sparks259

i do nasa and pca.
afaik passing in both groups is limited to the instructor corps.
as far as the quality of instructors, if you are driving a porsche, why not be instructed by a fellow porsche driver.
nnjr has a three day event @mo, with campers, security( if my memory serves) and we throw some sort of dinner one night during the event.
the big advantage with nasa, is being on track with other makes of cars.
i would check the amount of track time with each group, and if pca is close or more, it is a no brainer.
btw-------unles you ARE a racer, you will be abiding by drivers ed rules regardless of which group you decide to drive with.

sparks259

i should have prescreened my post.
passing IN THE TURNS is limited to the instructors.
otherwise, passing would rquire a hand signal.
sorry about that.

Kein_Ersatz

The MORPCA will do a PCA vent in May with CLub Racing intermixed, but may be limited to "A" & "B" groups only. NNJR PCA event also in May if I recall (as someone else pointed out), 3 days, good value. I did multiple PCA DE's at MO this year (my first year) and all had good instructors, typically 4 sessions of 20-25 minutes a day, all good people and good value. Most held a Saturday social gathering / feeding.

Also MidOhio sometimes offers "test and tune" sessions on Friday evenings ($195) with 3 sessions of 20+ minutes each. Makes for a very compact session in one evening. 1st grp is race car tuning / race licensed / PCA instructors (all solo, no riders). Second grp is PCA DE like (solo, no instructors in car), many MO class grads in that grp. 3rd group is "follow the leader / swap places" with MO instructor in the lead, they also give "demo" laps in grp 2 for grp 3 drovers.

I did one this year (grp 2) and was on the track with just 4 other cars. :-) Another time there were 8 cars. Don't know if they plan on doing them again next year. Sometimes they are before a DE weekend and can be combined with a DE weekend event.

Sterling Doc

No, anyone in HPDE 4 can pass in the corners, not just instructors.
Not everyone makes it to HPDE 4, either, though.

To the OP, both are great organizations. The relative merits have been well stated above. I'm a race junky, so the NASA ladder was perfect for me.

Rob in VA

+1

If you can only do two weekends a year you're best eeking out as much time as possible. In my opinion Chin motorsports is the way to go. I've been doing track events for many years and Chin still impresses me.

TroyN

Both clubs are great. I prefer the cameraderie of fellow Porsche nuts, though there are a number in NASA too. I found that in NASA there are a lot of Vettes and Vipers and such so I end up pointing by a lot.

Z-man

I've run/instructred in both PCA and NASA/PDA - both offer what you are seeking - track time with instruction.

In my area, with PCA you get more for you money -- the events are typically less costly and/or you will get more track time for your money. (Side note: I don't go to track events for the fancy dinners or free t-shirts - I go to drive and instruct. Want a nice free meal or free t-shirt - there are plenty of better places for both!)

Your best bet is to try out PCA and see how it fits. If you are a member of both NASA and PCA, you are now opening yourself to more options and dates.

-Z-man.

Potomac-Greg

2nd (re the ladder). I did my first NASA event in October (VIR). Upside is sharing the paddock with racers and seeing how a racer's weekend works. It definitely de-mystified the jump from DE to racing. The HPDE ladder system is good too. I also like the diversity of cars. Downside is that HPDE's seem to get less track time.

JR944

I beleive the NASA/PCA comparison is very different in different parts of the country. Personally, I've had very good experiences with both Ohio Valley and Mid Ohio Region PCA at Mid Ohio.

Having run DE's with something like 14 different PCA regions, I can state that the quality of instructors and instruction is extremely variable and dependent upon how serious the region is about actually offering instruction vs. just an opportunity to screw around at the track. In Denver, I'm afraid the edge goes to NASA.

Joe

paradisenb

I have done plenty of DEs with both groups. For just DE, PCA is the way to go IMO. More track time. Less incidents on track that take away from driving time and they hold a single focus, DE.

NASA is great for climbing the race ladder. The passing in the corners option in HPDE 3 & 4 is great experience. The potencial problem with NASA, and why I seldom DE with them anymore, is whatever time on track clean ups take is taken from the DE run groups. Racers come first.

I stoped when I got a 12 min session so they could make up some lost time. If you plan to work up to racing NASA is a good place to be. Also, racing costs less with NASA though you get less track time.

JR944

As I said, Randy. I think it varies across the country. I don't think any of us can say conclusively that one is better than the other on a National basis. For the OP, I think the PCA regions who run at MO all probably do a very good job.

When I first came to Denver, a couple years ago, the local PCA region offered just 3 sessions on Saturday and two on Sunday (plus two timed laps in a time trial format). I don't know what they will decide to do this year. RMR offers no significant classroom instruction and pretty much no instruction for folks who have progressed beyond novice level.

Mikelly

I guess the question is "what are your eventual goals?"

I was perfectly happy "lapping" without passing in corners until 2008 when I attended a CHIN event. I got promoted to run with the advanced "pass anywhere group" and it's been a slippery slope since. We're getting ready to send our Miata out for a spec cage to be welded in...

PCA provides excellent instruction. You will not go wrong with their DE program. However, most train you to learn to drive your car safely at speeds in a DE. As others have mentioned, PCA DEs aren't geared for "racing."

They also don't give up track time so the racers can race, either.

This past year I started instructing with a couple of groups, and the difference between the groups is a reflection of those who organize and run the events.

If you have racers in charge who race in NASA, you're gonna get a NASA flavored event (trackdaze is run like this) where the goal is to get you to eventually pass in corners, and think in terms of advanced drivers training for eventually going racing. I think Chin is more geared like this as well.

But it really goes back to what I asked at the top of this diatribe... What are your eventual goals?

Mike

jaje

Don't forget with NASA you can volunteer for events in order to get credit towards track time too (where people have more free time than $$ in wallets).

mikew968

As everbody said but Where are your friends driving. Having friends to hang with and go to dinner with over the weekend make all the difference for me. I started with PCA and made many friends and now I race with NASA so I can stay local.

JerryW

I've run with both PCA and NASA here in NorCal. I believe that NASA tries to take the time from what ever group caused the need for the cleanup. Note I said tries.

I think either group is great to run with but PCA has the advantage for Instructors knowing the specifics for the Marque and NASA for the advanced techniques (HPDE3/4).