Are you getting the basalt black? If yes, that was FAST!

No.

A dealer has a low miles CGT but it's the same colors as mine.

Yours is not low miles at 6,900? It seems low to me. :icon107:

It may be hard to believe but there are CGTs on the market <1000 miles.

I was offered one with 200 miles! Sick.

Yes it's low - but the idea was to double down and pick up a 1000 mile car.

Have one to drive senseless and let the other appreciate.

Looking back should have bought the Hurricane Sandy CGT that was 230k 3k miles a missed opportunity / fun project.

Anyway the bottom line - CGT's should be driven shown and enjoyed. This forum has seen a lot of guys barely enjoying their cars and it seems those owners have sold or are selling theirs which actually hurt values vs the alternative of none for sale.

The cool factor of the CGT today and later - will always be known as the best analog drivers car ... but if you own a low mileage CGT you appear to be sort of a wuss :)

Full disclosure - I was pursuing the one on e-bay with the pics on the track but decided not to play the sellers game and keep looking for a 2nd.

That one screams scam.

I don't know.

The seller has two others in the hunt - one here.
He acts like he is a well known owner and there are pictures of him driving or someone in the car. If that's not him those pics are a big risk.

Originally we agreed on a LOI and he came across as a decent guy that wanted to see the car go to a good home. All the sudden he got a few bites and it turned into a bidding war. Have learned trouble going in is double trouble going out I don't have the time and or energy to work with someone who plays games as I just went thru that with the broker who bought my Mclaren and another PIA seller here.

Hope it works out for the one buyer here.

Yup. This.

This guy ended up selling the RM Auction yellow CGT to Marshall Goldman without driving it at all. He also sold them his 200 mile CGT as well. So much for putting a collection together. Very strange.

Yeah, odd that BC sold them both. I knew he sold the one, but didn't know about the second that he grabbed off Sloan a little while back.

Guess he's satisfied with the blue Gemballa one:
https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.n...37514845_o.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...ed5c4ff87e.jpg

Weird other than he seems to love Veyron hp. Bliue CGT is more his style it is stunning and that plate works well.

Goldman had two low mileage silver CGT's guess those sold - any idea what the yellow is going for?

They get a lot of big players who go in and out of cars along with a lot of low mileage collector cars but many are from their own collection.

I think they would take $600k for either one.

CGT's with minimal use is an ad for feather dusters.

Anyone who wants to enjoy a CGT will spend a lot of money to make sure it's road ready. 50 miles a year IMO is a liability vs asset car movers don't mind glazing a clutch.

Flip side - there can't be many under 1000 mile cars left and it's just a matter of time before asking price is 7 figures vs 550 for 3 - 5k miles.

I'm not so sure the low miles garage queens will be the highly sought after ones in the future. I'm reminded of a 1911 Oldsmobile Limited with tattered tires and inches of dust that sold for much more than a restored one. Crazy.

I think if someone really wanted to make a great investment, take a CGT; go out on a highly publicized, wild drinking binge with some supermodels and tigers; (throw a clown in there just for the fun of it), run the car into a lake and leave it there for 40 years.
I'd love to be around to see what that one brings at auction.
Anyone else have a great investment idea?

Haha! Great post!! I'm with you

679k asking.

Get em while you can boys!

I missed out on the F40 & F50 - nice to enjoy the ride :)

Anyone see the new Ford GT - already called a dealer friend in hopes.

Just saw the 679k asking price on that one. Will be curious to see if someone picks it up for around that number. Seeing these prices, makes me glad I talked my dad into buying when I did! No news on the Ford GT, but I'm from the Detroit area so when some Ford employee decides to let some info slip, I'll keep you in the loop!

While I expect the Fayence Yellow one(s) to command a premium, especially considering the low mileage, keep in mind things have cooled down dramatically.

There are approx. 4-5 GT Silvers on the market, ranging from 1k miles to 6+k, all listed above $500k, all sitting for a while.

I would expect this to happen at these figures. The reason is simple. Because the price has now set itself around or above original MSRP, People are trying to get out of them at cost. Now we have good inventory on the market and people are afraid to be among the few who buy above MSRP for a CGT. I would imagine most of those Silver cars are single owner cars. I dont know this as fact though but it seems reasonable to assume.

I think the FGT was so cheap to begin with it reset to what MSRP should have been. Different scenario. But should people be paying half a million for that car? IDK

I also expect them to sell at somepoint even if slow at these levels. It may take a while to hit the next upshift for this car. But certainly $500K is reasonable in today's market. Hopefully we do see a slow down, for a few years, so i can get another one.

Oh, I completely agree. And I'm in the same boat as you on your last point. :)

I'm just saying that things aren't flying off the shelves anymore. :)

I think that it is very difficult to assess the current market based upon what is for sale. Other the MG's yellow car, which ticks the boxes of very low mileage combined with a rare color and thus will sell for a big number sooner or later, all others are silver. Not only the most common color, but they're all competing with one another. If a great black, red, white or PTS hit the market, I have a feeling it would sell quickly and for more money.

Agreed. 100%.

Even if there are 5 on the market the F40 F50 prices are crazy. The F40 at 300k F50 500k was not that long ago.

I am not writing a check for an F40 or F50 when CGT's are 1/3 at 550 - 600 even 700k.

My guess is we will see higher prices over the winter. There will be some crossing the auction block at big numbers. Porsche owners are silly to be selling right now.

Yeah, I've long maintained on FChat that we're in a bit of a Ferrari supercar (and some other cars, too, such as the 997.2 GT3 RS 4.0) bubble.

(I track Ferrari prices, not just Porsche.)

I just read an article on Ferrari's - Dino 365 330 few others and it appears that there is no end in sight. Of course when I picked the 612 and 16M they both went down and then was further insulted by the MP4. It's nice to finally be on the up tick :)

Aventador / F12's are 500k it makes the CGT look like the buy of the century.

People talk about the Ford GT initially priced below market - feel the same way about the CGT.

Hmm, Aventador's and F12's can be had for ~$400k if you look hard enough. Or just put down a deposit and wait, like everyone else, and get a brand new for MSRP (if you go to a reputable dealer outside of major hotspots).

The CGT wasn't priced below market when it came out. It took forever to move all of them initially. :( 918 Spyder has the same problem (granted, it's twice the MSRP).

But yes, the Dino. Wow. Skyrocketing prices.

:thumbup::thumbup:

Bespoke engine and design from head to toe. The 959 sold for half the price it cost to produce and I truly believe the CGT wasn't far off that ratio.

Then Porsche cut 06 production as it didn't meet seat belt laws. The 918 came out at the right time but there is no way it costs almost double of what the CGT cost to produce.

F1 engineers and designers do not think budget first - the clutch where the battery was located magnesium etc. are small expamples - open check book far different vs Porsche thinking today.

Biggest difference and I felt it with the Mclaren - factory filled the showroom with unsold units. People of wealth want exclusive buying power and I commend Porsche for not building unsold 918 units.

Ah, yes, makes sense. I misunderstood you. The market didn't think it was too low when it came out... But you did. :) I get that.

I see a bubble for many exotics (including Porsches), but do not think the CGT is a part of it. In short time, the CGT will be known as a 7-figure car, and will maintain that value.
My opinion of course.

Seven - one perhaps fake on e-bay = 3 - 4m in CGT's.

Group buy / double our money.

guys selling cgts to buy 918s I bet

Very well could be it's a completely different driving experience.

its hard to put miles on these cars - most guys who own them prob have 5 to 30 cars or more, have busy lives, family etc....theres no way I cld drive all of my cars with my work/life demands...

Agree - softened it up a bit. :)

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
love it

Silver / black 04 7600 miles 425k - it was sent to me off of Ferrari Chat.

New clutch and tires all maintenance less than 1000 miles ago.

That seems like a really good price, if it checks out on PPI and has a good history.

Sounds like a rare bargain in this market.

Just went over to F-chat. Looks like he needed to move it and found a potential buyer already.

I think it's very legit - if someone is interested get on a flight with a cashiers check and hard cash or maybe the new buyer will flip it

If not hope it's to someone here - there have been more than a few here who chose to sell their CGT outside of this forum.

Not a fan of f-chat but they do seem to have an active loyal buyer / seller theme.

I have to spoken to owner about cAr. I had a chance to buy and passed. Not because of car just because I decided i didnt two sitting idle as oppose to one. If anyone wants more information on car pm me. Bottomline its legit.

If the CAD $ wasn't in the ****s, I'd buy it.

What do you mean by CAD $ ???

Canadian rate of exchange.

Jamie is right - people are making a fortune off of exchange markets.

