Cayman S braking ABS problems?
06-03-2009 | 08:48 PM
#16
GT3 Track Junkie
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From: New Jersey /Dallas and Mexico
06-04-2009 | 12:30 AM
#17
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Track Day
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06-04-2009 | 12:33 AM
#18
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Track Day
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06-04-2009 | 12:39 AM
#19
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Track Day
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There is alot of discussion concerning this very issue on the Planet-Porsche AKA Cayman Club board. Do a search in the "modifications" as well as the "competition" forums. What is interesting is that the problem isn't universal. Myself and several other Cayman owners run with suspension mods along with R compounds or Hoosiers and have yet to encounter the problem. I have about 6,500 track miles on my car, including at The Glen, running with advanced groups and have fortunately never had any brake problems. FWIW I use PFC 01/97s, PFC front rotors, SRF fluid, GT3 brake ducts and have removed the front debris shields.
Just out of curiousity, what size tires are you running F&R, the ABS issue seems to crop up with F&R tire size differential >5% rotating diameter.
Just out of curiousity, what size tires are you running F&R, the ABS issue seems to crop up with F&R tire size differential >5% rotating diameter.
I run on original size MichelinPS2 tires 19" dicks.
Do you drive with or WITHOUT PSM?
On Shenandoah I drove without PSM and had no problem at all, but on Thunderbolt or the Glen I was driving with it "ON" and the troubles began.
Next Glen or Thunderbolt will try without PSM.
06-04-2009 | 12:49 AM
#21
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Track Day
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06-04-2009 | 12:51 AM
#22
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Track Day
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There is alot of discussion concerning this very issue on the Planet-Porsche AKA Cayman Club board. Do a search in the "modifications" as well as the "competition" forums. What is interesting is that the problem isn't universal. Myself and several other Cayman owners run with suspension mods along with R compounds or Hoosiers and have yet to encounter the problem. I have about 6,500 track miles on my car, including at The Glen, running with advanced groups and have fortunately never had any brake problems. FWIW I use PFC 01/97s, PFC front rotors, SRF fluid, GT3 brake ducts and have removed the front debris shields.
Just out of curiousity, what size tires are you running F&R, the ABS issue seems to crop up with F&R tire size differential >5% rotating diameter.
Just out of curiousity, what size tires are you running F&R, the ABS issue seems to crop up with F&R tire size differential >5% rotating diameter.
06-04-2009 | 12:54 AM
#23
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Track Day
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I can add a bit of insight since I believe i have 10,000 track miles spread among 2 caymans. What you are experiancing is excessive heat from overuse of the ABS system. Air in the abs pump is hard to remove. It is sometimes hard to feel the slight pulsing of the abs as it does its magic, the combination of the psm working keeps the brake temps very high as it engages them to keep the car steady. A short term solution would be black pads with srf fluid and turn off the psm.
BTW did you ever also feel the clutch stay on the floor and not return after a really good run?
BTW did you ever also feel the clutch stay on the floor and not return after a really good run?
06-09-2009 | 06:04 PM
#24
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Track Day
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Thanks everybody,
However it seems to me that my explanation of the problem was too detailed and not concentrated enough to the point.
Very concise now.
I have Castrol SRF in the system, I have slotted rotors, Padig black pads, GT3 air scoops, titanium shims, GT3 Air Scoops.
Original size Michelin PS2 tires, 19" dicks.
Nothing is leaking.
The problem is not the braking power or loss of brakes, no, the braking power is absolutely good, the stopping distance is very good, ABS is working when pushed hard. The whole braking system works perfect on tracks and on streets. THE PEDAL TRAVELS VERY SHORT, as it suppose to do, DURING ANY KIND OF BRAKING at ANY SPEED.
The problem is in what happened AFTER A COMPLETE STOP.
The car is motionless with motor running, applying moderate pressure to the brake pedal and the pedal GOES TO THE FLOOR. The same when the motor is shot.
Then pumping the pedal after it touches the floor and it became firm, but then, if we still keeping some substantial pressure, like during short stop, the pedal will surrender and go almost to the floor.
Again and very short.
In the stand still car the braking pedal goes to the floor under pressure.
This is not right, the pedal under no circumstances suppose to go to the floor.
The air in the system has nothing to do with what I’m experiencing.
If the air is the problem then the braking would be affected or the pedal would be “long” during the braking, but the pedal is short and firm during any braking, so it is not the air.
So something is working incorrect and should be fixed.
Please no SUGGESTIONS, I already read tons of them and they are all wrong, maybe I explained the problem bad, sorry.
I need to hear from men who had such problem and fix it.
I heard that ABS might be the problem, but why?
Please don’t tell me to change the driving style; it is not in the discussion.
If you can explain why ABS is “guilty”, please do.
Thank you all.
Lev.
However it seems to me that my explanation of the problem was too detailed and not concentrated enough to the point.
Very concise now.
I have Castrol SRF in the system, I have slotted rotors, Padig black pads, GT3 air scoops, titanium shims, GT3 Air Scoops.
