paradocs98

Was at our local Pole Position indoor karting venue today for Fathers Day--my wife and kids know me well--and noticed that they had a large Cruden racing simulator in the lobby. Only $12 for 6 minutes, so I gave it a try. Very impressive looking. Huge platform with three seats, perched on massive hydraulic rams. Seating is like 90s McLaren F1, with driver in middle and passengers on either side slightly behind. Sparco seats, harnesses, and Tilton pedal assembly. I believe the software is called Panthera. It looks and runs much like iRacing. Car was programmed as something like an Aussie V8 supercar or BTCC car, and track was the Glen.

Didn't love it. Was surprised by this. All controls seemed slow to respond, like motoring a sailboat into a dock slip. The brake pedal was heavy with absolutely no feel, zero feedback. Squat, dive and roll from the hydraulics were exaggerated and unrealistic, almost cartoon-like. Overall a very numb, removed experience.

Had to have been an expensive setup. Are all dedicated simulators this bad? I can't believe that the pros would find this level of "realism" acceptable. Really made obvious how much sensory input we get in real life on the track to tell us what's happening, and how much we depend on it.

Picture of similar setup attached. Thoughts?

ProCoach

That's an old-timey Cruden Hexapod. Ten years old. Too much latency. Probably running open source simulation like Racer. Crappy. Boris Said and I got sick on the ones at VIPER down at VIR.

paradocs98

That's funny, Peter. I got nauseated as well. Was counting down the seconds on lap 3 for my time to run out. Are the newer platforms much improved?

Sir5n

The SimCraft I've been in rocked it...literally.

ProCoach

There are many ways to effect motion.

D-Box, Blue Tiger (now Eleetus), VRX, CXC and Simcraft are all out there and do things different ways. I like the D-Box, but haven't tried the CXC and am not a fan of the others.

When your inner ear senses motion that doesn't jibe with what your eyes see, it's not good. It's a serious issue and one recognized by the military. Not surprised with your reaction.

Sir5n

Funny you point out the sea sickness side effect. I brought a co worker who raced and the owner warned us about this side effect.

We work on boats so we had no problem but it's a real thing I've heard about from others. It's amazing how powerful the visual inputs from a sim can be. Ship bridge simulators when programmed to run with heavy weather settings can cause you to feel like the room is moving.

It isn't of course but your brain says it is.

https://vimeo.com/91272399.

tvr-4

I tried a CXC machine at a trade show a couple of years back running WGI in a Z3 GT3 car and thought it was an awesome experience.

Very balanced, good feel, realistic feedback.

johneecatt

I tried one at the Porsche Experience in Carson. Hated it - like OP suggested, really slow and cumbersome. Nothing realistic at all about it. Can't see how it would help any real-world situation.

User 52121

I have yet to try a motion platform that felt "correct". Always a delay (latency).

The folks I know that love them either say "you just have to get used to them" or "it was probably set to exaggerated settings on purpose to be more of a 'thrill ride' for those trying it."

So... *shrug*. Still a delay that's noticeable. Now the only time I got actual motion sickness is when I tried motion combined with VR. That was *immediate*.

jlanka

Is motion really necessary?

My993C2

Motion is probably more of a distraction, especially where there are no Gs.

VR is awesome though. VR is worth it.

ProCoach

IMO, no. Motion is more of a distraction, than an aid. At least for my purposes. I have not tried every system, either. The ButtKicker, D-Box and other sensory aids work well though.

As a Oculus DK1, DK2 and now Rift user, I agree. VR enhances tremendously. But I think people need to develop their sensitivity for the VR environment, just like for triple screens. Most should stick with single screens, as least starting out.

Frank 993 C4S

For me - no. But it depends what your goals are.

MSR Racer

I agree. Motion is rubbish. A good DD wheel, top level brake set (HE), butt kicker and oculus are all you need.

Recently introduced irFFB software brought more detail to the wheels in iracing.

User 52121

I agree with these suggestions, if only because I'm biased and have a DD wheel and HE pedals, and an Oculus Rift LOL.

What is this "irFFB software" you reference?