Not happy about that whole thing, have a bad feeling that I will never again see a CGT at similar price.
I gave my word so I would not back out of that deal but secretly hoping that the PPI tomorrow will not satisfy the buyer and he would cancel the purchase.
Somebody hit me on the head please, I am really doing something stupid selling that car.......:banghead:

I don't blame you. Every car added equals to additional costs and head aches especially having to store it at a 3rd party. However, you cannot get the same excitement you get out of this car from too many other cars out there. Good luck anyways.

Beautiful car, I can feel your pain. You priced it to sell, and it should sell easy at that level.

Don't sell what is sure to be the worlds greatest analog drivers car ever produced and continue posting the ownership experience.

Advice - turn on the radio full blast leave the engine lid open and go to sleep.

In a few days - jump start or purchase a new battery for 1000.00 installed.

The best ROI you will ever receive. All kidding aside after owning a lot of cars the CGT has been on my radar and it offers everything I could ever ask for.

There is not a car I would rather own :full stop:

I agreed to sell my car...but even before closing the deal (car is at the dealer now who is acting as a clearing house for the whole transaction) I bought another one!

I knew I would have missed the CGT too much but my car was too perfect to use and I had the impression that any additional mile would have had an impact on the value...so once the sale has been agreed I managed to find a black car with higher mileage so I can finally use it without the fear of depreciation!

Win win situation really!!

P.s. If you think the market is hot in the US you should come to the UK...total madness!!!

I have been looking for a low miles CGT for a while. I found a silver/ascot 1 owner right in my own backyard. The car was serviced a month ago. Clutch reading is fine and it has the new tires. There's not a scratch on the car. What's the max I should pay for this car???

Can you give us details on the one you sold and what price you got for it?

There are a few things that were / are required for me to stroke a check.

One owner no paint work every document and luggage etc.

No leaks proper maintenance 3 - 8k miles. I found two you now own one of them :)

Need more information - but if it's like above 525 - 550k

FWIW - I do not trust clutch readings it's to easy to glaze a clutch consider it requiring one which is under 10k refurbished from Porsche and it's a good time to address any issues 15 - 20k.

The car did have a leak therefore they replaced the seals. I am not planning to drive this one that much fwiw. My red one is the one I am keeping around for driving pleasure.

So you think $525k is a good price?

I agree with the condition of the car and what is important.

Does the luggage really matter? Cant you buy the luggage after market.....

Whats the highest mileage cgt out there. I saw one with 35k miles... Even at that mileage properly cared for it should be no big deal...

It has the luggage. Missing luggage would probably set you back another $10K.

BTW. Congratulations on your 918...................:bowdown:

I forgot to mention. Car has 1800 miles on it !!!

I have first hand experience with a CGT in Italy with 80k miles...was about to buy it but got too scared about the fact it was essentially uncharted territory and I could have spent way above the saving vs a lower mileage one in case of an engine failure of any sort!

Any paint work all documents one owner windshield no chips no leather defects?

There is a difference between buying new luggage vs the original - all these may not sound like a big deal but if you are buying a car for investment than it's important to get the best as the buyer down the road will think very similar and dollars are secondary.

Documents Documents Documents. I used to think the cheapest car was the best deal - reality is the most expensive using your better judgement is most likely the best for ROI.

How would anyone know if it's new luggage vs original?

They most likely would not.

Unless the car was advertised on the internet and it stated no luggage.

Is it worth misrepresenting a 500,00.00 car? If the buyer finds out they are going to become more and more skeptical and most likely walk / run to the next seller.

I have a 69z28 and there is almost no way to know whether it's a real z28 or fake same goes for very expensive corvettes but there are service providers who do nothing but hunt down the history which is one of many reasons I stress one owner cars bring more money.

Luggage, no luggage, non original luggage, original luggage but from a different car ( non-matching numbers) , we're starting to sound like stamp collectors.

A while back, in the 80's, some buyers wanted original tires (xwx) on their 60's Italian cars. Fortunately, the more saner people saw the folly of that.

How far are we going to split hairs? A totaled car for sure, but where will it all end? With the original wiper fluid? Deduct 5k for non original replacement wiper fluid. Silly. The Duesenberg club has a sensible handle on this.

I didn't consider luggage when I bought my car. Nice to have, but it would not have been a deal breaker if it wasn't there. I use brown grocery bags anyway. Does anyone use their luggage? Probably not. Don't want to scratch it! Stamp collectors.

Haha, ok, I might be labeled a weird one right now, but I actually love car specific / fitted luggage. If it isn't too terrible cost prohibitive (i.e., it's not some absurd $100k luggage set), I buy a second spare set. Save that (it's the collector in me), and use one set.

Smokey may be right but then again he owns a Ghibli :) - used to laugh at guys saying stuff like I posted but all the little trinkets etc are part of the heritage.

Good to see a fellow collector - we are nuts btw!

Smokey this pic is for you spent last weekend wit this wonderful machine.

:thumbup:

It's a shockingly expensive addiction.

Should we start a thread - I try not to think about it :)

I need counseling and mental therapy. Can anyone recommend a psychiatrist?

Considering I'm still an addict, no. :) Whomever I'm working with is failing miserably.

Yes - ebay.com click the buy it now button shipping included.

:thumbsup:

haha ... you know it's bad when you have Fed ex and UPS blocking USPS.

You guys lightened up my otherwise hectic day. Yeaaaah I love the Ghibli, but I am sad it didn't come with luggage.(wink wink) By the way, the Ghibli sold for, I believe, 23k when new and the Daytona sold for around 21k when new. Makes me wonder where the CGT will be in 40 years.

Gotta go check on my stamps and Star Wars figurines. https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

My friend in the picture attends every auction and has over 230 cars Hyman Motors recently picked it up in Florida - I can see if he will part with the luggage :)

Ghibli vs the 16M on the highway was impressive even on the twisties to the wineries - yes St Louis has wineries if it were not for prohibition would have put Cali to shame.

Hey buddy. You're going to get me in trouble here. Out to dinner with boring couple. Enjoying this thread a lot. Gotta go before getting smacked for checking my fone so much.

cgt in germany
 

in germany there used to be around 20-30 cars on the market.
since a few month, less and less are for sale. at mobile.de there is a new record low, 2 for sale only. there was a cheap red one for sale 330.000 euro 2 weeks ago, sold within 3 days. the asking prices are now often 4xx something.
its a good investment i suppose.

As an aside you can get a FULL BIG suitcase of luggage in a CGT (with a passenger) in a very neat and organised way if you keep the roof on (I greatly prefer it off -- but once you are one of your locations, you can take it down). It is astonishing -- you take 4 ultra thin nylon "duffle bags" (with shoulder straps) and use TUMI wrap packs so that you unpack and lay them under the front hood. You then lay these ultra thin bags and lay them down on top. The front hood "pops up" a bit (you have to really press some to close it). along with 2 sets of the the internal luggage of the cabin (a garment bag behind each seat, the passenger side compartment on the passenger side and behind the bottom seat of the driver etc.). You have a decent assortment of everything you need (including many pairs of shoes for the lady) to go touring for several weeks (which we did recently in Italy).

In the UK prices are now comfortably above the 650k USD...a 9k miles, original UK car with perfect service history and in a very rare and special Midnight Blue/Ascot color combo is currently for sale at 920k USD (!!!) and I have evidence of other European cars with same kind of mileage being sold in the UK at around 750-800k USD

Could you please post the link to the blue one. Have a friend looking for paint to sample CGTs and price is no object for him.

I have seen pictures of the midnight blue. It's absolutely gorgeous!!

http://www.jct600.co.uk/car-details/...55azt-21206465

No pictures on the ad, but this should be the car (there are 2 Midnight Blue cars as far as I know in the UK)

Attachment 1204054

Attachment 1204055

Do you guys in UK pay a sales tax (VAT) on top of the sale price or is that included in the sale price?

Blue helps the yellow calipers and cf pop - very nice!

At those prices the ones for sale in the US will be exported.

CGT0000 - wife is in Germany allowing lots of free time :)

VAT is always included unless specified, but it is very rare and mostly on imports

Be careful. Lots of free time & too much money is a dangerous combo ;)

thanks on the 918...cgt000

Its delayed but I am building a white one, carbon interior, weissach wheels but weissach package

In the meantime I am loving gt3..... I am into that car right now...

Anyone have an estimation on how many cgts actually still exist

Beautiful color combo on the 918..................

1270 CGTs were built. I am guess 20 to 25 have been already wrecked. :crying:

The GT is a remarkable car, requiring far more driver involvement than a 918. This point was made abundantly clear to me this past weekend, as I punched it, fishtailed, kept my foot down to catch it, and kept motoring down the parkway. This all after just exiting the 918. Ah, the pleasures of still be a juvenile delinquent into your 60's. Yes, the 918 handles better, is easier to drive, but, in terms of pure fun, with much more driver skill required, find yourself a GT. One final note, I had the dealer install a lift kit (lifts front and back, unlike the 918), so now, no need to predrive your route.

