roll bars and seats
06-08-2004, 04:11 PM
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roll bars and seats
My friend has an 84 944 that he wants to put a racing seat and rollbar into. Considering that 944's are a bit slim on room, what could he fit in that will still support a fairly big dude? And what are some opinions on the best roll bar for the 944?
06-08-2004, 05:02 PM
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http://www.redlinerennsport.com/SafeguardPage.html
He is a Rennlister and a helpful one at that (RedlineMan). I have an Autopower in my 951, but it was installed by the PO. I think the Redline one is better.
As far as seats go, I don't know what works well for big guys as I am an average sized guy. You could look at the Sparco Evo 2 and Evo 3, I think those are wider than normal seats. I think Recaro also makes some of their models in larger sizes.
Max
He is a Rennlister and a helpful one at that (RedlineMan). I have an Autopower in my 951, but it was installed by the PO. I think the Redline one is better.
As far as seats go, I don't know what works well for big guys as I am an average sized guy. You could look at the Sparco Evo 2 and Evo 3, I think those are wider than normal seats. I think Recaro also makes some of their models in larger sizes.
Max
06-08-2004, 06:28 PM
#3
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944's actually have plenty of room for large drivers and roll bars.
Autopower is one . Ok, but bolts to floor through holes you must drill
Redline is really a very good harness bar, but not quite a full-up roll bar. Nice thing is that it is very simple install and easly removed with no drilling.
Safety Devices also makes a good one. Probably the best bolt in roll bar. However its strength is also its pain. It has nut plates that must be welded to the chassis. These are in nice spots on the chassis (better than autopower), but must be welded in. The bolt in cage then bolts to these.
Autopower is one . Ok, but bolts to floor through holes you must drill
Redline is really a very good harness bar, but not quite a full-up roll bar. Nice thing is that it is very simple install and easly removed with no drilling.
Safety Devices also makes a good one. Probably the best bolt in roll bar. However its strength is also its pain. It has nut plates that must be welded to the chassis. These are in nice spots on the chassis (better than autopower), but must be welded in. The bolt in cage then bolts to these.
06-08-2004, 08:39 PM
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Hey guys;
SC - Why is that 911 guys always get information regarding 944s BACKWARDS to reality.
- I have never constantly banged shoulders or helmets with my student in a 944. We have banged heads, but that's over their driving!
- My student has never shifted my left knee into fourth gear in a 944.
- I have never driven with my head laying on my shoulder to fit under the sunroof in a 944.
- I have never had to drive with the door open and the shifter permanently stuck in 5th gear to give room for my knees in a 944.
... I could go on.
Anyway, if your friend wants good harness mounting, low intrusion & hassle, and no mods, there is only one choice. That would be ME.
If you want more protection, you'll have to cut and/or weld. Safety Devices would be my choice. If you want protection above all else, custom is the way. I do that too, and for what it costs to get something you can live with, it makes more sense than Tinkertoy-cage-in-a-box.
SC - Why is that 911 guys always get information regarding 944s BACKWARDS to reality.
- I have never constantly banged shoulders or helmets with my student in a 944. We have banged heads, but that's over their driving!
- My student has never shifted my left knee into fourth gear in a 944.
- I have never driven with my head laying on my shoulder to fit under the sunroof in a 944.
- I have never had to drive with the door open and the shifter permanently stuck in 5th gear to give room for my knees in a 944.
... I could go on.
Anyway, if your friend wants good harness mounting, low intrusion & hassle, and no mods, there is only one choice. That would be ME.
If you want more protection, you'll have to cut and/or weld. Safety Devices would be my choice. If you want protection above all else, custom is the way. I do that too, and for what it costs to get something you can live with, it makes more sense than Tinkertoy-cage-in-a-box.
06-08-2004, 11:26 PM
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Actually i'm just relaying what he asked me over to the board, i've had 3 944's, including one turbo before. Personally, the 44's have better room than 911's. But then again, this dude is 240lbs and about 6-4. Anyhow, thank's for the replies, i'll relay them over to him and see what he does.
06-09-2004, 01:12 AM
#6
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1FastREDSC: What will your friend be using his 944 for?
If it's for street driving, then a rollbar and racing seats are not necessary. (Side note: most 5/6 point harnesses are not DOT approved for street driving)
If it is for DE's and autocrossing, then the Redline Rollbar is a perfect solution. That's what I have in my car. Before, I had a simple harness bar, and while I believe it was a sufficient device for holding the harnesses, it offered no roll-over protection. John's Redline rollbar does!
If your friend is planning on getting into SCCA or PCA or NASA club racing, then the Redline Rollbar is not the best choice - most clubs now require a full cage - check with the sanctioning body's rule book before you make this decision.
HTH,
-Z-man.
If it's for street driving, then a rollbar and racing seats are not necessary. (Side note: most 5/6 point harnesses are not DOT approved for street driving)
If it is for DE's and autocrossing, then the Redline Rollbar is a perfect solution. That's what I have in my car. Before, I had a simple harness bar, and while I believe it was a sufficient device for holding the harnesses, it offered no roll-over protection. John's Redline rollbar does!
