there ) ) or the trader had the paperwork on the desk ready for when I paid (just signed the ownership and ta da!). So now my question is also, if you buy from out od province do you have to pay some kind of local fee to register it or does the ownership paper just follow the car (i.e. if I buy a car from BC do I and I register it when I buy it, can I just leave it like that or do I have to register it again when I bring it home???) sounds kind of stupid but when coming from a country that is probably no bigger than some of the proviences I realise that EVERYONE wants a bit of your purse, no matter how they can get it (I'll start complaining when the gas prices reach that of back home).

mducharme

Hey Jim,
I'm aware finding the right car takes time, I totally agree with you and Adie. If Adie has his heart set on a 993 thats great. Although this limits his search. If he wants a certain colour this also limits his search. If he wants a good one, it gets worse. The more narrow of a search the greater the area becomes to search in. Beyond 100 miles you are at the point of paying more than what it is worth. Unless he is fortunate enough to find the perfect car his first time out . Which would surprise me and the rest of the porsche community.
Sooner or later, admit or not ,it all comes down to dollars and cents. If not, next time you see the perfect car on the street , just offer the guy 5000 more than he paid for it.
I'm not trying to be sarcastic Jim , But this would probably be the US equivilent.
Mducharme 86 930 turbo
84 carrera cabrio (for sale)

mducharme

Hey Adie,
Most people are not looking to spend 35000 on a car they have to fix. Anyways , how many 993's have you seen for 35000. None Canadian, lots in the US ,Key word US. This makes you short about 20 grand.
You are probably an expert I'm not doubting your knowledge . I too am not afraid to touch any part of my cars. I'm trying to help the guy thinking there's a big savings buying US.
I'm not sure about the question you asked about the ownership. I'll to answer, You have to pay for the car first, then the US title gets transferred in to your name. Then it gets sent to US imigration. If all checks out with them you can bring the car to Canada. If it doesn't , You can figure it out from there. See what I'm saying about pitfalls.
Mducharme 86 930 turbo
84 carrera cabrio (for sale)

nuck

Adie. When you buy out of province you pay any applicable pst in the province you register. I live in Alberta so when I have bought cars out of Ontario I have not paid PST at all because we don't have the provincial tax here. Same from b.c. I paid a $75 document fee or some such at the BC dealer but once back in Alberta the only other cost was an out of province inspection ($75). You don't register the car where you by it unless you want to run B.C. plates and insurance. I have bought 3 cars out of province. The B.C. car I picked up and the other two I had shipped by Sea Rail which was $900 by train from Ontario to Edmonton.
Mducharme I agree the small costs inc vehicle shipping, gas, hotels and whatever can easily nickel and dime away your savings on a US car and lets not forget that you can probably not get the same $ at resale for a US car, all other things being equal. Once the dollar values get up a little bit it becomes more practical. A friend of mine has been looking around for a 96 911 TT. Decent cars are changing hands in the US for $60,000 USD which today is about $79,000 CDN. With tax and duty it would be $90,000 CDN. The other expenses would at worst run a few thousand so you have your 993 TT for under $100,000 CDN. They don't come up very often but the CDN asking prices for these cars are 110-120 thousand plus GST if it's from a dealer and I'm not talking about garage queens.. This is not much less than a 996 TT if you can find one privately.The same guy was looking at Countach's a while back and it was exactly the same thing. With so few exotics coming up for sale in Canada the sellers, usually dealers, will try to bend you over even worse then they do on new models. On the other hand the prices for 996 coupes, in Ontario at least, seem pretty reasonable. The only alternative my friend has is to find a rare private deal since the 993 TT the dealer is asking $115,000 for probably only got the previous owner 70k on his trade . Funny how that works.

mducharme

Hey Nuck,
I agree with you 100% , If your buddy gets his 993TT for under a 100,000 he's happy right. I mean in Canada. He's not going to say to the seller it can be bought in the US much cheaper. These are the potential buyers I'm seeing for the last month. There's this terrible myth out there porsche's can be bought for a song and dance in the US. Your buddy would be happy with a 15% savings when in most cases people are expecting a 50% savings if they buy in the US.
Look around on this board you'll see what I am talking about
Mducharme.

delhi

there's a 96 993TT going for 79k. and it has ~30,000km. worth a look for anyone that can swing it. Same price as an M3 (sorta).

Alon

What? A 993TT for $79k? That must be $79k USD, right? If that is in Canadian dollars, please let me know who has this car ASAP.

Thanks,

Alon

DJF1

how would you get financing though for a car that you buy in the US???