"1270 CGTs were built. I am guess 20 to 25 have been already wrecked."

much higher number.. I looked about 6 months back and found over 80 wrecked just mentioned here on the RL.. not taking into account the web site wrecked exotics :crying:
total damage > value of car. I talked with my mechanic and he felt there 15%-20% destroyed.

I don't think a CGT owner should cry about one getting totaled. With each one that gets totaled the price increases for the remaining cars.

I cry about a CGT getting totaled. I invest in businesses/stocks for the purpose you described.

Keep in mind, 1270 built, only 604 original US cars. Best guess, < 500 left. Still "common" compared to the roughly 300 918s destined for the US or the approximately 60 959s that have made their way here. Just checked eBay, three for sale.

While the 959 is amazing, it was a blueprint for the future. Many 4wd, 911 twin turbos made after that car. A 993 Turbo was a better car in everyway. It took 7 years. Just the way it is. Not knocking it at all.

The 918 is also a blueprint car of the future. Watch Porsche make many carbon tubbed small displacement 8 cyl, hybrid cars in the future. Prob with turbos as well. But you catch the drift.

The CGT, NOTHING EVER ANYWHERE from any manufacturer will compare. Its THE ultimate supercar along with the F1. Wouldn't matter if there were thousands. 500-600 in the US is rare, dont kid yourself.

Or the number of 997.1 GT2's, or 997.2 GT2 RS's around. :)

(Same goes for the 997.2 GT3 RS 4.0.)

Don't get me wrong, for pure fun, I'd take the GT over the 959. However, if you are a collector/investor that still craves a little fun now and again, go for a 959.

That is funny. I did exactly the same thing when I got in my cgt after I test drove the 918. Fishtailed hard, yep there's the limit. Better sure as $hit know what your doing behind the wheel. Finding the limit, if you dare is part of the allure of the car. It's so razor sharp it can make the foolish feel invincible. You get out what you put into the cgt, there's nothing else like it. It's a beast of a car that few can really tame, but when you do, it rewards like no other.
I was trying to understand why I'm not interested in the latest and greatest super cars today. For me the 997.2 GT3RS and CGT are ALL the performance I will ever want or need from a road car. Of course cars today are faster because they have even more power than the two I mentioned. But in today's world more power means more driver aids. I call it pseudo driving.

Something that showed up today.

Awesome! I need one for the garage. Where did you get it?

Better than expected which is always a nice surprise.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-3D-S.../111489993141?

Agreed, I don't think there is any other car out there like the CGT. Even if it hits $1 mil, I couldn't see myself letting it go. It is such an iconic car. I agree with all the pseudo driving of the cars today. It's a shame out kids won't know how it feels to really "drive" a car.

Pass it down to your kids like a fine watch or an antique.

Not sure if any of you lunatics are looking for a low mileage CGT. I got a call today about an 05 silver/terracotta with 540 miles. Send PM and I will forward the contact info.

Thanks! Looks great.

Nice! That's awesome. Just grabbed one. :D

Thanks!

Glad to help spruce up the man caves.

I believe the car is in Chicago...asking price is 575k. I am being told its perfect...one owner, all paperwork, books, keys, luggage, and recently serviced.

I am happy to send the phone number and name of the gentleman who called me...send pm if you want it.

If it was black/black I would be buying it.

I have the black/black and never would have considered the silver. Now, after meeting Plastique last year and looking at our cars side by side, I've really grown to love the silver over black. So, my search continues.
Meanwhile, after picking up a FGT a few weeks back - for those who have not driven one... fun fun fun FUN!!

After having black, GT silver and now seal grey, I think my favourite colour is silver also.

Hands down it looks best in Silver not even a debate. Everyone is running around trying to put premiums on non silver cars....... Stupid. Its PERFECT in Silver. My preference on a CGT with the Ascot Interior. Its so classic for Porsche and looks soooo damn good.

Have to say, when it comes to pure aesthetics, not value, I prefer silver with black interior. I was fortunate to find one earlier this year, before prices ran up like crazy.

You owners of silver CGTs are all haters :p

Not a bad color in the bunch. A PTS blue I once saw blew me away

Love brown leather interiors in general but for CGT I think the black works better with all the carbon fiber trims

That's possible :)

But the yellow calipers and CF pop best with the red.

I think the silver is only appreciated when you own it and see all the movement in the cf.

The design of this car is timeless. It looks great in ANY color IMO, even the metallic orange that was on ebay (even though some people here hated it).

Agree.

Here is the one I would and have tried to break the piggy bank for as I am a fan of the era and Steve Mcqueen - been tempted to wrap mine.

http://www.autopia.org/forum/topic/9...ple-gulf-blue/

Thanks for the link. GORGEOUS :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

Wonder why Porsche never offered this car in any hue of blue!

LOL - it's interesting even today most of the guys ordering a 918 don't go far off the standard colors. The P1 owners on the other hand have gone PTS crazy.

Side note - anyone looking for a deal on luggage.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-Carr...item3f3ff08ac3

Red is my second choice, followed by yellow.

The Gulf Blue is just incredible.

You're an ebay junkie. I own stocks of ebay so THANKS :roflmao:

Deal junkie - triple screens to provide entertainment while at work best item were 9 basketball courts in Detroit!

After buying Ferrari (china) items the Porsche design is incredible - Knives Pens Shoes Humidor ... :)

:thumbup:

Luggage? Some one say luggage?https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif

Seeing a floor of $500k and some very low mileage just south of $700k
The CGT on its way to pass the 918 in value is the question...

05 silver black complete with luggage and service docs with 2k miles traded at 475k 2 weeks ago in metro ny area. clean no story car.

has anyone on this board actually paid over 500k for a cgt?

Which dealer had it for sale?

pretty sure it wasn't listed at a dealer

Someone got a good deal. :biggulp:

another similar specs with 900 miles sold for 500k as well

Money received today, car is sold and waiting for truck to ship it to it's new lucky owner.
I was never as unhappy as now while selling a car.........

Sorry for your loss. What are you replacing it with?

He is lucky!

It shows everyone how many guys are looking for nice examples of the CGT and when one is priced right ... it's off the market.

If it makes you feel better it appears you were an excellent keeper of the CGT.

Thanks, had my fun with that car but as anyone who has one knows, it's never enough, it is and should be a keeper.
Only my reluctance to keep it at 3rd party storage forced me to part with it.
I know I will deeply regret this sale, already am....
$400k.....

It's going to be a long winter for those of us in the Midwest - should have stolen yours first!

Purchased! Thanks for the heads up on the luggage. My interior is black, but I like the terra coat color better anyway.

Mario

Just got it today! Love it. :D

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...2c55599d08.jpg

Ugh you bastard! I had sent the seller a question as they wouldn't ship to the UK!

Grr!

tmario - nice purchase but what the heck are you going to do with those seat cushions.

Guessing there are members that would die for those including me but it's not worth dying / ruining them.

GL - that bear never looked so good!

LA Brit - if you want to take a chance on the electrical conversion buy it send it to me and I will ship it over.

:burnout: I had never heard of the cushions! I like the seats the way they are, so all good. Who knows, maybe I'll do an interior conversion! I wonder how much that would cost? Shudder...

Sorry, I know how you feel. I was figuring it might be some other rennlister.

I may have some seat cushions ;)

No worries, enjoy the luggage!

:thumbup:

Anyone interested in a red one?

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/oth...arrera-gt.html

Yes but would like a few less miles

$485 for 26k miles? What is this world coming to :)

If he wants 485k with 26k miles makes me curious what my dads 4,700 mile guards red one is worth!

And Absent just sold a silver with 20k miles at 20% less on the same site.

Once the 918's are all delivered - pricing will get interesting.

Admit the 918 is tempting as it seems the US numbers are going to be pretty low especially the PTS examples it's still the beginning of an era vs the last / best of it's era.

My car has 7900 miles....
Paid for, papers signed, still in my garage and really makes me feel stupid knowing it's no longer mine.....

The "still in my garage" part makes that post really sad. :(

I know that feeling.

Go drive it :)

If it makes you feel better my 360C is on e-bay and I can't get .50 cents on the dollar for it and to make matters worse can't drive it!

Arancio Borealis is at 626k - has not hit reserve.

Marshall Goldman, 05, Yellow, 800 miles, $700K

FWIW, they raised the price recently from $680K. They also have a 200 mile yellow one that owner is keeping in his private collection.

