Jarez Mifkin

Not if your brakes are gone!

mooty

tell you the truth, i really try to not use the extra pavement. but when i need the pavement as i exited T8 at 106mph, i used it. then the next lap at 108mph, i used a bit more.... you get the pix.

then at the esses, i really try not to use the new pavement on the right, but during the race with the C6z06 on my ***, i was on throttle earlier and harder and drifted on to the extra part.

i like the extra safety, but i just think we will end up using it and defeat the purpose.

but i have no other intelligent solution to add to safety. i thought i liked sand pits like LS, but appareenlty you will flip if you dont go off the right way (whatever that might be, it's not all that easy to go off straight at the top of the cork screw, when u know you are f'k up, you are already sideways.)

karlooz

even without brakes you can still turn on pavement. can't do that in gravel. you either wash out and hang on for the ride into the tire wall or you dig in and flip.

karlooz

you can penalize racers for abusing paved runoff. you can get black flagged, drive through penalty, or let drivers behind you pass. it just has to be enforced by the club/track.

penguinking

if its on the outside of a turn, wouldn't the rumble strips on the outside make the car really upset if you were to drive completely over them?



Edit: nevermind...i just did that this weekend at road atlanta in turn 5.

mrbill_fl

I Disagree with THAT! (how would that work????)

you will stop faster on pavement than on GRASS.... in almost any conditions.

gravel traps DO stop the car....(with a few exceptions)

gravel sux, except when you're about to impact something Big Time... then its pretty damm good.

-do they even have grass in california?

penguinking

explain how gravel stops faster than pavement. on pavement there is more friction with the tire so it should grip better.

Jon Moeller

Whether your brakes fail or not, pavement offers the advantage of being able to change your trajectory before impact. Gravel does not.

When you're playing with gravel that's deep enough to slow the car as fast as brakes on pavement, you significantly increase the chances of creating a gravel trap that will roll the car in the event of a skidding entrance.

Regarding the issue of cars utilizing the extra run-off room for faster laps, I'd suggest a definite cutoff to the runoff pad. Create a pie shaped sliver of grass so that if you utilize the runoff pad, you're going off-roading, if you try to incorporate it as part of your line. Granted, this is the "ideal scenario", but it's never going to be perfect. That's why we sign the waivers when we register for an event.

-J

mrbill_fl

I drive at homestead racetrace in south miami... its an infield within an oval.
(the white areas are gravel...not sand on this link: http://www.seats3d.com/international...ay/grand_prix/ )

They have a LOT of gravel TRAPS. and they are DEEP, maybe 2-3' (or more) and swallow cars pretty fast......

However I HAVE seen GT-1, (and some other High HP cars), almost cross and in some cases skip over the traps and reach the tire walls. (just like we see in F1)... to do that they were going FAST. (100+)

I dont ever think I've seen a rollover in the trap. a few rollovers that ended up in the traps, but started much earlier.... maybe I just missed them...

also, I flagged scca races, pro races, and some HPDE events, for about 15 yrs, at least 5 yrs at hmstd... I sure don't know everything.... but imho, I'd rather have a gravel trap than grass or pavement, if I loose my brakes at the end of long straight.

and I also agree, the best solution is track, pavement, strip of grass then gravel.

-maybe you have a different definition of a gravel trap.

I think of them as a pit filled with gravel. like quicksand...

mitch236

Has anyone done any testing of the theory about which medium would stop the car faster, gravel or pavement? I think the reason F-1 did it was to keep the cars raceable. I have been in a gravel trap and they stop the car pretty effectively.

earlyapex

There's no arguing that a properly designed gravel trap will stop a car. That said, not all corners need cars stopped and stuck. Most tracks have one where a hard top would allow cars to gather themselves up reenter the race. Turn 2 at Laguna Seca is a perfect example. There is allot of space where a series of tire bariers could be placed to catch a car with stuck throttle or blown brakes and yet give the copetetors some additional run off to use if the get out of shape. It's also not a corner that you could use the additional run off to improve your time or track position.