Monticello - will it survive?!?
08-31-2010, 05:14 PM
#1
Race Director
Thread Starter
Monticello - will it survive?!?
So it appears that this will be the last year that car clubs like PCA, NASA/PDA, Audi-club will be able to rent out the track for a DE / HPDE / Driver's Ed event. And as far as I know, there are no professional racing series events planned for this track, nor are there any car club races scheduled either.
That leaves Monticello Motorsport Club member's track days and their own internal racing series.
So either their membership is really growing by leaps and bounds, or their money gurus have the financial wisdom of a pumpkin rotting in a field. As far as I know, at this point, they don't even have the cash to continue with their "phase 1" building plans.
Will Monti be the next Bridgehampton? Destined to become a lousy golf course? Or will it be more like VIR - abandoned only to become a resurrected Pheonix? Will the track re-open to car clubs once they realize they don't have the means to keep the track going?!?
I have driven the track a couple of times already, and have two more events I'm planning on attending before this season's over. It is a wonderful track - it really has something to offer everyone. And it's real close by to my home -- about the same time it takes me to get to Pocono, even Lime Rock. Would be a shame to not be able to turn some laps there anymore -- without a $25,000.00 membership price tag...
What are your predictions for Monticello?!? Discuss...
-Z-man.
That leaves Monticello Motorsport Club member's track days and their own internal racing series.
So either their membership is really growing by leaps and bounds, or their money gurus have the financial wisdom of a pumpkin rotting in a field. As far as I know, at this point, they don't even have the cash to continue with their "phase 1" building plans.
Will Monti be the next Bridgehampton? Destined to become a lousy golf course? Or will it be more like VIR - abandoned only to become a resurrected Pheonix? Will the track re-open to car clubs once they realize they don't have the means to keep the track going?!?
I have driven the track a couple of times already, and have two more events I'm planning on attending before this season's over. It is a wonderful track - it really has something to offer everyone. And it's real close by to my home -- about the same time it takes me to get to Pocono, even Lime Rock. Would be a shame to not be able to turn some laps there anymore -- without a $25,000.00 membership price tag...
What are your predictions for Monticello?!? Discuss...
-Z-man.
08-31-2010, 05:32 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
All I can say at this point is that the track owner quite adamantly stated to me that there WILL be races in the future at this facility. And from what I can see, they're not running out of money up there by any means.
08-31-2010, 06:10 PM
#3
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-Z
08-31-2010, 08:35 PM
#4
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i'm a member at mmc, and i love it. lower pavilion has been built and used this year, nto sure what "phase 1" u are referring to. club is in great shape financially (note, they built the building over last winter during the deepest part of the recession!) and continues to provide the most amazing venue for the members to work with instructors, track any car they wish, and in my case take a race school taught by some of the fastest racers in grand am. what's yur beef? no 944's at the club? hehe.
08-31-2010, 09:02 PM
#5
Race Director
Thread Starter
i'm a member at mmc, and i love it. lower pavilion has been built and used this year, nto sure what "phase 1" u are referring to. club is in great shape financially (note, they built the building over last winter during the deepest part of the recession!) and continues to provide the most amazing venue for the members to work with instructors, track any car they wish, and in my case take a race school taught by some of the fastest racers in grand am. what's yur beef? no 944's at the club? hehe.
I don't mean to sound like a cheap-skate - but for me, $25k is about half-way to a 996 GT3 upgrade. And when that car lands in my garage, for a nominal fee, I can take to all the other tracks on the east coast.... which to me, is a far better investment.
I love the track and how close it is to my home -- and if it were the only track in close proxomity to me, then the $25k cost to play wouldn't be that bad. But given the fact that there are so many other great tracks in the NE, with substantial history and mystique, (The Glen, Lime Rock, VIR, Mosport to name a few) I think I'll pass on Monticello until it is open again to lowly 944 drovers like me....
When you're up there next year, please turn a lap or two for me....
-Z
08-31-2010, 09:21 PM
#6
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if they dont need money, maybe its a PR strategy? Just a taste to get everyone talking. then provide a means to masses by offering more reasonable membership options down the road? Who knows, im just thinking out loud....I would have liked to check it out....
Kaan.
Kaan.
08-31-2010, 10:24 PM
#7
RL Community Team
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IMHO I think allowing clubs to rent the track was a ploy to lure new members much the way the supposed interest in an F1 race was.
If the club was doing well financially why open it to clubs in the first place?
I belong to a golf club and we expanded our club house and dinning facilities just this past year. We saved a bundle on construction costs because the economy has been so bad. If you want to build something now is the time to do it cheap.
In the end I think MMC will still have a private club component but the track will be available for clubs to rent.
If the club was doing well financially why open it to clubs in the first place?
I belong to a golf club and we expanded our club house and dinning facilities just this past year. We saved a bundle on construction costs because the economy has been so bad. If you want to build something now is the time to do it cheap.
In the end I think MMC will still have a private club component but the track will be available for clubs to rent.
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08-31-2010, 11:44 PM
#9
If the club was doing well financially why open it to clubs in the first place?
09-01-2010, 01:26 AM
#11
Race Director
Thread Starter
Just got a note from someone who wishes to remain anonymous, but allowed me to post this here:
Hi,
Just wanted to share something with you that you can post but not attribute to me (can't say it myself).
I've driven MMC 5 days at this point all with clubs. We get some inside scoop from management / members and it appears that the contracts / bylaws allow MMC up to 8 "Promotional Days" a year and that's how they've been bringing us clubs in. They've been hopeful that widening the exposure via club rental is going to turn into some new members. On average, every time they have a Ferrari club event, MMC scores 1 new paid member of the club. BUT, it appears MMC management / ownership blundered and exceeded that 8 day regulation by a factor of 2 or more. I think the last I checked, MMC had booked something like 16 days (and those are just the ones I know about). They got greedy for the cash we clubs were willing to pay and they took just about anyone that would sign a contract regardless of promotional potential.
