winders

Out here, in Northern California, Hawk Blue 9012 brake pads are a popular choice for light (~2000 lbs) air-cooled 911-based GT cars. These cars are using 11.5 x 16 and 13 x 16 Goodyear bias-ply slicks. The guy that built my race car uses these pads in his 1900 lbs GT-2 car that is usually the class winner. He is a pretty smart guy.

Due to class rules, my car is a little heavier at ~2150 lbs and has at least 80 HP less. It uses the same 11.5 x 16 and 13 x 16 Goodyear bias-ply slicks and has 930 calipers front and rear. My car is currently using the same Hawk Blue 9012 brake pads.

Now, my friend Mike (Mahlers9th) will think I am crazy for asking this because he uses the Hawk Blue pads and he thinks I should use what my builder is using and what he is using. He'll say "They're proven to work".

But I ask will anyway.

You racers with light air-cooled 911 GT-2 and GT-3 class cars, what brake pads are you using? Have you ever tried the Hawk Blue pads? What did you think of them?

I ask this because I understand that the Hawk Blue pads are older technology and can be harder on rotors than some of the new pads. In the Hawk line, the DTC-60 pads are supposed to better. Thoughts?

When I raced bikes, I preferred Performance Friction and Carbone Lorraine (now CL) brake pads. I understand the PFC 97 pads work well as do the CL RC6 and RC6E.

Thoughts?

Scott

Matt Romanowski

Raybestos makes the best race pads I've ever you by far. Call Porterfield and talk to the girl that answers the phone - she is very knowledgable and will hook you up with the right compound.

Carrera51

Scott:
Are the Blues chewing up your rotors? Have you taken caliper and rotor temp readings at the track? If you have and are not heating the Blues up past their maximum effective temp, then no reason to make a pad change since you sound like you are happy with them.

The Hawk DTC are supposed to be easier on the rotors. They are considered a "high torque" pad whereas the Hawk Blues 9012s are considered a medium to high torque pad. The DTC also has a higher temp range than the Blue.

onefastviking

Hawks can be fast pads, they have the stopping power needed.
PFC's operate in a larger temp range so they are easier on the rotors and it's easier to stay in the sweet spot of the pad for more drivers.

Cory M

+1

Porterfield sells their own brand along with Hawk, PFC, and Raybestos. They can tell you what will work well with your set-up. NASA and POC racers get a discount too.

Veloce Raptor

+1. Consider PFC06 or evven 08. Not too much initial bite (which would over slow a lightweight car) but excellent modulation to aid pointing the car into the corner.

analogmike

pfc for the win. anyone want a slightly used set of hawk blue?

Mahler9th

Juicy... better than a long discussion about whether there is such a thing as a "momentum car..."

stop it. (I love that Ditka segment on ESPN).

I do not think you are crazy. Trying to get $50 per piece lightweight Wilwood rotors (raced on a car like yours at our most commonly-driven tracks) to last more than 30-40 race days is a lofty goal (tongue in cheek).

I would think you were crazy if you were trying to out brake someone based on pads. That would be like me trying to get 1-2 seconds per lap by changing from a TBD to an LSD with no other changes... I might be better off searching for enlightenment with real LSD.

Let us be clear though: my opinion is not based on what the builder is using. It is based on 10 years driving and racing a car very like like yours at our most commonly-driven tracks. For a large number of those years:

1. My car weighed about 2000 pounds without driver and had about 330-350 bhp (crank) estimated.

2. My car had two drivers at most DE and racing events. Two drivers using the car pretty hard.

My car also has a bit more front brake bias than yours.

In those 10 years, I have gone through two sets of Wilwood rotors. I changed from #2 to #3 just because. So I have no reason to change to save rotors.

To be honest, I have only tried one other pad, and that was a used set of Pagid blacks I stuck in front once at Thunderhill as I was without a set of Blues. Used pads, used rotors, no issues.

So as you know, the relatively cheap blues have been fine for me, however, everything else being equal I'd like to get more events out of them. I know one of our guys was thinking about doing a bulk purchase to save a few pennies, and that one of our suppliers has approached us on the same topic. Very modest savings... so not a lot of motivation.

So... save on pads with a change... maybe. Save on rotors, doubtful based on my experience. Of course things were different with my 3000 pound, 300 and later 360 bhp 951. I tried several different brands and compounds.

But I encourage you to find out whether differences amongst pads are in the noi$e for your car, the way you drive, et cetera.

Keep us posted!

KaiB

I use them to clean rotors; two laps and back in to remove them.

Mahler9th

Which of you guys have car's like Scott's with 930 front calipers and Wilwood UL 32 ($41 list each) or UL HP 32 (ooops, now $90 list each)?

My sets #1 and 2 where the cheaper ones, for #3 I bought the higher tolerance HP version... a few years ago when they were about $60.

winders

Mike,

I am actually hoping to find a pad that is friendlier on rotors, lasts longer, and offers better braking performance. It would be great if the cost to use the pad ends up the same as the Hawk Blue as long as I get better braking performance.

The only way I am going to find that pad, if it exists, is to look for it. That means asking questions, doing research, and eventually doing some testing. I may find a better overall pad and I may not. But, if I do what you do, I am guaranteed one thing for sure: no improved braking performance.

Scott

Sean F

it all comes down to how you drive and your braking style/preference. i've tried everything and settled on PFC 97's because I love the big initial bite and ability to modulate through the braking zone. but, I don't care at all about pad or rotor wear or cost - I only care about winning races (which i never do :0 ).

One thing to consider trying - talk to guys in the paddock about picking up their take offs. everybody carries an emergency set of their favorite brand with 20-30% left. see if you can collect some different sets to try out.

Gary R.

I'm not getting involved in the bro-mance spat...

winders

I think the only options for the 930 calipers are the 97 and 01 compounds. What are the pros and cons between these two compounds for a light car?

Scott

onefastviking

The only way to make a race car faster is to try different things, different things work differently for different cars and drivers. Try, test, collect unbiased data and see what works and doesn't work for you.
What you choose to work on can be car related, like what brake pad to use, or even changing your personal driving techniques.
Some people even reach a point where they are happy and content and don't want to go any faster.
It's all good. Whatever makes you happy.

Me personally, a big fan of the PFC 97's, the 01's are very similar with a little change in initial bite. With my driving style/experience level I seemed to like the modulation and temp range of the 97's better than 01's, although I also drive on Hawks and just adapt my brain for the difference in bite and the Hawks are fine also.

Like I previously said, It's all good. Whatever makes you happy.