Notices
Racing & Drivers Education Forum
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Michelin Teams to Boycott USGP?? (Developing)

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 06-19-2005, 09:17 PM
  #31  
Larry Herman
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
 
Larry Herman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Columbus, NJ
Posts: 10,432
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Nordschleife
the FIA felt their 'rules', which to be honest they mostly make up on the fly, were more important than putting on a good race. This sort of attitude is typical of fascists and stupid people, or both......
I guess that we are in the minority because I totally agree. This is not Michelin's fault, nor was it foreseeable. The track was reground this year, and the change in surface friction could certainly have affected the situation. Also, isn't the most critical item here DRIVER SAFETY? The FIA could have allowed the Michelin teams to run the alternate tires with some sort of penalty, like all having to start from the pit lane, effectively putting all the Bridgestone runners at the front. The Michelin cars would probably have incurred a performance penalty, not having setup for the new tires, which logically would have been slower anyway. No, this is totally and completely the FIA and Eccelstone's fault; intransigent, meglomaniacal bastards.

BTW I think that the no tire change rule is stupid anyway. This would have not been a problem under the old rules.
__________________
Larry Herman
2016 Ford Transit Connect Titanium LWB
2018 Tesla Model 3 - Electricity can be fun!
Retired Club Racer & National PCA Instructor
Past Flames:
1994 RS America Club Racer
2004 GT3 Track Car
1984 911 Carrera Club Racer
1974 914/4 2.0 Track Car

CLICK HERE to see some of my ancient racing videos.

Old 06-19-2005, 09:33 PM
  #32  
38D
Nordschleife Master
 
38D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: About to pass you...
Posts: 6,626
Received 787 Likes on 401 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Larry Herman
IBTW I think that the no tire change rule is stupid anyway. This would have not been a problem under the old rules.
Yeah, I've never understood the one set of tires for qual & the race rule.
Old 06-19-2005, 11:14 PM
  #33  
carreracup21
Three Wheelin'
 
carreracup21's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,335
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I just heard that Eccelstone was personally telling team managers to race.. the show must go on, but the teams defied him. That's something that never used to happen. I wonder if there will be any attempted sanctions against the teams for not driving. Also, all the Michelin tire incidents were on Friday. When teams increased tire pressures and changed their camber settings to compensate for the load in 13, there were no further incidents on Sat. . Michelin came up with several "proposals", to alleviate the problem including changing the track, likely knowing none would be acceptable, but that would give them the out they needed to shift blame to the FIA...... Which they did of coarse.
Old 06-19-2005, 11:30 PM
  #34  
Larry Herman
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
 
Larry Herman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Columbus, NJ
Posts: 10,432
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by carreracup21
Also, all the Michelin tire incidents were on Friday. When teams increased tire pressures and changed their camber settings to compensate for the load in 13, there were no further incidents on Sat. . Michelin came up with several "proposals", to alleviate the problem including changing the track, likely knowing none would be acceptable, but that would give them the out they needed to shift blame to the FIA......
This is what I do not understand. If all the Michelin runners made the changes, and this really did alleviate the problem, then why was there still a concern? Toyota, Renault and McClaren were clearly faster than Ferrari, and one of them would probably have won the race, so what was there to gain? What was Michelin's motive in this, if it were not clearly out of concern for driver safety? It seems to me that Michelin still felt there was such a serious problem that it was worth this debacle.
Old 06-20-2005, 09:39 AM
  #35  
Bill L Seifert
Three Wheelin'
 
Bill L Seifert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Hailey, Idaho
Posts: 1,561
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Saying that Toyota, Renault and McClaren were faster than Ferrari, is, I think, not true. Toyota started very light. Someone suggested that they put in a chicane and let the teams get three laps of practice to get use to the chicane. Toyota supposedly said that they did not have enough gas to do three laps and start the race. I think the rule that lets them start on fumes is also stupid. I do, however I think the whole thing is Michelin's fault, though a lot of people have secondary fault.

