Moving to a dedicated track car
10-16-2018, 11:03 AM
#31
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Being a 911 and GT4 guy - I don't know that you'd be happy with the speed of a SPB. I think a SP996 is a great car that's a happy balance of speed, performance, and cost of running. There is a SP996 for sale on the site here that I know personally and the car is awesome.
Take one piece of advice from me though - buy one that's already built. Don't pretend that building one yourself is the way to go.
Take one piece of advice from me though - buy one that's already built. Don't pretend that building one yourself is the way to go.
10-16-2018, 11:58 AM
#32
Three Wheelin'
Trailer and tow vehicle are, at least to me, a different expense as I can buy them used and not suffer too much depreciation. Same with the right race car.
In terms of consumables here are the tire and brake costs 991.2 vs GT4:
Tires
GT4: RE-71R - $2000 installed, 4 track days: $500 per day
991.2S: MPSC2 - $3000 installed, 3 track days: $1000 per day
Front Brake pads (approx):
GT4: $500 - 7 days: $71 per day
991.2S: $500 - 4 days: $125 per day
Rear pads (approx.)
GT4: $500 - 12 track days: $41 per day
991.2S: $500 - 4 track days: $125 per day
TOTAL:
GT4: $612
991.2S: $1250
Not sure why it's so different in terms of brakes except that I probably didn't brake as much in the GT4, my data suggests I carry more speed in the corners but lose to the Carrera coming out of corners.
In terms of consumables here are the tire and brake costs 991.2 vs GT4:
Tires
GT4: RE-71R - $2000 installed, 4 track days: $500 per day
991.2S: MPSC2 - $3000 installed, 3 track days: $1000 per day
Front Brake pads (approx):
GT4: $500 - 7 days: $71 per day
991.2S: $500 - 4 days: $125 per day
Rear pads (approx.)
GT4: $500 - 12 track days: $41 per day
991.2S: $500 - 4 track days: $125 per day
TOTAL:
GT4: $612
991.2S: $1250
Not sure why it's so different in terms of brakes except that I probably didn't brake as much in the GT4, my data suggests I carry more speed in the corners but lose to the Carrera coming out of corners.
Honestly you might be better off with some pro instructions to save on the consumables.
10-16-2018, 12:00 PM
#33
Burning Brakes
I know that car really well - been in it a bunch of times. I also know the owner (owns the local P-car indy) and know that he spares no expense on it (and it's priced well).
I've got nothing to motivate me to say any of the above other than it's the car I should have bought instead of building mine.
10-16-2018, 12:03 PM
#34
Burning Brakes
10-16-2018, 12:32 PM
#35
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Ok, not going to go into the details. Tire Rack has Sport Cup 2's for a 991.2 for $1,667 right now. My point is that the GT4 20's and the 991.2 20's are about the same price add $100 to mount and balance or even $200 on the high end. $3,000 for tires is crazy if you are in the USA. If not, oh well, end of discussion for me. Your other prices are debatable.
Honestly you might be better off with some pro instructions to save on the consumables.
Honestly you might be better off with some pro instructions to save on the consumables.
10-16-2018, 12:42 PM
#36
I love the Radicals but am concerned about safety with the open cockpit. They make sense and a rebuild every 2 seasons isn't nuts as the low consumable cost makes up for them. I agree about great deals out there right now, even here in Canada.
In terms of budget I was thinking about $40-50k for the car, depends if I end up keeping the 991 really. I'm thinking a $25k 944 would be enough to start with for a season or 2.
In terms of budget I was thinking about $40-50k for the car, depends if I end up keeping the 991 really. I'm thinking a $25k 944 would be enough to start with for a season or 2.
Charley
10-16-2018, 01:01 PM
#37
Rennlist Member
To the OP, I was in the exact position you were earlier this season with my 997TT, looking over the financial cliff of making major modifications to my 997TT + the continued running costs, versus directing that money towards a purpose built track tool.
I went with a fully built 987.1 Cayman S. For 10's of thousands less than your budget in Canadian dollars. It has been the best car related decision I've ever made, and probably a great financial decision as well. I am down 250hp but am lapping seconds faster and having WAY more fun doing it.
Enjoy the search, it's half the fun.
I went with a fully built 987.1 Cayman S. For 10's of thousands less than your budget in Canadian dollars. It has been the best car related decision I've ever made, and probably a great financial decision as well. I am down 250hp but am lapping seconds faster and having WAY more fun doing it.
Enjoy the search, it's half the fun.
10-16-2018, 01:08 PM
#38
Race Car
Track-only 996 GT3. There have been a few pop up this year that are too track focused to be converted back to full time street cars and they've all been in the low 50's.
It's plenty fast, it's light-osj, no driver nannies, OEM adjustable suspension equipment is more than enough for most, availability of cup car parts that are interchangeable as necessary, 18" wheels...buy all the used nitto's and used slicks you can get your hands on for $100 / tire, Cheap $100 each cayenne rotors go on the front, aftermarket slotted rotors for the rear are $300 for the pair. Pads are still expensive but get an endurance pad that will last you near a full season. Mezger motorsport based engine is relatively bullet proof just fix the coolant fittings when you get it. Even wheel bearings and other consumables you don't think about often aren't really that bad.
