A.Wayne

Is pebbles trying to take over another thread narcissism is truly a disease

Anyway and back on topic .....When lewis closes the deal on this WDC . please remember where to send the bottle .... nutters !

multi21

I know your a life long Hamilton apologist, but try to stay on topic. We're not discussing Massa or Kimi. That doesn't change the fact that Hamilton has the best car 2 years running, but comes from ahead to tank in 2007 and is starting to show cracks again in his decision making.

I'll say this, if he doesn't extend his lead in China this weekend, he's in serious trouble because Massa is a virtual lock in Brazil.

wanna911

So I'm supposed to sit here and make excuses for Hamilton while you (and the rest of your crew) bash him like he's the only driver in F1 that makes mistakes????? LOL, you can try that game if you want to but you'll be playing alone.

How about I start two threads:

If it rains in China or Brazil, will Massa spin and/or crash out???

or

Does Kimi care enough to try now that he's blown his shot at the WDC???


Lewis has the best car two years running based on what? From what I've seen the Ferrari's have been the fastest all year. Add up the fast laps, poles, and fastest times in practice and I garauntee you the Ferrari's are faster overall. T

multi21

I think there is nothing to discuss when it comes to Massa and Kimi. There seems to be concensus that in the rain, Massa is simply dreadful and my "virtual lock in Brazil" should have included that. Consensus (Maybe the Finn won't agree) that Kimi doesn't seem to be interested in racing until the last 1/3 of the race.

Have there been other mistakes? Of course, Alonso in Monaco is a great example and he was called on it.

The only discussion is between those two camps that think Hamilton makes way too many mistakes, has lost 1 WDC already and may lose another because he can't keep it under control. The other camp thinks he walks on water and believes everyone else is just a hater, racist, tifosi, race steward or FIA official.

Schumacher certainly didn't make as many mistakes as Hamilton or the rest of the grid these days. You remember the old days when a mistake was so rare at this level that the 1st druver that made that mistake (if it even happened) lost the race? It seemed like they were not even human.

A.Wayne

LOL... schumacher didn't make mistakes BAHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAA


While the 3 musketeers ( LH, FM, KR ) make more mistakes than MS , MS was
the most mistake prone WDC when compared to the ones before him ...
anyway where is your on the "record" for last weekend's GP.

Stop hiding over here your air brain numbnut analysis of last weekends GP is needed..

ltc

I would have to rate the McLaren to be an better OVERALL car than the Ferrari (better on tires, managing tire temperatures, superb over curbs)

MTosi

Yup, while I would have to agree the Ferrari is the outright "fastest" car, the Mclaren is a better all around car. Not to mention the way that Mclaren chassis handles, it's amazing the way that car rotates mid corner AND you don't have to deal with a car that seems so fickle about getting tires up to temp. In the rain the Ferrari's might as well just park, they clearly haven't developed a variable dif (TC) as well as Mclarens, plus the Ferrari's dry and wet seems to understeer (most likely designed in for Massa). Then when pushed it reverts to snap oversteer.

wanna911

There are only complaints about the tires when Kimi languishes in the back for a whole race and then sets a fast lap at the end. He's been doing that for a long time now, setting fast lap at the end of the race.

The drivers are so up and down, how can one really draw a conclusion as to what the problem is? Massa was simply mistake prone and/or slow at the onset of the season, now Kimi has disappeared. They always blame the car and crew while Lewis wont put a bad word on his, and some wonder why his car rarely has a problem.

The Mcclaren is known to get to tire temps quickly, and conversely wears them out quickly, but of course in Lewis' case, it's blamed on him and not the tires where the Ferrari guys get excuses and it's the cars fault when Kimi is on his third set of tires and seemingly only one out of every three sets of tires can hold heat for the Ferrari so he can set the fastest lap of the day.

Unfortunately, Heikki hasnt been very helpful in assessing the problem with the McClaren overheating tires. But his ability to backpedal through the field should be a sign that his tires go away pretty fast too.

Not only that, but the McClarens have had problems with the soft tires while the Ferrari's excel with them more than anyone else, while still being able to make good use of the harder compound. So while being more on edge, which is seemingly Ferrari's preference, the car is more finicky, but that's their CHOICE, not circumstantial. The McClarens are less edgy, but have less potential for the fast lap, again, CHOICE.

wanna911

There is nothing to discuss, while you are still dwelling on Hamiltons mistakes from last year, we should just forget everyone elses, especially the guys in the other "best" cars? HAHHAAH. Nice try bud.

I dont think Hamilton walks on water, but I'm not hell bent on trying to demean the positive that he has done for his team and the sport of F1 (if you can call it that any more). Nor am I hell bent on doing that to anyone else. So that leaves you and I little to discuss.

Your reference to the FIA is laughable. Can you honestly say that you beleive the FIA hasnt coddled Ferrari this year? Can you say that the circumstances surrounding Lewis' denial of appeal werent fishy if the call itself wasnt?

Your answer to that question will determine whether I bother to respond to any more of your posts.

Sean F

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71441

Hamilton to face scrutiny over driving

By Jonathan Noble Thursday, October 16th 2008, 12:43 GMT


Lewis Hamilton will face fresh scrutiny from his rivals in Friday's drivers' briefing in China about his on-track behaviour, although fellow racers deny they are ganging up on the world championship leader.

Grand Prix Drivers' Association (GPDA) director Mark Webber and Jarno Trulli have both said they will raise Hamilton's conduct with F1 race director Charlie Whiting when they gather for their meeting on Friday evening.