It was sold on Monday I think. Wonder how much they got for it.

PM me if anyone here is interested in a basalt black/black 5000 mile CGT. $448.000

I have never laid eyes in that color - thoughts?

Metallic black. It won't show swirl marks like a non metallic black. The car has black wheels, cf shifter and a Gemballa steering wheel.

I had a 2010 Cayenne GTS that color.

Beautiful!! Metallic like stated and not the solid flat black.

This is the color of my cgt. It is really nice has a metallic flake which gives it depth and it wears quite well.

I hate you, you just helped me spent $600, these just arrived today :cheers:

Last pic before loaded on a truck....

You can always get another one. Not the end of the world. :thumbup:

It's worth a shot.

When you have a moment send the info - with those mods my guess is it's not one owner.

Whoopsy - lol it's not easy being cheesy :)

Absent - nice shots hope the new owner becomes active here. Love the way you covered the gutters!

Basalt Black car currently is out of country. Not worth following.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...dc2e28ef6d.jpg

Pulled the trigger on this silver beauty yesterday. 1565 miles. 2 owner car. This one is for the collection (kids).

Congrats!! Beautiful example!!!

Thank you.

Jealousy rears its ugly head again.....
Congrats anyway!

CGT000

Congratulations - nice addition!

Congrats!!! Awesome to have two CGTs under one roof.

Thank you guys. It does feel great having two of them. I almost ordered an F12 but couldn't pass on this beauty. I know I could always get my money back and then some if I ever want to sell either one of my CGTs. F12 would have taken a 100k hit the minute I would have driven it off dealer's lot. Ouch.

Let's hope they got ask or close.

Can have a cloudy appearance, straight black is nicer IMO.

Congrats buddy, silver is the best color for the CGT by far.
What are the details?

Silver/black. 1565 miles. 2 owners. Needs new tires. Clutch reading 30mm and most importantly comes with luggage :)

Good to see the over rev's didn't halt the sale. :thumbup:

Believe two things will change in the future.

2004's will be worth the same as 2005's and Silver will be preferred.

I feel better saying that now that you own a Special Silver.

Over revs very minor (was told by 3 separate cgt techs that almost all have minor over revs).

No reason why a 2005 should be worth more than a 2004. Don't make sense.

I believe the lines and design of this car is sooo beautiful and timeless that it starts appealing more and more as time goes by. A real classic. With that said, it truly looks great in ANY color. :bowdown:

05s will trade at a premium as they should. Last years of production always do.

Silver is the best color for the CGT and will be top demand.

Sound great. Have full luggage here in wrapping. :)
Where did this car trade?

Luggage, luggage & luggage :thumbup:

Private seller.

PS. Are you on LI?

These cars were made for two years and had no development done through the run. It is asinine to think an 05 is worth more than and 04. They are exactly the same car.

Also silver is by far the best color and people will come around to that. Who care if it is most common. It really is best.

Well, maybe not "exactly" the same: Porsche definitely mades some changes on the clutch for 2005 to perhaps improve the ease of use? I've driven both, and the 04 clutch has snappy and more responsive engagement than the 05 (05 feels smoother). For me, I prefer the feel of the 04 clutch.

I have been told many times that this MYTH started during journalist testing. Some had a very hard time engaging the clutch. Before customer cars were shipped they changed some of the electronics to the auto throttle. Done and done.

Maybe from car to car it feels a little different but from what I have been told the 04 electronics and clutch are exactly the same as 05. Not a damn thing different.

Is it possible that the software was slightly changed to effect the clutch engagement?

I own an '04, and, I have to say, the clutch was a challenge at first. Now, with almost 9,000 miles behind the wheel, it's second nature. Is it possible it gets easier to engage with age, either the car's or driver's? I have not driven an '05 for comparison, but, my '04 is a fairly high number in the year's run.

I used to own 2 1988 Porsche 911 Turbos. The clutch on one had a different feel than the other one and I used to drive them very often.

The '04s and '05s were built the same. There shouldn't be any price difference between them.

I think come spring the CGT is going to be in a whole different price range.

As there are more and more owners wanting one for show and one for go!

Perfect storm would be Barrett Jackson selling a pair consisting of an example of both or a 918 CGT 959 combination.

Does anyone know of any CGTs scheduled to cross the auction line, Last one was the yellow at RM Auction in March.

Manhattan and LI some weekends. You?

Office in Manhattan but live on LI.

We should link up at some point.

04 Silver/black 10451 mile CGT sold August 2014 Auctions America in Burbank for 385.

That means $423k after the auction house's fee. Do you know of its condition?

http://www.auctionsamerica.com/event...&category=Cars

1 owner California car, looks mint.

If it was mint - the last place one of the hottest cars would be is an auction.

Could be a needle in the haystack - but it's extremely doubtful at 125k+ below three listed on e-bay.

I would have thought the best place to get top dollar for a sought after item was a collector car auction where it will bid up to what the market will support.

There was a sub 5000 mile a couple of weeks ago on ebay that bid to 455K USD. It had new tyres, clutch and all service records.

Is it possible that the true selling / market price is around the 400K USD mark just like the silver one on this thread a week or so ago that went for 400K. (was a 7000 mile car I think).

Obviously the ultra low milers are another matter..

FYI
The 7K silver car had accident history, per carfax

1 owner does not mean anything with this car. When I bought my red one from the dealer, it was a 1 owner car however the dealer would only sell it to me after doing an engine out service, new clutch, belts, tires and battery. This alone added $40k to the price. The car in auction might have needed everything as well so the new owner paid $385k plus $39k auction fee plus cost of necessary service/clutch/tire. At the least it was bought for $424k.
I don't think you could get a freshly serviced sub 5000 mile car for under $480k these days.

Are you sure. I'm talking about the silver 7900 mile car sold by absent on this thread. It apparently was OK and passed a PPI prior to sale.

That may be true.

I'm just going on actual KNOWN paid prices. 385k in august and the 400K a couple of weeks ago.

Asking vs paid prices is the mystery.. Anyone can ask what they like.

True - Absent gave it away - it would have fetched upper 4's all day long.

US CGT's are in abundance no idea why the low hanging fruit examples are not being exported.

But once units begin to leave the US prices will be consistent with the rest of the world. 600 - 700k

Most likely.

Can you guys send a few more to Europe to bring our prices down a bit!

CF Bespoke Super Car - when you look at the other cars available at similar prices the CGT makes no sense at current prices. I truly believe a lot of collectors are older or simply unable to comfortably drive the CGT.

Paddle shifters levels the playing field adding more gears for better mileage faster/safer.

Don't misunderstand me I love the F1 shifts but my 360C and 16M are modified versions of very common models.

"I build cars for young men that only old men can afford” - Enzo Ferrari.

Which is why the older Ferrari's have gone thru the roof - CGT will follow in time.

I am certain. I considered buying the car, and ran the carfax myself.
Regardless, I thought that 425 was a good price for the car - and it must have been a very good price as it sold almost immediately.

Thanks.

Does the Carfax report show how bad the damage is. Would a minor bump show up or only severe damage? We have a system in the UK that only shows insurance write off s.

Carfax shows any / all claims - if it hits the Carfax radar.

It's not the most reliable system which makes less owners more desirable.

Carfax showed "Minor or cosmetic damage".
The actual damage occurred in 2008 when a truck tire bounced against the rear 1/4 panel and passenger door, requiring paint on these 2 sections.
PPI was done, according to buyer :"flawless"

That's quite a good system for the buyer of a car if every insurance claim / damage is logged.

Not such a good deal for the sellers, especially of high end collector cars where even minor cosmetic damage is logged. In the UK such minor damage would not be logged, only total loss / flood damage is logged.

For this particular car I'm glad it didn't put off the buyer since it appears it really was quite minor damage.

He was concerned.
....until I provided the pictures of damage before repair.

I believe it hammered at a lower price. Close to 345 if my memory is correct. I'm pretty sure the 385 is the price with premium included. Supposedly a one owner, well maintained car. Here is a link to Auctions America


http://www.auctionsamerica.com/event...&category=Cars

I was perplexed about this sale also. I've been to auctions with a couple guys poo pooing a particular car and it ruins the "atmosphere".
Auctions are hard to call. Once I bought a car that someone wanted but didn't bid for some reason, but after I bought the car, he offered me twice what I paid. I eventually sold him the car months later at an even higher price. I've also bought things and wonder what the world was I thinking. Could be, that auction being in Burbank, still had the ghost of Walker in the room?
Was that car manufactured in 12/03?

Just did a little research. Here is a link their timeline posts about the car Hammered at 350. My memory was not spot on.

https://www.facebook.com/auctionsame...364662/?type=1

Can't see an "educated" seller not setting a higher reserve.