Bill
Old 06-20-2005, 12:45 PM
  #36  
924RACR
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
924RACR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Royal Oak, MI
Posts: 3,976
Received 73 Likes on 58 Posts
Angry

Originally Posted by carreracup21
I just heard that Eccelstone was personally telling team managers to race.. the show must go on, but the teams defied him. That's something that never used to happen. I wonder if there will be any attempted sanctions against the teams for not driving. Also, all the Michelin tire incidents were on Friday. When teams increased tire pressures and changed their camber settings to compensate for the load in 13, there were no further incidents on Sat. . Michelin came up with several "proposals", to alleviate the problem including changing the track, likely knowing none would be acceptable, but that would give them the out they needed to shift blame to the FIA...... Which they did of course.
I agree, and I think that the FIA scarfed that bait down hook, line and sinker - give 'em an opportunity to demonstrate their pompousness and they will! I was there, down in Turn 1, and yeah, it was kinda ugly. But I think Michelin and the FIA both deserve blame on this one... too bad the fans seemed to all be booing the red cars - for once they weren't really so much the bad guys, IMO.

The joy of politics. I'mn looking forward to some REAL racing next weekend, back home!

I think the Michelin teams were more than happy to take the opportunity to blow a big load of egg all over Bernie's face, knock some of the wind out of him as the Concorde Agreement expires. It's all bargaining position, and there are no saints in this one - not even the fans!
Old 06-21-2005, 03:38 AM
  #37  
vegasgolf98
Racer
 
vegasgolf98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Henderson, NV
Posts: 473
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I was in Turn One too and if 160,000 fans were there only 10 or so throwing things. It wasn't crazy. Most of them left after the first 20 laps.
Old 06-21-2005, 07:42 AM
  #38  
Konstantin
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
Konstantin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Germany/Braunschweig
Posts: 1,937
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Michelin screwed everything. BUT FIA should give the michelin cars a weight penalty and let them run with new tires. This could equalize the advandage of new tires. This is maybe not fair and it is not in the rules. but it would be fair for the fans who came to the track to see ALL the F1 cars racing.

At leat the Supercup had to great race and we won both of them. Did the Supercup came on teh TV in USA?
We get it on Pay TV in Germany. Realy nice and exciting

Konstantin
Old 06-21-2005, 01:18 PM
  #39  
M758
Race Director
 
M758's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Phoenix, Az
Posts: 17,643
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 7 Posts
Default

We dont get supercup coverage in the US. Sometimes we get wrapup shows covering the season highlights.

Great Job out there. Two wins. My friend and I got lucky as we walked by as Salens came out from Gasoline alley for pictures with Fans. I could see he was really pumped up about his performance. Really cool to see, plus my friend got his picture take with him!
Old 06-21-2005, 01:39 PM
  #40  
Konstantin
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
Konstantin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Germany/Braunschweig
Posts: 1,937
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

yes david is really cool. I always have to bring him back to teh earth when I discuss with him all his mistakes on the telemetry data ;-)
Then I must hear from him:" Do you have also something good to tell to me?" And I must say: yes you are the fastetst but you could do better. Sometimes he hates me but he is happy again after he won a race ;-)

Konstantin
Old 06-21-2005, 02:35 PM
  #41  
M758
Race Director
 
M758's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Phoenix, Az
Posts: 17,643
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 7 Posts
Default

Mistakes on his telemetry! From the stands it looked like he was running away with the event. I did however see him lock up under braking in Turn 1 on the last lap of the second race. Had to hold position I guess.

Cool thing about it especially after all that happen is that here was guy you drove hard and came in with a great result. He was happy about it and was more than happy to indudge the fans who at an F1 event typically see driver running away from fans and maybe signing an autograph just apease the masses. He was pumped and happy share his joy with those around him. Really cool and nice to see!

Konstantin... Good work.... My guess is even after two wins you still have areas to "work on" in order to well for the next race. I assume the next one is Magey-Cours in the first week of July!
Old 06-22-2005, 02:12 AM
  #42  
Jean
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member

 
Jean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,445
Received 167 Likes on 100 Posts
Default

Great job Konstantin, you make everyone proud (and small) on Rennlist. Are you leading the championship already after this race?

Looking forward to see you closely in "telemetry analysis" action in Hockenheim, maybe you can even upgrade me into becoming an average driver
Old 06-22-2005, 04:22 AM
  #43  
Geo
Race Director
 
Geo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Houston, TX USA
Posts: 10,033
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

The whole situation just reminds me of the old FISA/FOCA wars.

Even back then Ferrari was in the middle of all the controversy.



Quick Reply: Michelin Teams to Boycott USGP?? (Developing)



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 04:01 PM.