Its not Miata cheap to run, but is' relatively cheap compared to most other modern Porsche's and will run circles around everything proposed here thus far (except the radical...though it won't be far behind) while making you a disciplined driver all at the same time.
I'd suggest 996 cup but the maintenance intervals are a little more intensive and most of them have a long history at this point...unless you know the background a caged / track prepped 996 GT3 probably fits the bill better for you.
It's plenty fast, it's light-osj, no driver nannies, OEM adjustable suspension equipment is more than enough for most, availability of cup car parts that are interchangeable as necessary, 18" wheels...buy all the used nitto's and used slicks you can get your hands on for $100 / tire, Cheap $100 each cayenne rotors go on the front, aftermarket slotted rotors for the rear are $300 for the pair. Pads are still expensive but get an endurance pad that will last you near a full season. Mezger motorsport based engine is relatively bullet proof just fix the coolant fittings when you get it. Even wheel bearings and other consumables you don't think about often aren't really that bad.
Its not Miata cheap to run, but is' relatively cheap compared to most other modern Porsche's and will run circles around everything proposed here thus far (except the radical...though it won't be far behind) while making you a disciplined driver all at the same time.
I'd suggest 996 cup but the maintenance intervals are a little more intensive and most of them have a long history at this point...unless you know the background a caged / track prepped 996 GT3 probably fits the bill better for you.
10-16-2018, 01:08 PM
#39
Rennlist Member
Spec Cayman
Spec 996
Both these cars are great options for what you are looking for. This Spec Cayman Matt D mentioned is my old car and is very well sorted. Brakes are cheap and you can run affordable 18in nitto nt01's for DE's which last forever. Spec 996 also seems to be very well sorted and has a trailer package option. Both cars post similar lap times and have similar running costs and both cars are in my in car video here! Good luck with your next steps.
Spec 996
Both these cars are great options for what you are looking for. This Spec Cayman Matt D mentioned is my old car and is very well sorted. Brakes are cheap and you can run affordable 18in nitto nt01's for DE's which last forever. Spec 996 also seems to be very well sorted and has a trailer package option. Both cars post similar lap times and have similar running costs and both cars are in my in car video here! Good luck with your next steps.
10-16-2018, 06:45 PM
#40
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Spec Cayman
Spec 996
Both these cars are great options for what you are looking for. This Spec Cayman Matt D mentioned is my old car and is very well sorted. Brakes are cheap and you can run affordable 18in nitto nt01's for DE's which last forever. Spec 996 also seems to be very well sorted and has a trailer package option. Both cars post similar lap times and have similar running costs and both cars are in my in car video here! Good luck with your next steps.
Watkins Glen sprint race start Spec Cayman Spec 996. 360 cam
Spec 996
Both these cars are great options for what you are looking for. This Spec Cayman Matt D mentioned is my old car and is very well sorted. Brakes are cheap and you can run affordable 18in nitto nt01's for DE's which last forever. Spec 996 also seems to be very well sorted and has a trailer package option. Both cars post similar lap times and have similar running costs and both cars are in my in car video here! Good luck with your next steps.
Watkins Glen sprint race start Spec Cayman Spec 996. 360 cam
10-17-2018, 02:44 PM
#41
Rennlist Member
Yes I'd say the price difference is due to a combination of things such as age/donor car cost, but also the sp996 racing class popularity has declined in recent years with some drivers moving on to the new sp997 class, spec cayman, gtb1, etc.. This class count decline tends to bring down the value somewhat to the racing community vs. Spec Cayman which is in a growth phase. You'll see the same thing happening with F-stock class 986 boxster S(another great DE car option) selling in the used market for similar and sometimes less than a well sorted SPB which has a lower build cost compared to F. Since SPB is such a popular race class, well sorted cars are going for pretty good money ($25k-$35k+)
With the donor car cost factored out of SP996 and SPC, I'd say build costs are quite similar for both classes. Cant go wrong with either, especially if your focus is primarily DE. I also recommend buying one done vs. building one.
10-17-2018, 03:19 PM
#42
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Yes I'd say the price difference is due to a combination of things such as age/donor car cost, but also the sp996 racing class popularity has declined in recent years with some drivers moving on to the new sp997 class, spec cayman, gtb1, etc.. This class count decline tends to bring down the value somewhat to the racing community vs. Spec Cayman which is in a growth phase. You'll see the same thing happening with F-stock class 986 boxster S(another great DE car option) selling in the used market for similar and sometimes less than a well sorted SPB which has a lower build cost compared to F. Since SPB is such a popular race class, well sorted cars are going for pretty good money ($25k-$35k+)
With the donor car cost factored out of SP996 and SPC, I'd say build costs are quite similar for both classes. Cant go wrong with either, especially if your focus is primarily DE. I also recommend buying one done vs. building one.
With the donor car cost factored out of SP996 and SPC, I'd say build costs are quite similar for both classes. Cant go wrong with either, especially if your focus is primarily DE. I also recommend buying one done vs. building one.
Last edited by Inrev; 10-17-2018 at 03:47 PM.
10-17-2018, 09:34 PM
#44
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Ok so we've explored Porsche race cars. I'm starting to understand the lineup of classes even though it's confusing. Any other brands besides Radical? I'm thinking BMW 1-series, or M-car. Or later Mustangs? (Boss 302S for example).