I tend to get a lil competitive at auctions but a Barrett purchase is on the bucket list. Why these auctions aren't online is beyond me as I have been buying major commercial buildings thru online auctions.

Most important - twice? Congratulations!

Thanks for the congrats, I did good with that car, a 51 Nash Ambassador, $600. Great car, the seats fold down into one big bed. Lots of room for the all important luggage and other things of course. (no, it didn't come with stirrups on the ceiling.:))https://rennlist.com/forums/images/editor/smilie.gif

Does anyone have any info on the black carrera GT for sale in Omaha for 335K?. It has 27000 miles on it.

27k miles? I'm impressed.

Car has been listed for like 4 years.

If the car is clean and has never had any body work, it's a steal. No one here would even hesitate to buy a ten year old 911 with such "low mileage".

05s are running about $25-50K premium over 04s.

For no reason at all, thats why anyone serious in a CGT should find an 04......

Last model year of production of cars trade at premium.

I can agree with some older car in the collecting world but lets look at just the supercar era of cars.

In the Countach range for instance, LP400's trade more than the 455hp Carb'd QV models which are actual supercars, not just a sculpture that sort of drives. Then look at the Miura range, early cars trade lower than SV's the last models. The argument is similar, the early cars are prettier and purer to the original intent, but the later cars drive best. Both cars had years of development and changes. There are many other examples in the world of collector cars showing both ways of thinking.

In the Carrera GT's case and others too, there was no development done during production. Nothing but condition, history will matter down the road for those cars.

I believe we will all be saying the same about a 959, except the Sport versions, 288GTO, F50, FordGT, 918, P1, Enzo, La ferrari ect, in the supercar era of collecting cars and any car that did not develop during production. That is how collectors think.

Pagani and Koenigsegg are different and follow the old Lambo model of upgrade the current horse your riding to the end. The cars end up being very different.

Then look the F40, which had just a small amount of development done throughout production. So in that cars range, there is discrepancy for what people care most for, with varying prices as a result. Adjustable vs non-adjustable suspension. Cats vs no cats, early cars with Plexi windows, and then USA spec cars.

If they are truly cheaper, then power to those who find nice CGT's at a discount. Its insane to think that it could be true IMHO.

When I was looking for my CGTs, the last thing I was thinking about was if they were 04s or 05s.
To me the most important factors were mileage, condition and color in order of importance.

Passed on two 04's as more than one collector and P dealer stated they prefer the 05's.

It makes sense there were improvements - less twitchy different dampener settings who knows possibly clutch ECU.

:thumbup:

definitely 05 more than 04', seen and heard from mechanics who took these cars apart and found numerous improvements over the 1st year model. Even minute things like screw changes and carbon piece relocation have been seen.

2005 year cars can apparently have their headlights adjusted to RHD by moving a lever as compared to 2004 which have to have their headlights changed over.

Never heard of anything and everyone that I have talked to says nonsense in all respects. From what I have heard, 05's are less twitchy because they came with the softer setting in the rear direct from the factory. I believe 04's came with the the harder setting and have to do is adjust an 04 to this setting and its the same. Correct me if I am wrong please but that is my understanding.

Again all indications say nothing in the ECU is different for the clutch. Saying things like possibly the ECU is different from year to year is misleading.

I think we need to get the right source from the factory who can describe the differences year to year for the CGT. Someone who was there. Otherwise all of this talk of differences is just pure speculation. That is fact at this point.....

I am all for doing the research and finding out whats different, and this forum should document changes from year to year since we are all heavily into the cars. Everything I heard on this forum to me is here-say until documented. This means with photos from cars from each year with changes.

Admittedly I have an 04 and if I got another I wouldn't hesitate on getting an 04 again if it was the right car.

From what I have heard, read, talked to mechanics who pulled them apart, and from all my research, there is not a damn thing different.

Please document these changes if you believe there are so it is fully transparent and not just some 05 owners saying 05's are better........

Are you saying there will be no price difference between the short run of 1992 cars and the 1987-88 cars?

Well, when new in 1992 owners paid a lot more for them so maybe that has something to do with it. Owners/Brokers latch onto the fact there were 8 built ohhh ahhhhh. My view is big deal.

I personally wouldn't value them differently, but of course the "market" may because of perceived low build numbers for that year. Thats a pretty specific case as well...

But, on the contrary, maybe some people think the opposite. They may want a car from the original run because thats when all the magic on the production floor was happening. I certainly would for this reason alone. Who wants some built from parts car made three years after the originals were built? I will never understand.

It would be like Porsche coming back in three years to make some 918's from left over parts and charging $1.5 million. Not sure how people would feel about that. Theres an ass for every seat as they say, so who knows.

:thumbup:

92/93 959's are SLIGHTLY different than the rest of the production run. The biggest change is they have speed sensitive dampers. The 92/93 cars trade for ALOT more than Komfort or S spec 959's. I do agree that in the future 04 and 05 CGT's will be valued pretty similarly, but I can definitely see why a collector would put a premium on a 92/93 959.

On the subject of the eight newer vintage 959's, has anyone ever seen one come up for sale? I have an'87, which took me over a year to locate. That was almost two years ago, and, I have never seen a '92 - 93 come up before or since.

I bought my 88 a year ago and have not seen one either. As far as I know this is the last series 2 959 to sell
http://www.kidston.com/kidston-cars/109/1993-Porsche-959

CGT04115, I had actually never thought this 04 versus 05 debate would get such legs. Mine is 1124 (so '05) and the default setting was in the middle; don't know about '04s and yes, you can easily change this (see elsewhere on the forum). Lots of rumours about the clutch between the two years (which I think you need to reset anyhow when you buy the car from someone else?). But anyhow, give me until next week and I can have the definitive answer for you from a well respected pair of official Porsche CGT mechanics (there is one for the mechanical systems and one for the electrical systems) to find out if there are truly any factual differences between the two. And, if so, can you easily modify one for the other? My strong suspicion is that the difference here is non-consequential, but will know for sure then.

A certified CGT mechanic said the 05's the later the better and suggested paying up.

I agree the settings on the 04 vs 05 but believe there is more to it.

Keep in mind many slated 06 cars were shoved into 05 due to the new air bag laws the 06 CGT was not compliant - so it's three years not two.

As factories find flaws and or cars are repaired adjustments are made - not ignored. But I will ask but my guess is with all the lawsuits over the CGT those in the know have been told to hush.

I have read by 04 owners there is no difference - but when a mechanic speaks it's a whole different ballgame.

It seems Canepa either sold their silver GT or pulled it off the market. Does anyone know if it was sold in fact?

And yes it is a whole different ballgame when a mechanic speaks about them, and not us laymans. They tell me theres nothing different that would make an 04 less valuable than an 05. I personally talk to a mechanic that has pulled 6 cars apoart for engine out jobs, and worked on over a dozen in total. This with cars from each year and he says nothing is different, just rumors. If that mechanic was at a dealer selling an 05, then maybe thats why you heard to get one....

This tech services both of Ralph Laurens silver GTs BTW. I believe they are both 04's but can double check.

Thanks Stephen. I think the car deserves to be documented as such. If there are differences then they should be spelled out by FACTORY techs who can unequivocally say xyz is different from year to year.

And yes, the clutch "remembers" how you drive and should be reset for new owners........

There is much we know, and a lot that we speculate. We should not do that and get real, hard answers.

I can absolutely see it both ways, Personally I would not value them more. Thats great they have one or two things different, but these are hand built supercars. When they get built there is a dedicated floor, with skilled workers only working on these cars. It is a place of collaboration and ultimately a historic place. I would always choose a car built in period on the original production run. I am a collector, this is how I think.

Whatever the differences - both are CGT's.

I think it's a matter of personal discretion to pay the premium no different then paying up for a color or low mileage example.

918's were held - they did this so all 918's were created equal and perhaps they learned from the 959 & CGT.

I just see false advertisements about 04vs05 and we owe it to current owners, future owners, and the cars themselves not to pass judgment when nothing is truly known. Hopefully we can get clarity.

Also, I know they reprogrammed the ECU clutch setting from the start. I was told since so many journalists were having trouble with it during their rounds, Porsche changed it before a single car was delivered and this is how the myth of later cars having different ECU's started.

These are important things to discuss when talking about half million dollar toys. A 5-10% difference gets to be a large number.

Yes it is up to the buyer if he feels justified in paying the "premium" for a later car. I for one, at this point in time, with the knowledge I have, think this is terribly misguided. Maybe Im wrong but we should all find out.

Furthermore, it is odd they would stop production over an airbag regulation if they were changing other significant things on the cars during production without fuss. I just don't believe it guys........