If your friend is planning on getting into SCCA or PCA or NASA club racing, then the Redline Rollbar is not the best choice - most clubs now require a full cage - check with the sanctioning body's rule book before you make this decision.
HTH,
-Z-man.
06-09-2004, 01:54 AM
#7
Definitely more room in the 951 than in my old Carrera - no doubt!
I'm 6'5" and 210#
Z - ROTFL over some of your 911 classics - all true.
Roll bars are OK for DE, but he will need a cage to race.
Get your bud to try the Kirkey Deluxe Road Race seat. Strong, tons of support, and comfortable for the larger dude. They make 'em in ++ sizes.
I'm 6'5" and 210#
Z - ROTFL over some of your 911 classics - all true.
Roll bars are OK for DE, but he will need a cage to race.
Get your bud to try the Kirkey Deluxe Road Race seat. Strong, tons of support, and comfortable for the larger dude. They make 'em in ++ sizes.
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06-09-2004, 10:04 AM
#8
Race Director
Originally posted by APKhaos
Z - ROTFL over some of your 911 classics - all true.
Z - ROTFL over some of your 911 classics - all true.
-Z-man.
06-09-2004, 11:41 AM
#9
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Originally posted by 1FastRedSC
Personally, the 44's have better room than 911's. But then again, this dude is 240lbs and about 6-4. Anyhow, thank's for the replies, i'll relay them over to him and see what he does.
Personally, the 44's have better room than 911's. But then again, this dude is 240lbs and about 6-4. Anyhow, thank's for the replies, i'll relay them over to him and see what he does.
No space issues.
06-09-2004, 01:00 PM
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I am only 6'1" and hit my head on the roof ( I've had to remove the headliner and sunroof mechanism)! I am using a Sparco Touring seat and love it. But this a track car and that seat is too cumbersome for street duty.
06-09-2004, 01:08 PM
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When I had my factory seat on the passenger side, my instructor was not able to put his helmet on with his head in the car. He had to poke his head out of the window and put it on. I would say he was probably 6'3"-6'4".
Now that my SRD is on the passenger side and it sits much lower, I don't think it will be a problem. There is also less leg room on the passenger side with my Autopower roll bar because on the driver's side the bar is recessed to accomodate the seat.
I would imagine if your friend put in fixed seats like the Recaro/Sparcos or Kirkeys, space would not be an issue at all.
At least he isn't trying fit into a hardtop Lotus Elise!
Now that my SRD is on the passenger side and it sits much lower, I don't think it will be a problem. There is also less leg room on the passenger side with my Autopower roll bar because on the driver's side the bar is recessed to accomodate the seat.
I would imagine if your friend put in fixed seats like the Recaro/Sparcos or Kirkeys, space would not be an issue at all.
At least he isn't trying fit into a hardtop Lotus Elise!
06-09-2004, 02:25 PM
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Hey All;
6'5"/235 here!
Anyway, headroom can certainly be a problem in 944s with stock seats and helmets. Although it creates an unnaturally long reach, we usually deal with it by laying the seat back.
This can create a problem with race seats because A) they obviously are not articulated, and B) they need to be fairly upright to compensate.
I have recently installed Kirkey Road Race Deluxe seats in two cars; a 996 and my own 944. I had EXTREME difficulty in both cases getting them positioned correctly for optimal driving efficiency without undue compromise, and was only partially successful in the latter regard. Although they are a nice seat for sure, for reasons of layout I would not recommend them. They simply do not offer the right architecture for many reasons unless one has short legs. Not to say that people do not use them successfully. They just are not easy to deal with in my experience.
I would suggest that if someone is looking for an alloy seat that they look into Ultrashield. http://www.ultrashieldrace.com Although their website is not up to date regarding their model line, they do offer some very nice and modern road seats in both 20 degree and 10 degree layback.
The latter spec is crucial. I have found a 20 degree seat (Kirkey) FAR too reclined to be effective. I have attempted to work with Kirkey to remedy this, but they claim to be too busy right now to take me up on it. We'll see.
6'5"/235 here!
Anyway, headroom can certainly be a problem in 944s with stock seats and helmets. Although it creates an unnaturally long reach, we usually deal with it by laying the seat back.
This can create a problem with race seats because A) they obviously are not articulated, and B) they need to be fairly upright to compensate.
I have recently installed Kirkey Road Race Deluxe seats in two cars; a 996 and my own 944. I had EXTREME difficulty in both cases getting them positioned correctly for optimal driving efficiency without undue compromise, and was only partially successful in the latter regard. Although they are a nice seat for sure, for reasons of layout I would not recommend them. They simply do not offer the right architecture for many reasons unless one has short legs. Not to say that people do not use them successfully. They just are not easy to deal with in my experience.
I would suggest that if someone is looking for an alloy seat that they look into Ultrashield. http://www.ultrashieldrace.com Although their website is not up to date regarding their model line, they do offer some very nice and modern road seats in both 20 degree and 10 degree layback.
The latter spec is crucial. I have found a 20 degree seat (Kirkey) FAR too reclined to be effective. I have attempted to work with Kirkey to remedy this, but they claim to be too busy right now to take me up on it. We'll see.