Should we boycott tracks in need of resurfacing?
07-09-2007, 03:19 PM
#19
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by dgz924s
One can repave LRP every year and still end up on a washboard. I read an article a while back on the ground there and other Northern tracks on ground composition. LRP like others are constantly fighting winter to summer temps and poor beds for the tracks. The Germans had this issue so when they built the Autobahn they did it in sections 6' deep to reduce buckling. It is impossible to keep the ground from shifting so they combat it with a special surface and road bed thickness. When a section cracks or buckles they change the section. The ground at LRP is always moving so a rough surface is going to be there unless they spent millions to do as the design for the Autobahn. In Iowa we cannot keep our roads flat at all and it is much worse in the NE area.
If they pave, give it 2 years and it will be back to what it is now....no question!
If they pave, give it 2 years and it will be back to what it is now....no question!
07-09-2007, 03:42 PM
#20
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by Matt Romanowski
Some misinterpritation, but no big deal. I didn't mean to be elitist at all, just pointing out that to be really fast their you have to be really good. Everyone is invited!
I completely agree with the "If you don't like it, don't go" mindset. It is bumpy and could certainly be better, but the whiners remind me of the NASCAR drivers when they talk about how bad a track NHIS is becuase it's short and flat.
I completely agree with the "If you don't like it, don't go" mindset. It is bumpy and could certainly be better, but the whiners remind me of the NASCAR drivers when they talk about how bad a track NHIS is becuase it's short and flat.
07-09-2007, 04:30 PM
#21
Burning Brakes
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right or wrong, I heard that the lack of entries was due to track conditions and that they didn't want their cars damaged by the track conditions
To clarify, the intent of the thread was to get your opinion whether we should as a group, attempt to put economic preasure on the facilities, which fail to maintain their complexes. When it comes down to it we are paying for asphalt and its lay out. I find it offensive to have to incure additional expenses to repair my car due to the lack of the above and will vote with my wallet and reinforce with a friendly letter to the facility. It is a shame, because I like Summit and it is only 4 hours away, but I missed and open track day and 2 additioanl days at WGI due to the repairs from what I believe was attributable to Summit. I have never been to LRP and purposely have not do to it's condition and yes a stock car would do well since you need a mush suspension to suck up the wash board. 
07-09-2007, 07:31 PM
#23
Originally Posted by ZAPmobile
Watkins Glen, LCMT, and Mosport seem to have solved the problem.
I have no idea how they maintain it that well given that it is in the middle of a ski resort.
07-09-2007, 07:32 PM
#24
Originally Posted by renvagn
+1
To clarify, the intent of the thread was to get your opinion whether we should as a group, attempt to put economic preasure on the facilities, which fail to maintain their complexes. When it comes down to it we are paying for asphalt and its lay out. I find it offensive to have to incure additional expenses to repair my car due to the lack of the above and will vote with my wallet and reinforce with a friendly letter to the facility. It is a shame, because I like Summit and it is only 4 hours away, but I missed and open track day and 2 additioanl days at WGI due to the repairs from what I believe was attributable to Summit. I have never been to LRP and purposely have not do to it's condition and yes a stock car would do well since you need a mush suspension to suck up the wash board.
To clarify, the intent of the thread was to get your opinion whether we should as a group, attempt to put economic preasure on the facilities, which fail to maintain their complexes. When it comes down to it we are paying for asphalt and its lay out. I find it offensive to have to incure additional expenses to repair my car due to the lack of the above and will vote with my wallet and reinforce with a friendly letter to the facility. It is a shame, because I like Summit and it is only 4 hours away, but I missed and open track day and 2 additioanl days at WGI due to the repairs from what I believe was attributable to Summit. I have never been to LRP and purposely have not do to it's condition and yes a stock car would do well since you need a mush suspension to suck up the wash board. 
Turn 5 is really the only one that is a major problem.
07-09-2007, 08:07 PM
#25
Race Director
Originally Posted by Brian P
I was going to mention LCMT as it is by far the nicest surface that I have been on (that includes VIR, which is a close second)
I have no idea how they maintain it that well given that it is in the middle of a ski resort.