I understand the willingness to know - but factories don't like sharing this kind of information and it's heavily frowned upon at the dealer level. There are dealers that read this forum and will not add information to threads like these same goes for the alternative GMG clutch thread - it always fades with no owners or shops sharing any information.

Regardless - are you saying the US airbag laws that were to be in place for 06 cars did not halt production?

Porsche closed the order forms due to not being able to and or willing to spend the additional monies to test and have the additional airbags fitted.

The only way and it's going to have meaning is someone from the factory or a mechanic posts differently - last thing I and others are going to believe is someone says my mechanic said.

We all know value is perception especially for a collector.

Well said..

I owned an 05 for about a year. I will be buying another CGT next year. My preference is another 05 but I wouldnt pass on the right 04. For those who currently own or have owned here is the bottom line.

The car is truly sublime and the sound it makes are spectacular.

Are you saying companies have a willingness to change their halo cars during a short production run and then frown upon speaking of the changes?

The airbag was a large change to the car=money, testing ect which halted production, I understand. In my mind why would Porsche change something substantial if they would have to test/design spend money ect to incorporate it, and then be hush hush about it. My guess is if there are differences they are minimal to nothing at best. Maybe a few workers learned how to screw a screw on better over the year? I dont know, I guess there could be more comfort in that but it seems wildly crazy to pay $25k to feel that way.

No one is asking you or anyone else to believe another guy through some guy you met on the internet.... Thats why I am searching for some true expert opinions. But, when an experienced tech who has first hand know-how with many different cars talks, Im inclined to at least listen. He's not selling any cars...... Just a friendly conversation together about a cool car.

Hopefully Stephen can get some clarity from someone in the motherland who was there.

But at the end of the day they are all CGT's and thats all that really matters. And to be perfectly clear, my car is not, and hopefully baring anything unexpected!!, WILL NOT be for sale for decades as its staying in the family. So I could care less about values. Just seeking knowledge for the future.

It's been a closed subject for 10 years - each lawsuit has been settled out of court and you think Stephens mechanic is going to risk losing his career?

I raced and had a qualified mechanic - the CGT for all intense purposes is a race car and those who don't prepare it correctly will feel that pain of poor prep street or race these cars have to be maintained at an extremely high standard it was built by a team that did not take maintenance cost as a consideration.

A 10 year old car needs to be gone thru over and over before you take on a straight at 170 mph only to shift into 3rd throwing the car from corner to corner and how many times have we read owners did this on 10 year old tires.

Owners often sold their CGT when the clutch went bad now you see owners spending 25 - 40k as they replace the clutch there are a host of other issues because owners were negligent during their ownership.

So if an 04 has been updated torn apart and put back together maybe there is no difference but stock to stock 05's are better cars.

Factories learn just like anyone else over time especially race teams and this is a race car that has faced death lawsuits from owners who were clearly negligent.

Later production cars Halo or otherwise always have less issues consumer 101.

It's only as of late whether it's the lawsuits the 918 and or prices increasing owners are incurring a large bill before selling or taking ownership in the past CGT's went unserviced by a true CGT tech from owner to owner.

As far as the 25k - I feel the same way about the color or low mileage premium only difference is that $ amount is closer to 4x greater as if the CGT wears out at 20k miles ... reality it's still being broken in. Ferrari learned a long time ago and enacted a policy if their cars are not driven 2500 miles per year and maintained by the book they can deny warranty which goes hand in hand with liability because owners did not drive or maintain their cars properly.

Hey. Are you trying to scare everyone off here? Death? Lawsuits? :icon107:

If it helps lowers the price - so I can grab one ... yes :)

On the other hand - it may preserve one's melon to have their CGT maintained.

It seems Canepa either sold their silver GT or pulled it off the market. Does anyone know if it was sold in fact?

Does anyone know how much was the silver with PTS red from Isringhausen sold for?

Thanks.

Agree with the article - practice makes perfect so many owners choose to never bond with their CGT.

Drove an Aventador - while the owner thought it was a driving machine it felt refined in comparison.

Debating on buying the Sandy CGT and taking it to 100K miles.

That would be awesome, but from what I remember the Sandy car had a Seized Engine.

You nailed it........ I drove a 599 and felt the same.
Apparently people have realized this in GB and demand has been rising for analog Porsches as per the article.

I used to think my Challenge Stradale was raw...then I bought my CGT. I still dearly love the CS, but it feels like a daily driver in comparison! haha!

Funny you say that, I was saying the exact same thing to someone the other day. Used to have an SLS which was a bit tame, so I traded it for the SLS Black Series and I thought it was a borderline race car. That was until I bought the GT and drove it for a couple hours,then went to drive the Black Series which felt like a Rolls Royce in comparison.

My son wants me to get an aventador instead of the cgt. The lambo dealer in LA is a friend and loaned me one for the day. Very capable car on every level and the lambo V12 does sound wicked.

That said, the CGT is one of a kind!!!

CGT owners really run in small circles - great minds think alike :)

You guys should try the 16M - it's still relatively inexpensive and like the CGT will not depreciate.

It's F1 hard shifts are a gas and Michael Schumacker contributed to the development and unveiled it.

I can't tell you how many times I've seen a CGT owner also have a 16M or Ford GT in their stable, sometimes even both!

Totally agree!
Love mine and the 16M is such a different animal than the CGT but so wicked in its own right. I'll hold on to both for a very long time.

I'll be driving the 16M to one of the last C&C Irvine Meets in Socal. Shame that it's ending this location.

Hi Plastique,
I met you at the toy drive last year in my black CGT (we caravanned after to lunch on PCH with a few others) . I will also try to make this last C&C as well (I'll be driving my black Ford GT). I'd love to talk to you about the 16M. Now that a Ferrari dealership is opening in Torrance, I'm becoming very interested in Ferrari (but don't know much about them).

Mike! Of course, how've you been?
I actually went to the C&C this morning - it was a zoo. So the last one on the 27th is going to be insane!
We should meet up and you can drive my 16M to get a feel for it - very different from the CGT and I imagine from your FGT as well.
The 16M feels very "light" and nimble vs the CGT. It's a nice stark contrast.

My .02 on the 16M.

At high rev's the shifts are insane.

Where the car shines and it's not spaghetti like other Spiders is in race mode.

You have to trust the set up it's phenomenal.

Mine is slightly lowered with a full Capristo - adds 40 - 50 hp making the car come alive both in sound and power.

It feels lighter due to the way Ferrari tunes their steering, over boosted and quick ratio, not because the car is lighter than the CGT. If anything the 16M is probably heavier than the CGT. Focus on how your bottom feels rather than how much effort your arms have to give. I have a Scuderia and it definitely do not change direction with as much commitment as the CGT despite the much shorter wheel base. I like both but the two are not in the same league.I imagine if the CGT were allowed to race it would be very competitive with proper aero in the GTE class against the 911 RSRs and 458s.

the CGT has way more than 600hp too, it breaks traction with half throttle in 3rd gear.

Could not agree with you more maomao AND I previously owned both the 16M's in this discussion. Don't get me wrong the 16M is a cool car because it's a limited Ferrari and its a drop top, but when it comes to how they handle, there's absolutely nothing in common. I have a total of over 20,000 miles of seat time between the cgt and the 16M's and I can tell you that when pushed hard the cgt responds like a race car. The chassis, suspension, power delivery, braking all set up and perfectly balanced to give driver maximum feedback to his underside or bottom as you stated. The cgt communicates exactly what it's doing. In comparison the Ferrari feels a bit like you're sledding. There's a bit of cowl shake or chassis flex, the steering is as you said overly boosted, and the steering is quite numb and pedestrian. Keep in mind that when comparing any car or specifically the handling of any car to a cgt, there's going to be sharp contrasts.
Things I loved about the 16M are how it sounded, only at high rpm with baffles open, the way it shifts at wide open throttle(pound town) and the fact that's its a completely open top car when the top is down, unlike the 458 and the cgt. Trade offs for sure but in my opinion if you want the purest driving experience the cgt is an entirely differnt league. Its like putting at Augusta, absolutely true, pure putting surface. No wiggle room. Cheers :)

Has anyone posted a CGT dyno?

Happy Holidays to all

Thanks e-man :)

I would also be interested in seeing CGT dyno results.
Perhaps some early posts from 2005 might show it...

959 at Copley 1.45M 16,000 km.

FLGT - dyno pulls 560 ish hp watched a few on you tube.

:thumbup:

http://www.copleymotorcars.com/?show...he-959-komfort

A beauty.

So real crank hp is anywhere from 620hp to 660hp. Feels more like it.

I think mid 6's add mods upper 6's possibly 7.

