Jack667

Hi guys -
See below for all the background and details, or just dive right into the HD video:



I'm new to tracking my C2S but I have about 13 years of driving, mostly NA 944, DE, Instructor for the past ~10 years, Club raced a few years, have done as many as 20-25 days in a year and now down to 4 or less. May ramp up to 4-8 days/year, but goal is to be fast and safe in DE.
944 broke 2 years ago and I took my C2S out on stock tires and brakes that weekend. Last weekend was my first event since then, so I was a bit rusty.
The car is a 2006 C2S coupe, damptronics, RSS sway bars, drop links, rear toe kit and dogbones, Wevo mounts, and otherwise stock. I added 18" Allegeritas, 8.5 in front and 11 in the back shod with NT01s, 245 and 315. Pads are Pagid Yellow/Black.
I can critique myself a bit: inconsistent lines, maybe too much sliding around - to the point where I may lose some speed, and sub-optimal shifting on front straight (should go up to 5th and then back down to 4th, but I don't like to bother. Instead, I ride the last third of the straight at just under 7k RPM).
This is a DE event, with one lap just after a warm-up lap (note the waving green), then a couple of good measure. I have a C student in the car (in an A, B, C, D format, where A is sort of Solo), and I'm talking him through some things that I hope is not too annoying, but sheds some light on my thinking at times.
My philosophy on the gators (curbing) is that I don't try to hit it, and my line should keep me off of them, but if I get in a position where I should be on them, I'll just drive over them with no fear or concern, but it's not that I was meaning to to that. I don't mind being on them - but it's not the plan. To me, it just doesn't make sense to hit them on purpose in a DE. But - I drive pretty close to my limit and I'm on them a fair amount of the time.
I'm thinking of getting some professional instruction, but maybe just a pro associated with a PCA DE event. In the meantime, I figure I'll open myself up to the experts here.
I'm just a second or two faster than I was with my H-class 944NA before they repaved the track a few years ago. I know I'm not out as much, and I'm a bit rusty, but I should be at least 5+ seconds faster, maybe 10 if I was really pushing it?
TIA
Jack

Astroman

You can go MUCH faster in Turn 1 and up the hill through 2 and 3. Get all over the Turn 3 curbs to straighten it out.

Turn 5 is much faster too especilly if your car can use all the exit curbing.

Turn in earlier for 6 and carry more speed there too.

Jack667

All good info. Thanks!

I think my car (and I) handle the exit curbing at 5 really well. Are you expecting to be on it every lap? 2 wheels or 4, or is it just a buffer (which is how I treat it now)
I always feel like the curb at 3 is a bit rough, but maybe I need to just suck it up.
I also like the ideas for 1 and 6. I figured I was overbraking into 1.
What line should I take into one (early/late apex) and how far should I track out there?

LostSouth

I'm fairly new to this, so I won't comment on your line, but given your car, I believe your times are pretty solid. I've been using David Richardson as a benchmark around Road Atlanta. He runs a 99 C2 that he said was a bit down on power, has some aero work, big brakes and definitely lighter than us. I believe his qualifying times were just shy of 1:35 and his race times were around 1:38.

On your other comment, I've been in touch with Seth Thomas on some professional coaching. He likes to use the Chin events. Maybe he would work with both of us and we could share some of the cost.

dbf73

you know you've done 1 right when you think you've gone in way too fast and then the hill (barely) catches you

Astroman

The DE "turn-in" cones are good reference points for your students but are too late for someone with your experience.

Turn in for Turn 1 earlier (when the pavement starts to curve in) and then hang on. Pedal to the metal at the apex and all the way up the hill and through 2. I try not to track all the way out in 1 but I use more of the track than you do.

The Turn 3 apex curbs are not bad if you are going fast and get way up on them. The right side tires are not loaded.

I straddle the exit curbs in 5. If you put 4 wheels over them (you can), it's too hard to get back left before the pavement ends/grass starts.

Slow RSA

I'm no expert either, so if people are throwing around some road atlanta advice, I wouldn't mind a bit either! Fast forward a lap or two for some clear traffic...

Jack667

Great info Jack and dbf!
Thanks!!

PM sent to LostSouth
Jack

944hal

Have to agree with Astroman. Turn in a little earlier to T1 and let the car track out further. I stay off the apex gator at T3 if possible. Upsets the car balance. You should be able to get on the throttle before the apex of T3 and carry it to the the top of the Esses. I Bump the turn in gator on T5. Gives me a later apes and usually keeps me off the track out gator. The only gators I try to get up on are 10A and 10B.

My opinion, hope it helps. Criticism accepted!

BTW......didn't the # 667 reside on a Red 951 at some point. Neighbor of the Beast, if I remember correctly.

Veloce Raptor

Yep, gotta use pretty much every inch of the T3 apex curb to straighten it out & stabilize the car before bending it left into T4.

Here is a picture of me in T3, driving David Richardson's car a few years ago when we co-drove in a 3 hour enduro in it at RA.

Astroman

Cool pic, VR.

Jack667

More great info - thanks. Wrt turn 3 curb, I get that it's a faster race line and I feel like I have enough experience to drive a race line, but I just didn't want to beat the crap out of my street car for a DE trophy. I liked that comment about the right side of the car being unloaded, and that intrigues me enough to try it out more to see if I can get it right.

Regarding 667, I had that number on my cars in Boston, starting in 2000, before moving to ATL in 2003. It's a mix of birth years for my wife and I, since we're were co-driving the car back them. 66 for me and 67 for her (don't ever tell her I let that out). Also, 667 just sounds fast! It wasn't till we moved south that we found another 667 and that guy did have it labeled 'the neighbor of the beast'. He sold the red 944 long ago and I think the new owner changed it up. I lost track, though...

Veloce Raptor

I hear you about beating up the car. On a street car, the right tires should just glide right over the rumbles because the car is (relatively) soft and that side is heavily unweighted.

Jack667

Thanks VR, and that is a great photo!

TraqGear

Looks like you could be more aggressive...points already made here. But, a ton easier to critique if you could put up some cockpit video IMO. Then we can see how much of it is do to handling, driving technique, etc. For example, if the car is handling very poorly, it may be difficult to go much faster. Hard to tell without seeing your hands/throttle, etc.