But amid an increased focus on Hamilton's driving etiquette following a controversial Japanese Grand Prix, both deny there is any specific campaign against the Briton.

Trulli is upset about the way Hamilton behaved when the Italian tried to lap him during the Fuji race - claiming he lost valuable seconds that cost him the chance of beating Nelson Piquet's Renault for fourth place.

"I am definitely unhappy," Trulli told autosport.com about his views on Hamilton's driving in Japan. "I was leading the race, he was lapped and for two laps he held me up. This cost me 1.5 seconds, which if we are going to put it back on my second pitstop could have given me the chance to stay ahead of Renault after the stop.

"I am not saying I would have finished in front, but sometimes thing like this can change a lot. Lewis did not even watch the mirrors because he came back on the track right in front of me and he held me up for two laps. And probably he should have paid more attention because he was more or less out of the race. He was dead last and I don't understand why."

Webber has said he wants to raise with Whiting the way that Hamilton approached the first corner in Fuji - even though the Briton was already handed a drive-through penalty for forcing Kimi Raikkonen off the track.

"The braking areas is an issue because you cannot move around in the braking areas like that," said Webber. "We lost a marshal at Monza (in 2000) when there were guys moving around in the braking areas and it is very hard to change your line if you don't know what is going to come. That is the only thing that we need to look at."

Despite their feelings about aspects of Hamilton's driving, both drivers denied that rivals were picking on the Briton amid his challenge for the world championship.

Trulli said: "I don't comment on Lewis' driving because honestly I can comment only on what happened to me. In the end I don't want to get involved in any speculation or discussions. He has done some good things and some bad things, as has every driver. It is difficult to judge.

"I would feel it is unfair to talk about him. It is better to discuss it with him and tell him, as I will do tomorrow.

"I will go in the drivers' briefing and I will say to Charlie, this is what happened and I believe Lewis could have handled it in a different way because it was not fair. But I am not going against anyone.

"I am not the kind of person who, if I don't get on with them, I make it a war of words. I just want an easy life without fighting; I just want to make the sport fair for everyone. I don't care if you are driving a top team car or the last car, I expect everyone to be treated the same."

Webber conceded that there were times when Hamilton's driving had caused him concern but said that such a situation was no different from how he felt about other drivers.

"He is a phenomenal talent," explained Webber. "Everyone has got strengths and weaknesses, and I haven't seen what he did with Jarno in terms of backmarkers.

"Monza was a tough race for him in terms of what he did to me, what he did to (Timo) Glock at the Curva Grande, what he did to Fernando, so in his eyes it is fine.

"And he didn't get a penalty in Monza, so he didn't do anything wrong in Monza in anyone's eyes, so that was fine. But his respected colleagues are sometimes saying, 'mate it doesn't need to be like that all the time'."

Webber added: "The first corner in Fuji was pretty wild. He was having a crack but if someone was sitting on his right rear when he pulled out there then that was a crash.

"There was also no way he was going to make the first corner. But that is not illegal to outbrake yourself. We want to have a bit of a chat about moving around in the braking areas. I am not smashing Hamilton but it is about how you move on. Tiger Woods learns. Roger Federer learns. And Lewis is going through that."

When asked by autosport.com if there were similarities between how rivals viewed Hamilton and how they often focused on Michael Schumacher's driving tactics, Webber said: "Yeah, could be.

"I think he is always going to be under the spotlight, that is the problem with Lewis. He is always under this light, which he would not necessarily want – he just wants to win his first world title. Being under this spotlight for various other reasons – whether they are the politics of the sport, his skin, or whatever it is I don't know.

"I think there have been a few occasions where he has learned. Michael was doing this stuff when he had all this experience under his belt, Lewis is still in only his second year of F1. You go back to Fuji last year in terms of how he handled the safety car, it was ridiculous."

Jenson Button also denied that drivers were specifically targetting Hamilton – and reckoned Fernando Alonso's claims he wants to see Felipe Massa win the title were just a bit of fun.

"If somebody has a problem with someone then they voice their opinion, but no one has targetted another driver," said Button. "There's never any arguments between drivers. There's never really any bad banter.

"Alonso is only saying what he has said because he just wants a reaction from everyone. He is not in the championship, so he just wants a bit of action. It's quite comical really."

chris walrod

I would agree!! +1

A.Wayne

Disagree dat McClaren is the best car ..All the facts point to the Ferrari. At the times when McClaren has gotten pole it was mostly from a much lighter fuel load.

Our speed dufus's likes to give McClaren credit for putting heat into the tires faster ,,, LOL,,, very laughable ..they must have access to the telemetry.

Lewis is fast in the rain , people who are fast in the rain tend to make fast laps on cold tires . Ferrari has the most poles , most wins and most fastest laps and really have had the dominant car all year. What Keeps them close is the fact Ferrari has 2 second rate drivers , if both LH or FA was in a Ferrari it would be another boring WDC , think not , add Massa's two missed 10 points situation that was not driver error related and call me back Massa is not on the same tier as LH .

924RACR

If the Ferrari is so good, why does it SUCK in the rain, so badly that even a great wet-weather driver like Kimi can't even keep the POS on the track?

I agree w/ wanna911, at least about this - it seems just a bit too optimized for dry weather, and does tend to excel there... but the McLaren seems to be a much more well-rounded car.

I know which one of the two I'd prefer to drive...

Larry Herman

Yeah, either!

Veloce Raptor

Yea, verily.