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Different regions phrase differently and this can lend to confusion aside from common sense about harness bars:
The general rule is where harness bars and 6 point is not explicitly forbidden, a roll bar is at a minimum strongly encouraged to complete a safety system. (see below)
A casual search finds this:
Regions explicitly require roll protection that passes the "broomstick test".
CVR, Schattenbaum, Potomac.
Potomac is a little vague and some could misread the rules: Potomac tech form
But this is clear: Harness guide bars can only be used to guide shoulder straps, NOT secure them,
The participant should BE AWARE that the addition of such a seat and harness system results in the occupant being fastened upright in the vehicle. Therefore, in order to have a COMPLETE SYSTEM, a properly padded roll bar or roll cage is recommended, and an approved head and neck restraint device is required. A head and neck restraint device certified as meeting the standards of either SFI 38.1 or FIA 8858 or its successor is required. The use of such a harness system without roll protection and a head and neck restraint device may result in an unsafe environment and is not a COMPLETE SYSTEM. Roll bars or cages and their installation must meet PCA Club Racing Standards.
The general PCA tech form requires roll protection and with use of harness H&N protection: PCA Tech form
Its a little vague but still blunt:
The Entrant should be aware that the addition of such a seat and harness system results in the occupant being fastened upright in the vehicle. Therefore, in order to have a COMPLETE SYSTEM, a properly
padded roll bar or roll cage is recommended and an approved head and neck restraint device is
required. A head and neck restraint device certified as meeting the standards of either SFI 38.1 or FIA
8858 or its successor is required. The use of such a harness system without roll protection and a head
and neck restraint device may result in an unsafe environment and is not a COMPLETE SYSTEM. Roll
bars or cages and their installation must meet PCA Club Racing Standards.
Because the addition of the harness means that the occupants are fastened upright in the vehicle, a roll bar or roll cage is strongly encouraged to complete the SYSTEM. The use of one without the other may result in an unsafe environment and is not a complete SYSTEM.
Here is an article about a prepared car at Laguna trying for a lap record that for some inexplicable reason did not have a cage or even half cage A miracle the driver wasn't killed. Look at the picture: https://www.motor1.com/news/713679/g...na-seca-crash/
you may wanna quote the entire thing, not just the parts that lend support to your position. for example the first tech form linked actually says:
Harness guide bars can only be used to guide shoulder straps, NOT secure them, unless the manufacturer provides written proof.
so they can be used in the correct situation as the mounting point. actually all of the above seem to allow the use of a harness bar, including the first 3 regions which i am assuming you are a member of one. the consistent is that any open or semi-open must have factory protection or a roll bar, and if using a 5/6/7 point harness a hans is required.
(** What is a manufacturer roll over protection? You tell me ***)
straight from the porsche website:
In the open-top 718 Boxster models, dual roll-over protection creates survival space in the event of a roll-over or side impact. The front roll-over protection element is made from super-high-strength steel. The rear roll-over bars located behind the seats are made from an aluminium and steel composite. These come fully trimmed and provide a high degree of safety.
here is an example of a 911 cab after a collision:
Appreciate the details gents. Since we are sharing regional info, attached is a link to the Chicago Regions run group definitions and safety equipment requirements. As mentioned in a previous post, the fastest run group (black) must run a half cage, 5/6 point harnesses and Hans. To me it makes sense given the speeds.
Harness bars (such as brey krause) are permitted without a cage, but only in the three slower run groups. But to run in black, you need the full montey.
Its important to nail down a point on harness bars for anyone thats trying to figure this stuff out. They are NOT a half cage/roll bar, nor do they provide any safety protection for your upper body and head if you roll the car. No different than seat belts as it related to upper body and head protection. However, with a good 4 point harness, they will strap you down into the seat substantially better than seat belts. And you can use a Hans device.
Because the 4 point harnesses come with the center release, you can get out of the car faster than a seat belt without getting tangled up. Yeah, believe it or not I have tested it.
Assuming your regions rules allow you to use a harness bar in your particular run group, and you are looking to be more firmly strapped into your car seat and even run a Hans, the brey krause or similar quality harness bar is a viable option.
But my vote is for safety first w/ a half cage. If you want flexibility for street and track, check out Heigo. FvD carries the Heigo line. They even have removable cross bars if you want to squeeze your golf clubs in the back of a 911 when you aren't on the track.
Good discussion guys. Good to see the regional variation.
05-21-2024, 08:59 PM
