NASCAR drivers are cracking HANS devices
05-14-2007, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by cooleyjb
So the bridges you drive on don't bend, expand, etc. and the concrete in Florida doesn't have any cracks.
This is the kind of passive agressive statement I was talking about that annoys many poeple and makes people have a general dislike of Isaac. You lose credibility with some people when you act like this.
Gregg S. Baker, P.E.
Isaac, LLC
05-14-2007, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by gbaker
Not more than they are designed to. That's because those bridges are designed by Professional Engineers.
Ooops
05-14-2007, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Greg Fishman
Ridiculous analogy.
At extremes of the bell curve conditions can exist which overload the element, but when NASCAR says these events are common, we are not talking extremes. We are talking a product that is underdesigned by any definition.
05-14-2007, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by gbaker
The next time I drive across a bridge and the steel bends, or the concrete cracks, I'm going to say, "Wow, what a great bridge! It was designed to break at a certain load!"
05-14-2007, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by cooleyjb
05-14-2007, 08:10 PM
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Your comments are beyond ridiculous.
Ahh, look at the way that sheet metal bends, what a poorly engineered/designed piece of crap...
Ofcourse had they been wearing an Isaacs device none of that metal would have bent!
Ahh, look at the way that sheet metal bends, what a poorly engineered/designed piece of crap...
Ofcourse had they been wearing an Isaacs device none of that metal would have bent!
05-14-2007, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Greg Smith
I award this post with my "Most ridiculous post of the day!" award. Well either this or that 201 mph 550i
05-14-2007, 08:21 PM
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You guys are missing the point. It's all well and good that a driver is saved because something broke. But is it not good to suggest that CF shards around the carotid artery are okay when they could be avoided.
05-14-2007, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by gbaker
You guys are missing the point. It's all well and good that a driver is saved because something broke. But is it not good to suggest that CF shards around the carotid artery are okay when they could be avoided.
05-14-2007, 08:56 PM
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Originally Posted by gbaker
Thank you. The Tacoma Narrows Bridge, which collapsed in 1940, was not well designed. You could lay that vid capture next to the HANS failure photo above and arrive at the same conclusion.
It was perfectly designed and performed exactly the way it was engineered to. The place they put it was incorrect.
05-20-2007, 09:03 PM
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In fact, we have the device now. We've pulled it and tested it and it goes right up to where it's supposed to fail. So it didn't affect the strength of the device at all
Cracks in the HANS device are not uncommon. The lower parts of the yoke-like apparatus, which fits over a driver's shoulder and connects to the helmet, are designed to break once a certain load level is reached
It turns out, that device was about three years old, and he's had a lot of wrecks the last three years. In fact, he totaled a car the day before [the Nextel Cup race]. So who knows, it might have done it then. There's no way to know, because no one picked up on it until after his big wreck there.
So I never got around to reading the final statement on this until today.
Contrary to what gbaker said the device had been in use for 3 years. Holy crap that's a lot of wrecks and hits to put something on your safety list through and not replace it.
It also was tested with the crack and kept the forces the same as a non-cracked version.
3 years of NASCAR wrecks and he never picked up a new one??? That's just a bit nuts if you ask me.
05-21-2007, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by cooleyjb
So the bridges you drive on don't bend, expand, etc. and the concrete in Florida doesn't have any cracks.
This is the kind of passive agressive statement I was talking about that annoys many poeple and makes people have a general dislike of Isaac. You lose credibility with some people when you act like this.
This is the kind of passive agressive statement I was talking about that annoys many poeple and makes people have a general dislike of Isaac. You lose credibility with some people when you act like this.
05-21-2007, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by }{arlequin
i'll consider the "isaac" when i see one in an f1 cockpit... sure, it's fairly certain that it does its job... apparently many top-level engineers who try to keep their drivers alive don't think it does this job as well as hans
IIRC, at one time NA$CAR allowed both the (earlier version) Hutchens and HANS, but now they have mandated only a HANS device may be used.
It is a bit odd for a sanctioning body to specify one, and only one, SFI38.1 certified device over others, especially when it comes to a non competitive part (e.g. H&N). As of today, the HANS, R3, Leatt Moto R and Hutchens Hybrid II are all SFI 38.1 compliant (I may have missed one)
Therefore, it would be a resonable to assume that there are other factors (business, financial, etc) in play regarding H&N restraint mandates, rather than the sterile world of engineering and SFI certification.....or have I once again missed something?