Original size Michelin PS2 tires, 19" dicks.
Nothing is leaking.
The problem is not the braking power or loss of brakes, no, the braking power is absolutely good, the stopping distance is very good, ABS is working when pushed hard. The whole braking system works perfect on tracks and on streets. THE PEDAL TRAVELS VERY SHORT, as it suppose to do, DURING ANY KIND OF BRAKING at ANY SPEED.
The problem is in what happened AFTER A COMPLETE STOP.
The car is motionless with motor running, applying moderate pressure to the brake pedal and the pedal GOES TO THE FLOOR. The same when the motor is shot.
Then pumping the pedal after it touches the floor and it became firm, but then, if we still keeping some substantial pressure, like during short stop, the pedal will surrender and go almost to the floor.
Again and very short.
In the stand still car the braking pedal goes to the floor under pressure.
This is not right, the pedal under no circumstances suppose to go to the floor.
The air in the system has nothing to do with what I’m experiencing.
If the air is the problem then the braking would be affected or the pedal would be “long” during the braking, but the pedal is short and firm during any braking, so it is not the air.
So something is working incorrect and should be fixed.
Please no SUGGESTIONS, I already read tons of them and they are all wrong, maybe I explained the problem bad, sorry.
I need to hear from men who had such problem and fix it.
I heard that ABS might be the problem, but why?
Please don’t tell me to change the driving style; it is not in the discussion.
If you can explain why ABS is “guilty”, please do.
Thank you all.
Lev.
06-09-2009 | 06:06 PM
#25
Thread Starter
Track Day
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Cayman S braking, ABS problem, failure?
Thanks everybody,
However it seems to me that my explanation of the problem was too detailed and not concentrated enough to the point.
Very concise now.
I have Castrol SRF in the system, I have slotted rotors, Padig black pads, GT3 air scoops, titanium shims, GT3 Air Scoops.
Original size Michelin PS2 tires, 19" dicks.
Nothing is leaking.
The problem is not the braking power or loss of brakes, no, the braking power is absolutely good, the stopping distance is very good, ABS is working when pushed hard. The whole braking system works perfect on tracks and on streets. THE PEDAL TRAVELS VERY SHORT, as it suppose to do, DURING ANY KIND OF BRAKING at ANY SPEED.
The problem is in what happened AFTER A COMPLETE STOP.
The car is motionless with motor running, applying moderate pressure to the brake pedal and the pedal GOES TO THE FLOOR. The same when the motor is shot.
Then pumping the pedal after it touches the floor and it became firm, but then, if we still keeping some substantial pressure, like during short stop, the pedal will surrender and go almost to the floor.
Again and very short.
In the stand still car the braking pedal goes to the floor under pressure.
This is not right, the pedal under no circumstances suppose to go to the floor.
The air in the system has nothing to do with what I’m experiencing.
If the air is the problem then the braking would be affected or the pedal would be “long” during the braking, but the pedal is short and firm during any braking, so it is not the air.
So something is working incorrect and should be fixed.
Please no SUGGESTIONS, I already read tons of them and they are all wrong, maybe I explained the problem bad, sorry.
I need to hear from men who had such problem and fix it.
I heard that ABS might be the problem, but why?
Please don’t tell me to change the driving style; it is not in the discussion.
If you can explain why ABS is “guilty”, please do.
Thank you all.
Lev.
However it seems to me that my explanation of the problem was too detailed and not concentrated enough to the point.
Very concise now.
I have Castrol SRF in the system, I have slotted rotors, Padig black pads, GT3 air scoops, titanium shims, GT3 Air Scoops.
Original size Michelin PS2 tires, 19" dicks.
Nothing is leaking.
The problem is not the braking power or loss of brakes, no, the braking power is absolutely good, the stopping distance is very good, ABS is working when pushed hard. The whole braking system works perfect on tracks and on streets. THE PEDAL TRAVELS VERY SHORT, as it suppose to do, DURING ANY KIND OF BRAKING at ANY SPEED.
The problem is in what happened AFTER A COMPLETE STOP.
The car is motionless with motor running, applying moderate pressure to the brake pedal and the pedal GOES TO THE FLOOR. The same when the motor is shot.
Then pumping the pedal after it touches the floor and it became firm, but then, if we still keeping some substantial pressure, like during short stop, the pedal will surrender and go almost to the floor.
Again and very short.
In the stand still car the braking pedal goes to the floor under pressure.
This is not right, the pedal under no circumstances suppose to go to the floor.
The air in the system has nothing to do with what I’m experiencing.
If the air is the problem then the braking would be affected or the pedal would be “long” during the braking, but the pedal is short and firm during any braking, so it is not the air.
So something is working incorrect and should be fixed.
Please no SUGGESTIONS, I already read tons of them and they are all wrong, maybe I explained the problem bad, sorry.
I need to hear from men who had such problem and fix it.
I heard that ABS might be the problem, but why?
Please don’t tell me to change the driving style; it is not in the discussion.
If you can explain why ABS is “guilty”, please do.
Thank you all.
Lev.
