Greg Fishman

How about this then? What is the difference between your engine and the one that is in the C2 of Oliver Z.? Shouldn't they be the same?

Larry Herman

Yes, except that I can optimize my setup with a custom chip, and don't have the parasitic loss of the PS pump. Add to that my car runs 300 lbs lighter and has a shorter R&P, and I should have much better acceleration.

Greg Fishman

Also LWF, right?

Larry Herman

Absolutely!

Hey, you're not setting me up for something, are you?

Greg Fishman

No, not at all, good buddy ole pal. Seriously no I am not. Just trying to think about the difference between the two cars. OZ's car was also rumured to be a C4 originally with a seam welded chassis.
Is that car still alive?

Larry Herman

Yes, I heard that it has a new owner and something about tracking and club racing it.

DHinkle

Larry:

I've raced against Rod in his 993 RS and I raced against Phil @ Daytona and I am still trying to figure out the 2-3 seconds in our group (I acknowledge that Phil is an accomplished driver) as you noted with the other 911.

I am toying with the idea of building a Boxster or Cayman for F. A developed example of either could be a very strong car moving forward in PCA.

38D

Olivers car is now owned by Drew Brown (he was at Daytona in E, where he won both races). If you look at Olivers old results, his best times at the Glen were in the high 2:11s. Larry ran low 2:09s this year, so that nearly a 3 second delta. That seems a reasonable spread to me.

Btw, comparing F to B cars only means something if the drivers are equal, which is clearly not the case in this example.

MJR911

Larry, correct me if i'm wrong... but you never raced Oliver (and his silver E c2) while you've had your RS? Just curious.

As for this discussion, I love it! Although its all heresay and BS. The truth is that Mark and Oliver can probably come off the corners quicker than others. There is also nothing against rebuilding a motor to factory tolerances, and my motor builder has never seen a c2 motor come apart that was anywhere near max stock compression. Although you can bet they go back together that way!

MJR911

EVEN BETTER IDEA: Maybe Ronnie Savenor will chime in here with some thoughts on Oliver's motor. I think those two went toe to toe (literally?) in E a few times.

jaholmes

Thats one more for the boxster. PM sent.

38D

The other thing I think happens sometime is that people don't really understand the accordian effect. If two cars are exactly equal, you should see the car in front slowly "pulling away" as they started to get on the gas a bit sooner than the car behind. You see this really well in F1 where the cars accelerate so quickly. So if you are 0.2 behind a car going into the at Daytona, the gap will appear to grow from ~24ft at 80mph to ~46ft at 155mph, which will make it seem like they have pulled roughly a car length on you.

JimB

Rod's car was down on power at Daytona. It was slow at Road America too. I drove right by him on the straight and that had never happened before in the many times we've raced. Normally Phil, Rod and I have been very close. Must be time for a rebuild.

Larry Herman

Never mind the comment about Oliver's C2 vs Carreras, I was having brain fade. His motor should be stronger than a Carrera.

It is a lot of speculation, and stated as such. However, I can run right with the GT3s at the Glen, and at Daytona they were 4 seconds faster than me. They were also probably 15 mph faster. That is HP. If Oliver ran 3 seconds slower than me at the Glen, and then Drew Brown ran 3 seconds slower at Daytona, then I would say that our motors are fairly similar (as they should be) and that I really don't have much more top end than they do. So how again does Marks car go faster than an acknowledged bullet C2 at a HP track? I'd like to see it on a dyno.

You know it. That's where all of the power is hiding.

Greg Fishman

If you look at my RRII video you can see the two cars in front of me at the start. Also the rules for that event were a bit lax so no idea what weight they were running at, etc.