It's def more than my MP4-12C all one has to do is exit a corner at WOT and or run the ODO to 220 mph!


959 pricing is an indicator of where the CGT is headed - last one I saw 2M.

what are the mods for CGT?

Hi Guys

Do you see a lull in CGT prices over the pond?

The Silver Isrinhausen car that was PTS leather (red) has dropped in price from 600K USD to 560K USD.

Purely looking on the Net I see all the same cars for 500 plus still for sale a couple of months later.

Here in the UK the PTS midnight blue car is still for sale almost two months later at 575k GBP.

Purely seasonal or price correction?

Any views?

Sacrilege

I think the silver PTS red leather has been sold. Isringhausen's website shows another silver one with 5000 miles asking $560K. FWIW, I just got offered $580K for my silver one which is not even for sale. :D

Quite right you are.

I didn't look hard enough, thought it was the same one.

Prices still very strong then..

Had a proper look at the advert.

This is the Wisconsin car that was on ebay a month or so ago. It bid up to $455K with reserve not met. I wonder how much it was bought for or if it is on a Sale or Return basis.

Car looks clean.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-964-...US_Cars_Trucks

1994 Turbo asking $320K (makes the GT prices look like a bargain).

Agreed.

Some guys moved to the 918 - resulting a few more than normal CGT's given this type of market.

If 20 units are exported the new prices will begin with 6 then 7 and then hold on as the best of the lot will hit 1m.

I know the silver with PTS red interior at Isringhausen sold for 595 I believe. I think these cars are easily 1M in the next year or so. My white car has been sought after by a ton of people, and its not for sale yet I have had people calling me daily wanting to buy it. I wouldn't sell for less than 900k i think currently.

Insanity. Of course, it's just asking. We'll see where it ends up at.

I wouldn't pay $320k for a 964 Turbo (non-S) with 33k miles on it. Granted, it gets bonus points for being a rare Amazon Green color.

I could see a Guards Red, White, Fayence Yellow, or other rare/PTS color, hit $1m in the next 12 months. Not GT Silver or even Black, to be honest. Way too many GT Silver cars out there for that.

The rarity compared to the 959 is not even close.

This one seems really cheap right now.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-Carr...US_Cars_Trucks

Been on the market for a little while. They want $550k for it.

Green Lantern. FYI, after speaking to a fee dealers in England and Germany, I understand that the preferred color across the pond is in fact silver.

No kidding? Well, my silver ones won't ever leave the US if I can help it. It makes me sad when rare cars leave the US; so difficult to get them back in. :(

Green Lantern. For a cool million, you shouldn't care if your car is going to Somalia. :D:D

Yeah, but that million can't be driven the way I drive a CGT.

You're a good man.

:thumbup:

Thank you. :)

Don't do it. I've had three Aventadors, including my current roadster. I plan on keeping my CGT and selling the Aventador (again). I keep going back to doors that go up :)

Collectors love bragging rights - drivers love odometer rights.

My ODO is no longer collector grade and I intend on keeping it that way :)

So many common silver comments come from non owners - in the long run color won't matter inasmuch as history.

Well said!

P.S. I'm hoping that, in the long run, odometer readings won't matter either.
P.S.S. I'd love to add a CGT at some point in the not too distant future. I should have acted when the prices of "drivers" dropped briefly into the high 300s.

Thats because GT Silver is hands down the best color for the CGT. ;)

Look at Daytonas and Miuras. Its not color nor miles that matter. It would surely be condition that would dictate the values down the line. Of course that's just my opinion.

The other key issues are supply and demand of course. Supply is known. Demand is very hard to predict. I recently sold a very rare, 1 of 6 race car from a well known 1960s car manufacturer with a race team. The going rate: about half the price of a street car from the same make (around 1,000 produced). (So I probably won't buy classic race cars expecting a profit again...)

Another surprise, at least for me, is the current pricing on Ford GTs. They've made thousands of them, they are roughly the same age as the CGT, and they fetch at least 2x MSRP.

With the Ford GT, demand is clearly the driver. The question is, why? It is a cool car. But cooler than a CGT? Not to me... but apparently I'm in the minority.

I have never driven the Ford so I defer the answer to those who own it but maybe the reason for Ford's demand is because its easier to drive compared to the CGT or maybe it's because the Ford wouldn't fishtail like a CGT when you punch it in 3rd gear!!! causing one's heart to stop beating for a good 10 seconds.

I entered a Ford 6 years ago whacked my head and the door swung open a long way.

Left the dealer with a CL65 one went down 100 the other went up 100 and my wife said get the Ford and to this day she still says get the Ford. I am guaranteed the new one if it's produced... fingers crossed.

The 3rd gear of the CGT is wicked - love it :)

From what I've heard from owners the FGT is also a very difficult car to drive at the limit. It doesn't have traction control and is also prone to oversteer.

Not so. I have 50k miles of seat time in a FGT including numerous track days. Car handles very neutral. In street trim (alignment) it tends to push if anything at all. The CGT is much less forgiving at the limit. The key with both cars are gradual throttle inputs to keep things planted. Your R foot is your traction control and active handling.

I've had my FGT for 3 years and it is very different but highly complementary driving experience to the CGT. The car is extremely friendly in all driving modes and with the appropriate modern tires it handles with no surprises. It also has a universal appeal about it which I think contributes to the demand. Many more potential buyers for it than the CGT .. Combination of drop dead gorgeous design, versatility, performance and no frills / timelessness. Tellingly my wife says it's her favorite car and must never be sold .. She doesn't care either way for my other machines!

I had both my CGT and FGT on track same day same conditions at monticello and I was much more comfortable going faster with the FGT, and it was damp too!

CGT 100+ more hp and close to 500 lb.s less. CGT is better balanced better brakes along with shifter is inches vs feet away from the wheel last but not least an sway bar adjustment - softer settings less twitchy.

Any comparison in track times to determine "faster" - my guess if you were going 8/10 9/10 th's - things simply happen much faster in the CGT.

If you had an even faster / raw car then went to the CGT it would be like going from the CGT to the Ford it's all relative - just my thoughts.

FWIW, I've driven my FGT about 15,000 miles, on a few race tracks, in cities, in the country side, 200 mph on air strip etc... I personally find it really easy to drive well, and reasonably fast, and I'm a novice. Of course, I have a healthy bit of fear and paranoia, so I am quite careful and don't disobey basic laws of physics.

With some basic tuning and mods (mine has a Whipple supercharger in place of the stock supercharger), it puts out approx 740 rWHP. That's about 200 hp more than the CGT. With its massive low end torque, it is an animal. The FGT's balance, suspension and brakes are top notch. I think at high speed, it is much tighter than a 458 or R8. Also, for folks in need of a bit more space (I'm 6'5"), the FGT is quite a bit more roomier than a CGT.

I like the fact that many folks modify and tweak their FGTs, making for a fun community of gear heads. In contrast, most folks don't seem to touch their CGTs too much.

The CGT and FGT really compliment each other beautifully.

I think one reason the FGT is appreciating in price so much is it was quite underpriced IMHO when new for what it is. I think the design is one of the most timeless I've seen of any cars. With MSRPs of $150-168k +/-, it is a heck of a lot of car. Easier than many to work on and parts aren't too obscene in price....yet. A good no stories FGT is probably $250-275k, depending. In contrast, a good CGT is ??? $550-600 (I don't know)

Not sure if this has been posted yet:

04 CGT for sale at Beverly Hills Porsche, $500k:

http://www.beverlyhillsporsche.com/u...cd1d45a7de.htm

I don't know why I still torture myself and follow these CGT threads.
I sold mine and almost immediately realized that was the stupidest decision I have made.

Good to see you guys enjoying your cars.

Superqaunt and you deserve a lot of credit.

Problem is in order to know the cars limits it must be pushed passed the limit and that's a tough concept in a street car.

Ford did one heck of a job and made a nice profit - I believe Porsche did far better but lost both financially and their buyers simply weren't qualified to drive a CGT.

The 918 is Porsches response - easy to drive and comfortable but has the potential to perform with perfection.

So many low mileage examples 10 years later - very far from the norm of Porsche.

Flip side drivers feel like a g-d :)

Who wouldn't feel like a g-d when your chariot screams this sort of tune. Heavenly....

This white CGT is the same one in Brasil (may not be there anymore) that went 216mph in a youtube video.

Its the downshifts, and the howl at the top end that gets me everytime.

Stop posting video and audio clips with CGT exhaust sounds. It makes me want to run out and spend money without doing my due diligence and at least making sure I get one that is in good condition. :)

Stock exhaust - none better.