I have no idea how they maintain it that well given that it is in the middle of a ski resort.
07-09-2007, 09:18 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by Brian P
Having driven Lime Rock and Pocono, I consider Summit to be reasonably well maintained. Turn 5 is really the only one that is a major problem.
Turn 5 is really the only one that is a major problem.
07-09-2007, 10:02 PM
#27
Originally Posted by bobt993
Errrr, Brian start using the entire track and you will change your mind....... Seriously, SP needs repaving big time. I could list turn by turn the problem areas, but most you guys would barf from the boredom of common knowledge.
I'm not sure what you mean by using the entire track. Are you saying I should be driving over the massive potholes at SP? Who would do that???
07-09-2007, 10:26 PM
#28
Rennlist Member
Brian, it was a joke...... T1 - T2 in particular has serious bumps that allow little rebound on adjustables as you track wide through T2. I have to use a soft setting to apply hard throttle past the apex of T1. T5-T6, if you trail hard enough, you can avoid some of the drop off just past the big concrete patch. Then T6-T7-T8 has more ready-patch than an urban parking lot. Middle of the track has the most grip. Now T9 is not bad, but entry is a little rough and tracking out WOT is different every lap. Track is falling apart wide a turn in T10, same in T1, same at Wagon Bend T3 between the two access roads.
Anyone want to add, I am sure I missed something. BTW I really like the way SP flows and would love to see it repaved.
Anyone want to add, I am sure I missed something. BTW I really like the way SP flows and would love to see it repaved.
07-09-2007, 11:57 PM
#29
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by bobt993
Brian, it was a joke...... T1 - T2 in particular has serious bumps that allow little rebound on adjustables as you track wide through T2. I have to use a soft setting to apply hard throttle past the apex of T1. T5-T6, if you trail hard enough, you can avoid some of the drop off just past the big concrete patch. Then T6-T7-T8 has more ready-patch than an urban parking lot. Middle of the track has the most grip. Now T9 is not bad, but entry is a little rough and tracking out WOT is different every lap. Track is falling apart wide a turn in T10, same in T1, same at Wagon Bend T3 between the two access roads.
Anyone want to add, I am sure I missed something. BTW I really like the way SP flows and would love to see it repaved.
Anyone want to add, I am sure I missed something. BTW I really like the way SP flows and would love to see it repaved.
I am not really boycotting Summit, but I am doing about 7-8 fewer days there this year, although I am going this weekend. For me, I use to be able to drive home at night and now I have to get a motel, so now Summit is not that much more expensive than VIR. VIR, MO or WG is one (maybe 2 if I’m tired) extra motel night(s) and probably another $50-75 for gas. So about $150-$250 more I can drive VIR, MO, or WG over Summit. Since the weekend will probably cost near $1k anyway, I would rather be at the better tracks for an extra $150-$250. Although the other three tracks are also easier on my car, I would be a hypocrite to say that is one of the reasons because I still drive the car on the crappy interstates and highways to get them.
I would rather run two events at VIR or WG on hohos than three at Summit on RA-1s, which is basically what I am doing this year. Fewer days but better days, IMO. Maybe flawed logic, but I’m going w/ it for now…..especially since I just drove the Glen for the first time Whoo-hooo!
I heard that Tom Bobbit spoke to Bill Scott about the condition and the result was: no repave anytime soon (this is what I heard). In fact at last year’s Potomac event in August Bill gave a speech about extending Jefferson Circuit into a mini “Suzuka” track. I don’t get it, but….Summit is a mess on a few levels, so I’m not surprised (flaggers, bathrooms, paddock, etc). If I owned that business I would take more pride in my product/service, but I guess since they still sell out every weekend, they don’t care….sounds like what I have read about Lime Rock.
07-11-2007, 01:50 PM
#30
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If they pave, give it 2 years and it will be back to what it is now....no question!
Last edited by John Veninger; 07-11-2007 at 02:09 PM.