rdstemler

Again..... the advance of technology. Used to be that not even airplanes had ABS, now it is standard on automobiles. It may take away from the purity of manual operation, but it is safer and cheaper in the long run. How much does a crash cost. I know a GT3 crash costs a lot. Ask me how I know!

Fuel injection rather then carbs? Radial ply vs. bias belt. Air vs. H2O cooling. There are others.

The new Boeing Dreamliner is gonna have electric flaps. That is a major change from hydraulics, but lighter and, if they are willing to certify the aircraft with them, just as reliable. I can remember when nearly all the major systems on large aircraft were hot bleed-air powered. I would rather have a CB pop then a hot bleed-air leak.

Speaking of hot air.....A/C sounds pretty nice. And safer in the long run. IMHO.

Flying Finn

I think this is just the matter of where to draw the line, or decide how much driver needs "help".

For example paddle shifts or even automatic gearbox are would certainly make drivers life easier and for sure safer since he doesn't have to take hands off the steering wheel or with automatic transmission, doesn't have to think about shifting at all.

Certainly would be safer to have automatic tranny but many people (including the drivers) don't want it.

That's my point in this issue, a/c in a way is a good thing but where should we stop when making drivers' lifes easier.
And I do beleieve fans play big role in this kind of things (i.e. automatic transmission in race cars) since many feel it would be "too easy" and therefore not so interesting making them stay home instead of going to races and paying for the whole thing.

BTW, seeing Johannes Van Overbek (who I really espect a lot) with his feet in a bucket talks a lot! I remember hearing J.J.'s comment after/during one of the Le Mans when he was having cramps in his feet.

Certainly life ain't always easy at Le mans but think about guys in the past doing 230 mph or something close to that in 917 during the night, with rain pouring down!
Makes 190 mph in a GT3RS truly like a walk in a park by comparison, with or without a/c.

Nordschleife

look at it from a team manager's point of view -

if something in the car gets too hot, you put in another radiator
if the driver gets too hot, you put in another radiator

you do what it takes to get the job done

R+C

Z-man

You could always put in another driver instead...

-Z.

kurt M

Add the AC to a cool suit system that cools the driver rather than the entire cockpit. Use a variable frequency magnetic coupled clutch on the compressor. This is not a clamp clutch like on street AC systems but a system that magnetically couples the pulley to the compressor. The frequency drive would be able to vary the speed differential between the pulley and compressor. As more cooling is needed the compressor speed increases. As the belt speed increases or the demand drops the frequency drive increases the RPM delta and the compressor slows down and consumes less power.

Build the same system to cool the entire cockpit if needed or mandated. Just build it larger. Insulation is the best thing to do overall. If the inside of a car is too hot and hotter than ambient look for the source of the heat and block it from infiltrating.

The builder that makes a car that is less taxing on the driver is building a better car in this respect. Build the car with this as one of the factors to contend with and you have built a better car. GM was shortsighted in not insulating the compartment enough. Yes there was a reason tha tthe foot well was so hot but it could of and should of been seen and dealt with in the build phase.

Nordschleife

we aren't in the movies now, this is for real.

R+C

Larry Herman

Hmmm. That could easily be run by a small electric compressor. Maybe I'd better get out to the work shop & come up with something. We could name them the Herman Cool Suit. Got to call my patent attorney too.

Z-man

Yeah, but can you get SFI 38.1 certification?

Opps, wrong thread.
-Z.

kurt M

A direct drive system is less cost in hp and weight. Converting rotating motion into elec and then back onto rotating motion is very wastfull of energy. On the other hand you can put the system wherever you want with a electric compressor and if driver only it could be a small unit. (the compressor that is)

mitch236

Actually, I think Larry has the idea. I would love to buy a system that uses the existing a/c in my car to provide for my cool suit. That way, I wouldn't need all that ice!

Nordschleife

You will find that Audi and Ames Research Centre are already going down that route. Years ago Vasek Polak Racing was working with NASA on this problem.

There is some (unsuccessful so far) work going on in making a cool suit balaclava, and making HUD work on the inside of the visor. My hi-itech contribution - put a stack of balaclavas in a deep freeze cabinet (in drylock bags) that is at the back of the pits (we have big pits in Europe, not hot pits).

Every outback Aussie knows how to chill beer quickly, no matter how hot it is.

R+C

Racerrob

Hell of an idea, quick, call Porsche!





Quote: "Add the AC to a cool suit system that cools the driver rather than the entire cockpit. Use a variable frequency magnetic coupled clutch on the compressor. This is not a clamp clutch like on street AC systems but a system that magnetically couples the pulley to the compressor. The frequency drive would be able to vary the speed differential between the pulley and compressor. As more cooling is needed the compressor speed increases. As the belt speed increases or the demand drops the frequency drive increases the RPM delta and the compressor slows down and consumes less power.

Build the same system to cool the entire cockpit if needed or mandated. Just build it larger. Insulation is the best thing to do overall. If the inside of a car is too hot and hotter than ambient look for the source of the heat and block it from infiltrating.

The builder that makes a car that is less taxing on the driver is building a better car in this respect. Build the car with this as one of the factors to contend with and you have built a better car. GM was shortsighted in not insulating the compartment enough. Yes there was a reason tha tthe foot well was so hot but it could of and should of been seen and dealt with in the build phase."

kurt M

Mitch. This would be EASY to build from off the shelf stuff. As to cooling the head and feet drop the water and pipe cold air. Only one hose and also clears the helmet visor. In fact just compress air and strip the heat from it. This will also dry the air. As it goes from high pressure to 0 bar it will be cooler than ambiant. All problems covered in one shot with only one hose to conect and no water to deal with.

why are most race cars so poorly set up for cooling or dehumidification? There is plenty of air that can be ducted where ever it might be needed. Yes ducts increase CoF but by how much and is it countered by the driver being able to think better see better and drive longer?

When ever it rains the drivers are all scrambling to clear the glass. We are not takling about a lot of weight but more in terms of design and planning for it in the first place. Many of the Pro cars I have looked over have crude almost after though air control. A hose zip tied to a roll bar conected to a NACA duct or the like is almost an advanced version in many cars.

Arkadi, I have lots of ideas just not many good ones...

Nordschleife

Kurt
There is a new microscopic treatment for windscreens that banishes fogging, pretty useful in a race car.
As far as dry air is concerned, we can have problems with sore throats and dry mouths if the air is too dry.

R+C

Adam Richman

I'd bet a handful show up at their first race or first race of a season with a few tricks that either a) don't end up working or b) got in the way during that ECM change and oops. On the former, any kind of ducting can look incredibly well thought out in the shop on jack stands or with a big box fan blowing at it but how they "actually" work is something often times unexpected.

Also, use ducts long enough and you will drive through someone else's off and track return - its a great way to get a suit (or face) full of dirt that NACA ducts are indiscriminant about pulling in just as well as air. Things like that make me at least weary of where ducts go or most of the time, just not use them. Those that run through air filters are IMO much wiser implementations but I have only seen those used on FA helmets, not mass air to the drivers chest or neck.