So, 4 members reportedly took major issue with "losing" 16 days that they could be driving the track and filed litigation against MMC. Claims of devaluation of their membership due to lower-than-agreed access to the facility, etc. Based on the litigation, MMC apparently is saying they will not be renting the track next year...
One real sad part of this whole saga is that the real victims will be those who can afford it the least - the local area businesses / residents. When our club (PCA) comes into town, we spend a lot of money on lodging, food, gas, etc. With just 8 days a year allowed that probably translates into hundreds of thousands into the local economy from a facility that otherwise appears to provide nothing but property taxes to the area (ie: Members of MMC are clearly not coming into town and spending a couple of nights at the local motel, eating at the great breakfast diner, having steak and wine at the chop house, etc.
Our hope is that somehow this all settles and soon. That perhaps MMC dedicates the "found money" of the 8 or so additional days to improvements for all MMC members to enjoy and goes back to having just 8 days of rental next year. Then I think everyone wins because the members aren't losing anything they didn't agree to when they joined, the local economy gets some revenue, and we get some exposure to another track.
Just wanted to share something with you that you can post but not attribute to me (can't say it myself).
I've driven MMC 5 days at this point all with clubs. We get some inside scoop from management / members and it appears that the contracts / bylaws allow MMC up to 8 "Promotional Days" a year and that's how they've been bringing us clubs in. They've been hopeful that widening the exposure via club rental is going to turn into some new members. On average, every time they have a Ferrari club event, MMC scores 1 new paid member of the club. BUT, it appears MMC management / ownership blundered and exceeded that 8 day regulation by a factor of 2 or more. I think the last I checked, MMC had booked something like 16 days (and those are just the ones I know about). They got greedy for the cash we clubs were willing to pay and they took just about anyone that would sign a contract regardless of promotional potential.
So, 4 members reportedly took major issue with "losing" 16 days that they could be driving the track and filed litigation against MMC. Claims of devaluation of their membership due to lower-than-agreed access to the facility, etc. Based on the litigation, MMC apparently is saying they will not be renting the track next year...
One real sad part of this whole saga is that the real victims will be those who can afford it the least - the local area businesses / residents. When our club (PCA) comes into town, we spend a lot of money on lodging, food, gas, etc. With just 8 days a year allowed that probably translates into hundreds of thousands into the local economy from a facility that otherwise appears to provide nothing but property taxes to the area (ie: Members of MMC are clearly not coming into town and spending a couple of nights at the local motel, eating at the great breakfast diner, having steak and wine at the chop house, etc.
Our hope is that somehow this all settles and soon. That perhaps MMC dedicates the "found money" of the 8 or so additional days to improvements for all MMC members to enjoy and goes back to having just 8 days of rental next year. Then I think everyone wins because the members aren't losing anything they didn't agree to when they joined, the local economy gets some revenue, and we get some exposure to another track.
09-01-2010, 10:22 AM
#12
RL Community Team
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Because at the end of the day they are owned and run by businessmen. When they walk out on any given Saturday and see only a handful of cars on track they suddenly realize that for next to no impact to the membership they can get $15K-$20K/day by renting it to a club (note: I don't know what MMC charges but I know what the other tracks charge). If all of the expenses are already budgeted, this is incremental revenue that goes direct to the bottom line. Do this a few days and suddenly you have the money for a new pool, upgraded paddock, restaurant expansion or money in the owner's pockets. It's a no-brainer.
In the end I think MMC will still have a private club component but the track will be available for clubs to rent.
09-01-2010, 10:47 AM
#13
I'm in....
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Maybe they don't think it has an exclusivity that warrants 25k if you can go with a club and run it for a couple hundred dollars?
09-01-2010, 05:59 PM
#14
What is lost here is that the contracts between MMC and the clubs require, I believe, that the clubs reserve 8 spaces in each run group for MMC members to drive. So the members probably weren’t really losing any time as long as they didn’t mind driving with the common folk.
09-01-2010, 06:03 PM
#15
MMC: The track was never meant to be a race track. It was specifically designed to be a club track that forces you to scrub off all the speed from the high speed straights - which while they boast the longest -are not the fastest. (the back straight runs on from a 60 mph 90 deg turn, whereas the Glen runs on from the top of the esses which can be up to a 140 mph run on). Anyway, I challenge professional races will ever be held there, unless major configuration changes are made (and I'm sure would be welcome).
The $ factor: they have at least a dozen members who could buy the place outright and not even move a decimal place in their bank accounts so I'm sure they'll be fine there. What makes the place special is the not just the membership, but their hardware. Go up on any member day and the cars that turn up are nothing short of spectacular.
If I had forked up the $125k to join when the economy was booming and had to put my driving time on hold for "lowly" porsche club track rentals, I'd take issue as well. I've driven it enough to get quick there and still not love it. I wont' miss it in the rotation. I much prefer driving the extra hour to the Glen.
The $ factor: they have at least a dozen members who could buy the place outright and not even move a decimal place in their bank accounts so I'm sure they'll be fine there. What makes the place special is the not just the membership, but their hardware. Go up on any member day and the cars that turn up are nothing short of spectacular.
If I had forked up the $125k to join when the economy was booming and had to put my driving time on hold for "lowly" porsche club track rentals, I'd take issue as well. I've driven it enough to get quick there and still not love it. I wont' miss it in the rotation. I much prefer driving the extra hour to the Glen.
