What hourly rate do you pay for work and setup?
02-28-2009, 11:29 AM
#31
Rennlist Member
I'm not saying bring your car to Mitas to have simple work done to get a low labor rate. You have to bring it to a reputable shop. But I think you can have different skill level technitians who work on different items.. Suspension, prep, etc. one rate. Engine tranny another, etc.
You don't need a neurologist to remove your tonsils. nor do you want to pay a neurologists rate for that service.
You don't need a neurologist to remove your tonsils. nor do you want to pay a neurologists rate for that service.
02-28-2009, 12:30 PM
#32
Racer
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My shop rate is $80/hour and since 90% of the work I do is NOT in a labor manual or I feel the labor quide is completely inaccurate, I charge pretty much the time the job takes. If I feel the job should have been done a little faster, then I charge for the time I think the job should have taken. For example- we are in the middle of putting a Toyota engine in an MG Midget. I estimated the wiring installation at what I felt it could be accomplished in, but have had to spend much more time than originally anticipated on the job due to lack of or incorrect information. I cannot charge the customer for this- its not thier fault and we have a commitment to them to get the job done and done right at or near the price we quoted.
IMHO a lot of shops count on being able to "beat the book" and use the labor quides to help themselves rather than thier customers, which is likely fine if your doing general service work but on a performance or racing car there needs to be a mutual trust between mechanic and customer or bad things are sure to happen. Just recently I learned a VERY noted Porsche racing shop completely screwed over a pro racing customer to the tune of a million bucks or more, using the money the customer spent not to prepare the car properly and as promised but rather to improve thier shop and cover the shop expenses.
IMHO a lot of shops count on being able to "beat the book" and use the labor quides to help themselves rather than thier customers, which is likely fine if your doing general service work but on a performance or racing car there needs to be a mutual trust between mechanic and customer or bad things are sure to happen. Just recently I learned a VERY noted Porsche racing shop completely screwed over a pro racing customer to the tune of a million bucks or more, using the money the customer spent not to prepare the car properly and as promised but rather to improve thier shop and cover the shop expenses.
02-28-2009, 12:48 PM
#33
Drifting
^^^ And that makes sense to me ^^^
I understand that many times our cars and doing outside the norm type of work may not fall with in the Chiltons guide of hourly service. But so long as there is fairness as you mention above, I'm OK with that.
I understand that many times our cars and doing outside the norm type of work may not fall with in the Chiltons guide of hourly service. But so long as there is fairness as you mention above, I'm OK with that.
02-28-2009, 12:56 PM
#34
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
OMFG;
I have not found many aspects of working on high performance cars that I consider take less attention to detail and concentration on quality than any other. Installing a brake rotor takes no less of any of this than installing a seat or harnesses. EVERY part of track prep is critical to me. I've seen the shops that let the new guy or the apprentice do something that is supposed to be easy. I've redone their work, and I've seen some frightening things, like this;
This fine installation was done by a vey well known West Coast shop. This is how they "fastened" the seat sliders to the side brackets. I'm lucky in that regard... I do it all myself. I don't have to worry about someone else falling asleep at the wrench or running out of talent.
The only place I see any advantage to using one person over another is in familiarity. If I need to maximize labor time, I put someone on it that knows exactly what they are doing and could do the job with their eyes closed. In the end, no matter who does it, I'd certainly rather have it done right than fast. If one can achieve both, so be it.
As for labor times, I use factory times where available, but otherwise it is Time and Materials. I don't quote stuff that I have not done a bunch of times because the quote will be meaningless. If I find that I have "wasted" some time figuring how to do something - on the job training, as it were - I adjust my time accordingly. I also invite my clients to come in and see their work in progress, even to the point of letting them help. Whether they end up helping or just watching, I find that informed customers are much more happy to pay the bill, especially the expensive ones!
I have not found many aspects of working on high performance cars that I consider take less attention to detail and concentration on quality than any other. Installing a brake rotor takes no less of any of this than installing a seat or harnesses. EVERY part of track prep is critical to me. I've seen the shops that let the new guy or the apprentice do something that is supposed to be easy. I've redone their work, and I've seen some frightening things, like this;
This fine installation was done by a vey well known West Coast shop. This is how they "fastened" the seat sliders to the side brackets. I'm lucky in that regard... I do it all myself. I don't have to worry about someone else falling asleep at the wrench or running out of talent.
The only place I see any advantage to using one person over another is in familiarity. If I need to maximize labor time, I put someone on it that knows exactly what they are doing and could do the job with their eyes closed. In the end, no matter who does it, I'd certainly rather have it done right than fast. If one can achieve both, so be it.
As for labor times, I use factory times where available, but otherwise it is Time and Materials. I don't quote stuff that I have not done a bunch of times because the quote will be meaningless. If I find that I have "wasted" some time figuring how to do something - on the job training, as it were - I adjust my time accordingly. I also invite my clients to come in and see their work in progress, even to the point of letting them help. Whether they end up helping or just watching, I find that informed customers are much more happy to pay the bill, especially the expensive ones!