06-09-2009 | 07:11 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,903
Likes: 29
Thanks everybody,
However it seems to me that my explanation of the problem was too detailed and not concentrated enough to the point.
Very concise now.
I have Castrol SRF in the system, I have slotted rotors, Padig black pads, GT3 air scoops, titanium shims, GT3 Air Scoops.
Original size Michelin PS2 tires, 19" dicks.
Nothing is leaking.
The problem is not the braking power or loss of brakes, no, the braking power is absolutely good, the stopping distance is very good, ABS is working when pushed hard. The whole braking system works perfect on tracks and on streets. THE PEDAL TRAVELS VERY SHORT, as it suppose to do, DURING ANY KIND OF BRAKING at ANY SPEED.
The problem is in what happened AFTER A COMPLETE STOP.
The car is motionless with motor running, applying moderate pressure to the brake pedal and the pedal GOES TO THE FLOOR. The same when the motor is shot.
Then pumping the pedal after it touches the floor and it became firm, but then, if we still keeping some substantial pressure, like during short stop, the pedal will surrender and go almost to the floor.
Again and very short.
In the stand still car the braking pedal goes to the floor under pressure.
This is not right, the pedal under no circumstances suppose to go to the floor.
The air in the system has nothing to do with what I’m experiencing.
If the air is the problem then the braking would be affected or the pedal would be “long” during the braking, but the pedal is short and firm during any braking, so it is not the air.
So something is working incorrect and should be fixed.
Please no SUGGESTIONS, I already read tons of them and they are all wrong, maybe I explained the problem bad, sorry.
I need to hear from men who had such problem and fix it.
I heard that ABS might be the problem, but why?
Please don’t tell me to change the driving style; it is not in the discussion.
If you can explain why ABS is “guilty”, please do.
Thank you all.
Lev.
However it seems to me that my explanation of the problem was too detailed and not concentrated enough to the point.
Very concise now.
I have Castrol SRF in the system, I have slotted rotors, Padig black pads, GT3 air scoops, titanium shims, GT3 Air Scoops.
Original size Michelin PS2 tires, 19" dicks.
Nothing is leaking.
The problem is not the braking power or loss of brakes, no, the braking power is absolutely good, the stopping distance is very good, ABS is working when pushed hard. The whole braking system works perfect on tracks and on streets. THE PEDAL TRAVELS VERY SHORT, as it suppose to do, DURING ANY KIND OF BRAKING at ANY SPEED.
The problem is in what happened AFTER A COMPLETE STOP.
The car is motionless with motor running, applying moderate pressure to the brake pedal and the pedal GOES TO THE FLOOR. The same when the motor is shot.
Then pumping the pedal after it touches the floor and it became firm, but then, if we still keeping some substantial pressure, like during short stop, the pedal will surrender and go almost to the floor.
Again and very short.
In the stand still car the braking pedal goes to the floor under pressure.
This is not right, the pedal under no circumstances suppose to go to the floor.
The air in the system has nothing to do with what I’m experiencing.
If the air is the problem then the braking would be affected or the pedal would be “long” during the braking, but the pedal is short and firm during any braking, so it is not the air.
So something is working incorrect and should be fixed.
Please no SUGGESTIONS, I already read tons of them and they are all wrong, maybe I explained the problem bad, sorry.
I need to hear from men who had such problem and fix it.
I heard that ABS might be the problem, but why?
Please don’t tell me to change the driving style; it is not in the discussion.
If you can explain why ABS is “guilty”, please do.
Thank you all.
Lev.
06-09-2009 | 09:34 PM
#27
GT3 Track Junkie
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From: New Jersey /Dallas and Mexico
You don't have to put in a Bosch race unit which costs the earth, you can actually use the teves mk 60 which is much much cheaper. This issue has happened on three cayman/987 based cars now at Farnbacher-Loles including mine, so Im having John T from BGB working on getting one installed in my car. The truth is that there is no simple fix to this, it's one of reason why it's allowed in Grand-am and in PCA club racing.
06-09-2009 | 09:50 PM
#29
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You don't have to put in a Bosch race unit which costs the earth, you can actually use the teves mk 60 which is much much cheaper. This issue has happened on three cayman/987 based cars now at Farnbacher-Loles including mine, so Im having John T from BGB working on getting one installed in my car. The truth is that there is no simple fix to this, it's one of reason why it's allowed in Grand-am and in PCA club racing.
Can you elaborate on what happened on the three cayman/987 based cars and how you think that is related to the OP's issue?
06-14-2009 | 03:14 PM
#30
Thread Starter
Track Day
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 19
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You don't have to put in a Bosch race unit which costs the earth, you can actually use the teves mk 60 which is much much cheaper. This issue has happened on three cayman/987 based cars now at Farnbacher-Loles including mine, so Im having John T from BGB working on getting one installed in my car. The truth is that there is no simple fix to this, it's one of reason why it's allowed in Grand-am and in PCA club racing.
I checked Google for Teves MK 60, did not found much info, no price either.
Not found if it is good for the Cayman S.
I can try to call J. Teece, on Monday.