garrett376

I am putting the finishing touches on the 996 race car and was thinking about the fire system nozzle placement.

Why bother putting a nozzle in the engine compartment or in the front trunk? If I am going to pull the cable to launch the halon, isn't it more important that I don't burn? At that point, who cares about the engine or the front trunk? It seems more important to not waste halon on the machinery that is probably toast anyways.

Has anyone ever pulled the fire system cable JUST for an engine fire? I doubt it... but it makes me wonder. My thinking, based on the engine fires I have witnessed, that the fire "system" never gets used unless the passenger compartment gets engulfed in flames, right? I've only seen someone use their built-in fire system in the pits.... by accident!

Any thoughts from the club racing crew on here? Nozzles necessary outside of the passenger compartment?

TedA

I have three nozzles. One on the fuel rail, one over the fuel tank (944..in the driver's compartment) and one pointing at the driver's twins. Priorities..

chrisp

When I installed my AFFF system (5 liters) I spoke to a few people including the manufacturer and one fireman. Their input was that for a gas tank fire you basically need a large firetruck to put that out. Using an in-car system is hopeless. Conclusion was that it's best to snuff and cool the source of the heat and spark (engine) and protect the valuables (me). I settled on two nozzles in the engine bay and one on me all three of which as directed by the manufacturer. If I owned a 944 or some other car with the fuel tank in the driver compartment I would probably include an extra nozzle on me.

RedlineMan

Hey;

One on the fuel rail is a good idea, since most fires of serious consequence are fuel related. I've also seen 911s have problems when oil lines ruptured and kept dumping oil on the hot exhaust and re-igniting the fire as fire bottles were used up too quickly by inexperienced operators, or not enough bottles were available. If you subscribe to the theory that you'll never get a fuel tank fire out without a flood, which is probably true, then skip that and place two on the driver. One over head on the main hoop, and one pointing up from under the dash at the driver's groin. Instead of one large multi-port system, I had considered having two smaller systems to be used based on where the fire actually was; cabin or engine. Makes sense, in theory.

kurt M

Be sure to plumb the lines and mount the tank in a safe and strong way. I see too many setups that could be damaged in even a small wreck. One I inspected had the tank in the front trunk mounted well in front of the strut towers. Lead with your chin so to speak. The tanks have some good weight to them they need to be mounted so they will not come loose and crimp off the tubing. If it is an AFFF make the tank easy to remove and install. They have to be protected from freezing.

I have one mounted in the front trunk, one on me and one in the motor compartment. The lines run in the center tunnel and stay car center front to back. The tank is in the drivers compartment and mounted in the most recomended location and direction. I also made a micro nozzle of sorts in the line that runs to the back. It runs in a inclosed chase that contains fuel and oil lines isolating them from the drivers compartment.The very small hole in the tube is there to fill the chase with Halon. Halon does not need to be in high concentration to snuff a fire. 5% halon / 95% air mix will prevent and snuff a fire.

ApexPerformance

We have in-car video of a driver at the Nasa Nationals few years ago, got bumped and spun, engine caught fire - he pulled the pull cable. Was really glad he had fire protection. Recommend two on engine bay, one on driver at a minimum.

PS: Article from Sportscar Magazine last Fall about ESS: http://www.apexperformance.net/cartg...%20systems.asp

M758

In my 944 I have a 3 nozzle system, but I use just two. One pointed at me and the other over the headers.

Tom W

I have 3 nozzles: Engine, me and fuel tank. I don't expect that my system will completely quench a fuel fire, but I do want a few extra seconds where the flames my be reduced to allow a safe exit from the car.

Astroman

Because that's where the fire is.

Cris Brady

I was the driver that Linda (Apex) was referring to. Somebody dropped oil just past the apex into Thunder Valley. I spun, was hit three times by cars coming over the crest and and not able to see me until it was too late - the penalty of running up front I guess. I tried to start my car to move it out of the next incoming wave of cars and it burst into flame. My frame rail was crushed against and broke my oil filter. Starting the car dumped oil all over the headers and it went up.

The view from my seat out the windshield:


I didn't even think about it. I just grabbed the handle and pulled. I have 4 nozzles on my AFF system. 2 under the hood on each side of the motor, one pointed at the fuel tank and another by my knee, pointing at me.

The system knocked the fire down in a few seconds, while the foam kept going for 60 or more. Personally I was very happy having the system. I was down below the hill so oncoming traffic couldn't see me sitting in the middle of the track. They didn't red flag the race and I for sure, wasn't getting out of that car with hot cars still coming. As far as saving the motor, the only damage from the fire was some wires to the distributor were melted. The fire system saved my motor, car and me.

A930Rocket

Taking an educated where to install them, I have a 10lb SPA that I placed one nozzle in the trunk for the gas tank and two nozzles in the passenger compartment (one low aimed at my boys and one the hoop aimed down over my shoulder). I thought about adding a 4th nozzle at the engine, but figured it would help empty the tank quicker without any doing a good job.

Astroman

All joking aside: Everyone please take a look at Cris' video. I'm assuming he is VERY glad that he had not one, but TWO nozzles in the engine compartment. The engine is usually the source of the fire!! Put the extinguishant on the fire at the source!!

Chaos

Cris thank you.