Huge crash at VIR
#17
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Scott, the normal line is full drivers right until after the end of the North Course cut-through road.
Cisneros in the slower GTC car is more than a car width off the edge of the road, akin to driving down the middle of it, reducing the options of Holzer in the faster GT car to get by.
I was ready to think that the GTC car was in the wrong because of that until I saw the tangent of the GT car immediately before contact moving AWAY from the left edge and towards the GTC car.
Now, I agree with you. An apparent error on Marco's part.
It appears the GTC car was going straight (even if he was out of proper position) and that the GT car either thought he was clear (or going to be) or forced the issue to make the GTC car back down and optimize his entry to the left sweep before climbing the hill. In essence, he drove into Cisneros and forced him off the road. The contact was side-to-side...
Bad deal, all around.
Cisneros in the slower GTC car is more than a car width off the edge of the road, akin to driving down the middle of it, reducing the options of Holzer in the faster GT car to get by.
I was ready to think that the GTC car was in the wrong because of that until I saw the tangent of the GT car immediately before contact moving AWAY from the left edge and towards the GTC car.
Now, I agree with you. An apparent error on Marco's part.
It appears the GTC car was going straight (even if he was out of proper position) and that the GT car either thought he was clear (or going to be) or forced the issue to make the GTC car back down and optimize his entry to the left sweep before climbing the hill. In essence, he drove into Cisneros and forced him off the road. The contact was side-to-side...
Bad deal, all around.
#18
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I have a feeling that Marco thought Cisneros would lift a lot and let him get by and on line. A lot of GTC drivers will do that, but not all of them. Very tough position to be in and it was at about the worst place on the track to have that issue.
#19
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Look at this CNN story: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...rial&hpt=hp_t2
"Spectators Narrowly Dodge Airborne Car in Scary Crash."
Really? Spectators????????
"Spectators Narrowly Dodge Airborne Car in Scary Crash."
Really? Spectators????????
#20
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Sad that CNN have to stretch the truth to get more readers.
#22
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Being a coach, im sure you would tell any driver to have some patience at VIR, there are plenty of places to pass (especially in a faster car).
Why would marco push the issue, i know its racing but someone could have been killed or seriously hurt (racer, flagger, camera man).
Why would marco push the issue, i know its racing but someone could have been killed or seriously hurt (racer, flagger, camera man).
I don't think Cisneros or Holzer intentionally wrecked, but the pecking order in multi-class pro racing would lead a GT driver (especially a factory-backed one) to want to get by a slower class GTC car and take significant chances to do it, especially if he saw the GT cars in front getting a clear shot through the Uphill Esses and he had to wait.
I would think that Holzer thought Cisneros would have seen the GT class car coming up on him and would have been surprised that Cisneros was NOT in the proper position (right of center, instead of drifting into mid-track), but that doesn't excuse Holzer from turning the wheel right, towards Cisneros.
It's a 2 hour, 45-minute race, and even in my coaching for the 40-minute ITC or 50-minute Lamborghini Super Trofeo races, on the radio I constantly reinforced with my clients the virtues of patience...
Just glad everyone is ok, ESPECIALLY the workers and camera guy.
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#25
Burning Brakes
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Without being in the car and just from watching the video and driving in that race, I can't fault Marco alone in that crash. While either driver could have clearly done something different to avoid it, it was well within the norm for that event at that location.
Marco was along side the GTC car for most of the straight. I heard some people at the track thinking Eduardo was trying to block the GT car to keep track position.. but to me it looked like he was creeping over while looking in his mirrors (ie: target fixation, not blocking/defending). Not sure if that was the case or not. But even if he was trying to defend against the pass it seemed to me that the GT car was far enough up along side that it's reasonable to me for Marco to assume the other driver sees him (it wasn't a last minute dive to the apex).
On a scale of 1-10 for risky passes I experienced by faster traffic in the race at that location (and into T14 where even out GTC car is > 160MPH) I'd only rate that maybe a 5 at most. Overtaking happens like that all day long...
-mike
Marco was along side the GTC car for most of the straight. I heard some people at the track thinking Eduardo was trying to block the GT car to keep track position.. but to me it looked like he was creeping over while looking in his mirrors (ie: target fixation, not blocking/defending). Not sure if that was the case or not. But even if he was trying to defend against the pass it seemed to me that the GT car was far enough up along side that it's reasonable to me for Marco to assume the other driver sees him (it wasn't a last minute dive to the apex).
On a scale of 1-10 for risky passes I experienced by faster traffic in the race at that location (and into T14 where even out GTC car is > 160MPH) I'd only rate that maybe a 5 at most. Overtaking happens like that all day long...
-mike
#26
Agent Orange
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A bit of a contrarian view from me on this accident. It was the flagger's fault, assuming the Cup car didn't see the RSR. Because if he did, he should've lifted. The flagger was supposed to warn the GTC drivers of approaching faster traffic and there was no blue flag waving. The guy was casually holding it. I don't see this as Holzer's fault.
#27
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Mike,
We must be watching different videos. The RSR was at most one third of a car length in front on the Cup Car. The driver of the RSR had to have seen the Cup car right next to him. If he didn't, well, that's just wrong. The Cup Car was holding his line. The RSR moving over like that afforded no time to the Cup Car driver to do anything. He was along for the ride at that point.
Even if the Cup Car should not have been there, what the RSR driver did caused the wreck. He should have left the Cup Car racing room and NOT run into him.
Scott
We must be watching different videos. The RSR was at most one third of a car length in front on the Cup Car. The driver of the RSR had to have seen the Cup car right next to him. If he didn't, well, that's just wrong. The Cup Car was holding his line. The RSR moving over like that afforded no time to the Cup Car driver to do anything. He was along for the ride at that point.
Even if the Cup Car should not have been there, what the RSR driver did caused the wreck. He should have left the Cup Car racing room and NOT run into him.
Scott
#28
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Sure looks like that corner station is not well placed. A slightly different trajectory and that GTC car lands in the bunker with those people having no place to run (being a bunker surrounded by barriers and tires).
#29
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Nice drive, Mike. Came by a few times but I missed you.
#30
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Patience, patience, patience.
Because there is ample evidence, including this incident, of why its absence leads to unhappy endings.
Because there is ample evidence, including this incident, of why its absence leads to unhappy endings.