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I've now done two AER weekends, one in my car and one with another team two years ago. Without question, it seems to be the best racing for the buck around. You have a lot of great drivers, fast cars, and constant competition. Not to mention, John, Alex, and team do an amazing job running the events.
Anyhow, I want to put together a solid team of capable drivers, who are looking to be competitive, have fun, are trustworthy good teammates, and financially stable. If anyone is interested, please lmk. The car is very competitive and will no doubt be able to win in it's class. This weekend unfortunately I had a clutch fail and that ended the race early, but here's a video of me behind the team in my class who won both days. You can see if the clutch wasn't slipping I could have easily taken him. Obviously being fast is just one component, having a reliable car that can go the appropriate time on fuel, a team in sync to make quick pit stops, and keep the car out of trouble is equally as important. I'm putting a lot of effort into the other areas now, and prior to the next race (may be in September at Summit) my goal is to have all those boxes checked off.
Car is a 2003 S2000.
No expenses spared on this build.
Incredibly cage, obviously all the other safety (NASA log book)
Anze built Penske's
Tuned and setup with data and help from Andrew Wikstrom
Standalone engine managment, AIM Dash, SmartyCam... bunch of other electronic goodies
Was previously raced with a supercharger and as such over built for that
AP Racing BBK in front with cooling ducts on all four wheels/hubs/calipers...
Huge oil cooler and dual core radiator
Radio system with 4-5 handsets, 2 pitcrew headsets, 15-20 foot pole antenna..
Will be adding trans cooler and fuel cell probably w/ dry break
Way too many other things to list
Thanks! Hey the beauty of arrive and drive is all you need is a gear, all of which is easily carried on a plane, I'm sure we can arrange pickup from local airports ;-)
How are you going to handle wrecks/incidents, of which there are a fair number in AER (or any series)?
I also have been exploring using my car for AER and this is the hangup with building a team. Does the owner "insure" it by collecting a fee, does each driver add to a pool of funds for each race, or does the driver insure? I've seen damage in excess of 30k+ on some of the cars that I know are in it.
Curious how you are going to handle it! It's my #1 question as I explore building a team with friends and fellow racers as well, or even as I consider joining a team down the road.
BTW, enjoyed watching the video from this weekend.
How are you going to handle wrecks/incidents, of which there are a fair number in AER (or any series)?
I also have been exploring using my car for AER and this is the hangup with building a team. Does the owner "insure" it by collecting a fee, does each driver add to a pool of funds for each race, or does the driver insure? I've seen damage in excess of 30k+ on some of the cars that I know are in it.
Curious how you are going to handle it! It's my #1 question as I explore building a team with friends and fellow racers as well, or even as I consider joining a team down the road.
BTW, enjoyed watching the video from this weekend.
A friend looked into this and it was prohibitively expensive to insure a race car for an amateur w2w endurance series. I think most teams operate on a 'you broke it, you buy it' policy?
A friend looked into this and it was prohibitively expensive to insure a race car for an amateur w2w endurance series. I think most teams operate on a 'you broke it, you buy it' policy?
I also heard it is prohibitively expensive and probably not worth it. I've discussed with friends some of the options above... I heard one team had everyone put in excess money for every race and then they built up a crash fund. Since they didn't crash, they used some of the money for upgrades to the car, resulting in a pretty sweet car.
My issue is that I find that some people do not have realistic expectations as to costs (e.g., how much it costs to have a well sorted E36, which is considered a "cheap" car). Having a team like this requires a high degree of trust and some common understanding as to true costs and expectations. Also perhaps some legal safeguards. It also opens up sadly liability to the owner if someone gets hurt. What happens if a driver blames failure of the car as the cause of the accident and refuses to pay? It totally stinks to have to think like this unfortunately...
That is my biggest fear at a track day or ever going racing. If the car gets destroyed all of that investment is gone. I can afford safety gear, entry fees, and consumables. I can't afford to replace the car if I have a temporary lack of talent and destroy it. It's one of the things which keeps me from joining friends for LeMons or ChumpCar races. I don't yet have the money in my bank account to cover a total loss.
The good rule still applies: Don’t track/race a car that you can’t easily leave as a complete write-off at the track without a sweat. A lot of people think they can afford to track/race cars which they probably can not — first due to underestimating the running costs and, second, due to underestimating the hit of a total loss to their mental and financial well-being.
I also heard it is prohibitively expensive and probably not worth it. I've discussed with friends some of the options above... I heard one team had everyone put in excess money for every race and then they built up a crash fund. Since they didn't crash, they used some of the money for upgrades to the car, resulting in a pretty sweet car.
My issue is that I find that some people do not have realistic expectations as to costs (e.g., how much it costs to have a well sorted E36, which is considered a "cheap" car). Having a team like this requires a high degree of trust and some common understanding as to true costs and expectations. Also perhaps some legal safeguards. It also opens up sadly liability to the owner if someone gets hurt. What happens if a driver blames failure of the car as the cause of the accident and refuses to pay? It totally stinks to have to think like this unfortunately...
Maybe run the car under a LLC which rents the car out to all drivers. If something goes south the owner of the car is protected, worst case just walk away from the entire LLC. I'm not an attorney so YMMV.
The good rule still applies: Don’t track/race a car that you can’t easily leave as a complete write-off at the track without a sweat. A lot of people think they can afford to track/race cars which they probably can not — first due to underestimating the running costs and, second, due to underestimating the hit of a total loss to their mental and financial well-being.
You're not exactly selling yourself as a co-driver!
You're not exactly selling yourself as a co-driver!
How so? Limiting your racing only to cars that you can afford to lose does not imply that you aim or prefer to lose them, just like buying insurance for your street car does not imply that you aim or prefer to crash it. Apples and oranges. I would prefer co-drivers (or partners) that can each easily afford to pay for the whole car vs. those that can't. You?
How so? Limiting your racing only to cars that you can afford to lose does not imply that you aim or prefer to lose them, just like buying insurance for your street car does not imply that you aim or prefer to crash it. Apples and oranges. I would prefer co-drivers (or partners) that can each easily afford to pay for the whole car vs. those that can't. You?
I didn't invent the rule I quoted.
My remark was in jest and not to be taken seriously. I was merely thinking that I might prefer that the first words out of a potential co-driver's mouth was something other than "let's just write it off". You are going with the bold statement and that is OK.
Regarding some of the risk factors, there are a few approaches that I've used.
1. I do have a separate corporation for motorsports, however I haven't transferred the car to it yet, although there's a high likelihood that I will (or a new one)
2. Regarding liability of drivers/insurance. The last group I rented to, we decided to have a shared cost structure on damage that was clearly proven not related to the drivers fault or a mechanical fault in the car. There was a preset cap on the total cost on the car, so worst case scenario if another racer slammed into the car caused it to go off track and it was completely totaled, the entire team would split the cost. If the driver is liable then he would pay. There is a ton of car data and in car video that would help prove who's at fault.
3. I have two contracts all drivers have to sign.
4. Some teams do setup escrow accounts, but that's asking too much, and not commonly done.
5. As stated in my original post, having the right drivers is not just someone who's fast, but also reasonible and financially secure. As all drivers will interview me and the car, I will interview them, including getting references and reviewing drivers in car race video.
Let's face it, in general every time we get in a race car we take a risk. We all try to minimize these risks as much as possible, but there will always be some risks.
05-23-2018, 11:16 AM
Looking to build an AER team