Grab one - what other car can you buy / drive that won't depreciate let alone feel like a g-d :)

Agreed, I spent about 30+ mins driving it on back roads and such, just so much easier to drive and almost does everything too perfectly. The CGT is a superior driving experience and long term values will reflect so.

Which makes me wonder on the new Ford GT.

It's most likely going to have a 6 tt and doubt it will run like the xj220 although rumors have it above 800 hp.

Dealer has my order in but there is little confirmation.

Is now the time to grab an 05 - for whatever reason I do not connect with the new "super cars".

'06!

You won't connect to it if it has flappy paddles.

Unless it has Scud / GTO thud shifts - you may be correct. Double shifting with flappy paddles becomes an art form whereas the 360C you wait n wait but on the track it's a heck of a lot safer and faster.

The MP4 had different versions as did the 458 - eventually both got it to work proper years later the early on buyers paid the price.

Ford would need a lot of R&D to get it right - we shall see.

I have a Heritage Ford GT with 1k miles if you want an 06!

Thanks - a dealer in Napleton offered me a like one for 500k. Told him I could afford the car but not the paint.

I talked to Ford dealer today - hoping they announce a stick.

Impressive unicorns.

so has anything traded recently? price points?

Better buy one now when they are still in the 5's. With the U.S. Economy recovery and a small recovery in the Chinese economy predicted for 2015, by next summer all the above average cars will be in the 6's.

My thoughts exactly!

This one's been at Auto Gallery for a couple months: http://www.theautogallery.com/used/P...d3d3bc331a.htm

When it was listed at Pacific Porsche December of 2013 (prior to ending up at Auto Gallery in 2014), they had it listed for $380k. [redacted] took a close look at it, and noted that there was a decent amount of road wear/tear on the exterior carbon pieces, a lot of the clear bra wasn't applied well, and so some paint was a bit roughed up by road debris, and there were scuffs on the front + rear bumpers. He passed when they wouldn't budge past $355k on the price.

It sold shortly thereafter, and hit the market again in October again, I believe. BH Porsche has it listed at $500k, and Auto Gallery at $530k now.

Last week. Sold was an 800 mile silver/ascot to a broker in England $583k. Not sure if the car needed service or clutch though.

Afraid that is going to happen a lot especially over the winter - broker obviously had enough room to make it work. Depending on the new owners intentions my guess is it's going to be stored.

I agree with others the 5's won't be around for long.

Pricey.

By the time it gets registered with tax etc will be around 500K GBP.

Will be interesting to see if it comes onto the market and at what price. For some reason that I cannot see why, US cars are worth less than the equivalent euro or UK cars.

Euro cars are available for tax free import into the UK for less than 500K GBP but with higher mileage. However I've just remembered that there is a strange rule about importing a car into the UK from Europe with less than 6000Km you will get taxed since it will count as a new car. So maybe it made sense to get this low miler into the UK.

From the US since it would have been taxed from Europe anyway.

I don't think too many sub 1000 mile examples are left through out Europe therefor collectors have no choice but to import from US.

You are probably right. I have seen a couple of sub 500km cars in the past year, but they are few in number.

The Europeans, particularly the Germans do like to use their cars. It has been mentioned previously but there was an Italian car with over 100,000 km for sale about 3 months ago.

Shows the robustness of these cars.

hope ur right! got my 05 with 4000 miles for 325k a few years ago!

Hi guy's, I was wandering if you could answer wether the US spec carrera GT, have less BHP than the Euro spec cars, The porsche press release states 558 for us cars and 612 for Euro cars? Thanks
http://press.porsche.com/news/release.php?id=9

old design
 

the press release is outdated and was published before the carrera gt became a production car. luckily they changed the design quite a bit too. the link is about the car which was shown in paris. the us spec car has 612 hsp.

hi gang…

does anyone know this car?

http://bestride.com/detail/2005/Pors...55544190191815

happy new year !

Strikes me as very fishy. Pics appear to be of different cars. Two locations listed. Must sell quickly. Proceed with caution.

if at all… yes, agree…

seen a few CGTs listed in the high 3s and low 4s…

I remember in 09 they were going for 270… now mostly in the 5s…. they track the S&P well :)

thanks

I remember that ad from last year or so. The owner had too many toys as I recall. I will see if I still have the details. I was told it sold last year ('13) when I inquired about it. I looked at quite a few, and I definitely remember it, just don't know if I kept the details.

did low mile cars hit 270k? I def tried buying a cple down there and 325k was the lowest I was able to get....late 2009

my ex business partner bought a silver/red with 4k miles or so for that price in early '09… I was going for it but had too many cars at the time and passed it up (mistake)… will get one for sure… best road car I've ever driven, been racing for most my life and it's the closest thing to a race car I've ever driven without it being a race car… tried buying it off him a few times, but I think he prefers to be buried in it first…

Double post

From one of the pics it shows it to be the The former VRalexandar CGT,just no more black rims. If it is I read somewhere that car had a fishy title. Beware if it is in fact that car

There were some 04s that traded south of $300K.

ah ok makes sense. I was only looking at 05s. thnx

Can't figure out how Marshall Goldman gets all their CGTs. As per their salesman, they just sold a black 900 mile one for $775K and just took a deposit on a 1400 mile silver/ascot with an asking price of $675K.

wowzer...some serious numbers

Wow I wonder what middle miles, 5-10k, are selling for...

7300 mile silver asking $539k in Chicago.

Big premium for low mile cars as would be expected.

Purely from the Net the U.S. Cars over 500K seem to be hanging around for a while. i.e not selling.

There is one guy in Germany who is offering 2 CGTs from the U.S. Delivered with taxes paid,european conversion, documentation and air freight all in for 400K euros each.
This comes in at around 310K UK pounds or 465K USD. If you minus the 20% tax and possibly 10% import duty it works out quite a lot cheaper in The US and he must be making a profit as well.
These were 6 or 7000 mile cars. Black and silver.

Thanks, I was just about to ask about that car. Chicago Motorcars doesn't list the price on their website. Looks like a clean car recently serviced with new clutch and new tires.

Big numbers - but still surprised they aren't even bigger.

Wonder how many of the CGT's especially with more miles have stories.

CGT undervalued for so long, going to $1M.

These are both 05s, correct?

Yes

Yes, 1M in 5 years is my prediction. Just look at the values of the cars in the same League.

I think the silver car at Chicago Motorcars is sold. They took a deposit and sold it in one day i believe.

The car was available as of yesterday. Salesman wasn't sure when was the clutch replaced except that it was serviced at 7k miles.

Should be shorter.

Wait til the right one crosses an auction block.

I didn't see / hear of any at RM which could have popped the CGT damn close.

Went for a drive today 55 and sunny tops off - there isn't a car I would have preferred and after seeing the attention it received at breakfast ...

Hmmm ebay ad said new clutch...in any case I messaged them about price and received response of $535k.

Blk car isn't his. Hmmmm. I'll side bet now we see that car go away. Then rotate back on through for sale jus like all the air cool cars have in the last 8 months. Haven't you guys noticed the same cars pop up stay disappear. Then come back. You really think they are sold then traded back in??????? 675k for the 1400 mile car. Again. Couldn't get 550k few months ago. Yet. 125k more now. Instant Again I could be wrong but I don't believe the hype

Do you know that each CGT has a production number on the console?
Are you 100% sure by your statement your seeing the same production cars cycle?

Marshall Goldman added a couple of new Carrera GTs to their website recently. None of these were there when I was at their showroom last month.
http://inventory.mgmsl.com/web/inven.../All_vehicles/

I checked the carfax on the black one. It seems that the car changed hands in December from a seller in Illinois to a buyer in Ohio. Please correct me if I'm wrong but it seems that someone in Ohio actually purchased this car recently.

Some nice driving. Great tight course for this car. Looks fun.

Just talked to Parin, car is available, the clutch is 600 miles old. He just put the new spec tires on it and did annual service. Sounds mint.

The car used to be mine. It's in great condition and a lot of things such as coils, starter, battery ect were replaced not long ago. The car is in great condition and Parin is a great guy to deal with.

Thanks for the info. What made you sell it?

I've owned a couple of them over the years. With prices up now and the 918 out I wanted a change.

The dealer always has the hottest cars on the market.

Flip side - 10% above market across the board.

Good luck with the new ride.

Holy cow! Those are low miles....do people just stare at them as museum pieces?
Anyone know what they are asking for these 3 cars?

Yellow: $770k
Black: Supposedly sold for $795k
Silver: They took large deposit on it. The ask was $675k

Can't believe I am that guy - but passed on a 1400 Blk Blk 04 450k at Isring less than a year ago.

Anyway the under 1000m is now a 150k premium and non silver 100k and it's the dead of winter.